Spying on your kids -- is it OK?

[Reincarnate]

When is it OK to spy on your kids? Is it ever justifiable? Why or why not?

[psychoangel691]

This is actually kind of a tough question and what sucks more is I'm going to be faced with this decision. I don't know if I'd ever really call it "OK" but maybe necessary if there's a possibility they are getting into something dangerous such as drugs or illegal activity. Obviously no parent wants their kids getting into that type of stuff. I'm really hoping that I will have raised my daughter well enough that I wont ever have to fee like I need to spy on her but even if you raise them the best you can there's nothing saying they wont try these things anyway.

[awein999]

It is definitely a last resort but is necessary for some situations. The information you can pick up upon can be helpful and constructive for the future. And sometimes it is necessary for protection purposes.

(hypothetical) Ex. 1: I'm suspicious my 16 year old daughter might have her first sexual experience with her boyfriend soon. Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to care for her as a person but she wants to be with him anyway. Whenever I even begin to get on this topic with her she immediately gets angry and dismisses it. I don't give off vibes of aggressive parental defense to her because I want her to feel that she can be with her boyfriend in her house. However, I make sure she always tells me where she is going and I try to get her to invite her bf over rather than go to her bf's. I speak to the boy's parents about my concern for my daughter, they tell me he is a fine young man that is simply figuring out where he is in life and assure me he will use a condom. His parents are too optimistic in their child for me to feel assured. I spy on her to make sure she doesn't get hurt and to make sure a condom is used if they are about to get intimate. I won't spy during intimacy. It is too personal of a moment for me to justify spying.

Ex. 2: My 13 year old son keeps telling me he can't go to school because he is very sad. He doesn't ever want to eat and he spends most of his time in his room. I've tried as hard as I can to try to figure out what he is upset about. Approached him kindly and asked if anything is wrong but he simply won't open up. His teachers at school say he is a fine young man and that his grades are good. I spy on my kid as often as I can here to see if I can pick up some information on what is wrong because he seems to be going through immense suffering and he might be contemplating suicide.
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So use your greater judgement as to whether you believe it is needed. It's ok when you logically believe all other alternatives aren't as helpful.

[Hakulyte]

Spying on your parents -- is it OK? I mean outside of modifying your judgment due to additional information, it's not changing much and shouldn't be done unless you're starting to see signs that something may be actually wrong with them. Of course "wrong" is relative to what you consider wrong to the point that it's worth getting involved.

Spying on your friends -- is it OK?
Spying -- is it OK?
Spying people who are spying other people -- is it OK?

Just giving random questions example to get multiple perspectives.

[zolaric]

If I haven't taught them well enough by puberty, chances are they won't feel like learning anything new from me while they're in puberty. Just have to assume they're smart enough to live intelligently. I (as a child of my parents) have had no problem so far.

[Niala]

IMO depends on if you're curious or concerned. Age is also kind of a factor. Everybody is entitled to their privacy, and I think that includes your children, however if they've been acting unusual for an extended period of time there might be something wrong. It could also just being teenager PMS, but you never know I suppose. There is an issue with parents trying to know everything about their child, which, I can tell you from experience, is pretty annoying. It makes you feel more like a possession than an individual. Before I get any rap about this, my parents are great, they just have some frustrating parental qualities, and having some intrinsic need to know where I am and what I'm doing 24 hours a day is one of them. All that being said, spying can be necessary to help your children, particularly in the earlier years of life, to figure out who they are and what they want from, and to give back to, the world. So, yes you can spy on your children, only under circumstances of extreme precaution however. I think, for the most part, it's better to let your children make their own mistakes, because they learn from the mistakes, and you learn how to be a better parent if/when they come to you for advice. It benefits everybody. Of course, if your kid is thinking of becoming a drug mule or something it's probably time to chime in, which is where spying is kind of the only tool you'll have to find out these problems.

[ffraxis]

When you consider the fact that there is no such thing as privacy, only the illusion of privacy, along with the whole reasoning behind spying (in order to see whats up, then to take a course of action according to the situation, which may or may not be accurate since if you spy, you do not capture the entire event so a different perspective is formed.)
I would probably say spying is okay, because you do not have to intrude on the person and their course of actions (but this raises conscientious issues to some degree), and at least you know if the child is in (by personal definition) engaging in "risky" situations or putting themselves at risk/danger, or doing something you do not want.

[Without A Contraceptive]

the job of parents is to produce productive citizens. this requires parents of different societies and civilizations to use different methods; if they are raising productive citizens then the methods they choose are irrelevant, it is only the final product that matters.

end of story, there is nothing else to be said on the subject

[ScylaX]

it is only the final product that matters.
Eh wait, it's just an opinion. What were you thinking exactly ? There are people out there that thinks how you get to the final result is something even more insteresting than the goal in itself, what you're doing is taking the quality on the "final products" that interests you and ignoring the rest which is determined by how it was done.

[rushyrulz]

Raise your children correctly so they don't need to be spied on later.

[pmonibuv1]

Spying on your kids depends on what you think is important or a concerning matter. If you have reasons for spying and can prove there are more cons than pros for spying for that reason, then it would be ok. Just as long as it doesn't invade their privacy too much or crosses the line.

[Kilroy_x]

I would say it depends on what your other values are. Spying is obviously a precursor to enforcing these values. If they are good, then yay spying. If they are bad, then boo. So like, I would approve of a parent spying on a kid who seemed flustered to find out if they were being exploited or abused by anyone. But a more plausible example of spying would probably involve trying to figure out if your kid is gay so you can kick them out of the house. Very not good.

I consider questions of morality like a poker game, btw, where the "chips" are units of utility. Also I play loose aggressive fairly often.

[SCWolf]

Spying, no. Guiding to prevent mistakes, yes. My mother gave me a ton of freedom. Enough freedom to make mistakes and learn from them. I turned out alright.

[Without A Contraceptive]

I consider questions of morality like a poker game, btw, where the "chips" are units of utility. Also I play loose aggressive fairly often.

poker is life

you get stacked regularly tho

[Arch0wl]

I don't think the question should be if it's "wrong" to spy on your kids but rather if it's effective to spy on your kids. The mental gymnastics required to prove this sort of thing wrong are something I'd rather not get into, while the effectiveness of this technique is pretty straightforward.

No, I don't think it's effective to spy on your kids. If your kids are even halfway intelligent they'll consider it an insult, regard you as a villain if they have not already, lose whatever trust they had for you in the first place, and groan as your surveillance system becomes yet another method of control they must outsmart.

Of course, the kind of person who reads that with a frown on their face isn't going to think "man, I probably shouldn't be antagonistic to my kids." Instead they just think they need to villainize themselves even harder and will attempt to use even more draconian parenting techniques.

[JuggaloShows]

Remember when you were a kid? Go back to those days for a second, imagine how you would have felt if you found out your parents were spying on you.
What would you have done? You would view them as some of the worst people ever. I see the shows with the camera in a bear and those things disgust me..i mean, were you really such a terrible parent that now you cant have a little faith in your child, or in the job you did in raising them?
I had great parents, they let me make mistakes and learn things on my own..taught me responsibility and how to take care of myself. They didnt spy on me because they knew if i did something stupid i would learn my lesson from it.
dont spy on your kids..you will just make them hate you when they find out.

[Dorby]

Spying is not okay. We all learn from mistakes and experiences that we go through, whether they are good or bad. To be caught spying on your kids would make them feel violated and, quite frankly, no one wants to feel that way.

As for rushyrulz, that was an incredibly moronic statement on your part. Please leave CT and never come back. Thanks.

[Reincarnate]

Personally, I think it creates trust issues.

Growing up, my parents spied on me constantly even though I never did much wrong. Never smoked, did drugs, got into trouble — and I brought home perfect grades, constantly remained valedictorian of my high school, etc. And yet they were obsessed with installing secret keyloggers and screen-recording/viewing programs on my computer so they would constantly be able to see what I was doing online.

It wasn’t for the sake of protection — it was just because they wanted to snoop for the sake of snooping, and it always contributed to a sort of resentment on my part. There was no reason for having my privacy invaded. They’d also do stuff like open the bathroom door (with a key if it was locked) even if I was using it, etc. There was never a moment of privacy. You establish trust with people by cooperation even in the face of vulnerability. You establish trust by giving freedoms and having those freedoms reinforced and reciprocated. You don’t earn trust by taking it through force. I couldn’t trust my parents at all because they were so willing to lie and sneak around and spy on me all the time. They projected their own fears and insecurities onto me, and I think that’s wrong.

At some point it crosses the line from being justified surveillance for the sake of safety to privacy invasion for the sake of fulfilling some sick need for control.

Like anything else, there are pros and cons. If you’re going to spy on your kids, you need a justified reason in doing so that is sensible. The ideal scenario is to develop a relationship with your child where there is a very open form of communication and lack of judgment. If you have to spy to get answers, something is amiss. There is no harm in letting your kids keep secrets of their own. You can certainly spy and force your way in if you really want to, but then you have to ask yourself if those secrets are really worth the cost of damaging the trust and communication with your child.

Most of the time I do not think you need to resort to spying to solve a problem. Like spanking, it’s an inefficient, brute-force, stupid solution to a problem that is better solved with less-invasive methods. There’s always a better way that won’t come with the downsides.

[hashishin0420]

I'm going to write my response under the assumption that the "spying" refers to monitoring their texts, IMs, emails, phone calls, and things of that sort. IMO, spying on your kids isn't really going to solve or prevent anything. Chances are, if their conversations are of questionable nature, the damage is already done. If you would have guided them in the right direction to begin with, their conversations wouldn't have been such a disappointment.

[hashishin0420]

Personally, I think it creates trust issues.

Agreed. Even if they don't initially have anything to hide, they'll learn to be secretive, so that when you do have something to be concerned about, it'll be that much harder to catch on.

[Cavernio]

"They’d also do stuff like open the bathroom door (with a key if it was locked) even if I was using it, etc."

omg
I'm not sure you could call that 'spying' if it's so obviously overt.

I was going to be all like, 'if you stick to the definition of kids as being kids, then it's expected that your parents are going to spy on you. It's like watching over you, that's what they're supposed to do', but I guess if you have to call it spying instead of 'looking out for you', its clearly wrong.

I guess my mom overtly would walk into my room all the time, right up until I left home, and even then when I would come back for a term. But she always treated me younger and more immature than I was; she liked to call me ditzy when I was in highschool, even though none of my peers would ever have dreamed of calling me that. The only way for her to stop being on my back was to move out, and she still thought I was relying on her long after they had stopped giving me money. My dad never did that sort of thing though, but I'm not sure his laissez-faire parenting was necessarily any better, although perhaps if my mom wasn't so involved he would have acted differently.

Gah, stupid thread, reminding me about all those things about my parents I hate.

'No, I don't think it's effective to spy on your kids. If your kids are even halfway intelligent they'll consider it an insult, regard you as a villain if they have not already, lose whatever trust they had for you in the first place, and groan as your surveillance system becomes yet another method of control they must outsmart.'

I smiled when I read that. Sad as it is though, I have a friend who fully says she will do the exact same sort of shit her parents did to her to any of her kids (if she ever has any.) And her parents were the strictest, most overbearing people I've met. But she loves them, and clearly has a better relationship with them than I do with mine, so what do I know?

[Louis8k8]

If you never get caught then there's no harm done (but I don't think you can really closely spy on your children up until they move out without them realizing it).

There's a lot of harm done if you do openly spy on your kid. Like I haven't talked to my dad for 4 years or seen him. He always spies over everything I do and its so annoying I moved out (more like ran away lolol) when I was 16. He will literally interrogate about everything he finds suspicious and waste so much of my time that I would be failing my classes.

A current friend of mine is 20 and her parents still check up on her internet activities and chat logs. She also has horrible communication with her parents because she hates her parents as well and avoid them as much as possible.

On the polar other hand, there was a new report where a 14 year old girl was addicted to cocain and asks for $1000 a week from her parents and keeps packs of them in her room and her room is full of black grease and a mess. Her parents never knew a thing until the police came storming in and even after that the mother still say they police is lying and her daughter is not a drug addict. Makes me wonder wth the parents were doing.

Parents can invade into their kids privacy as much as they want but know their kids will hate them and probably for the rest of their life. This is NOT one of those things where you can just say "its because they care for me". They have no respect or trust and surveillance their kids like some sort of lab animal. This is one of those life skills that require moderation. Going either extreme way will do some sort of irreversible damage.


On a personal note I love my mom because she's always supporting me and giving me advice and my freedom. She was sad that I left at 16 but she agreed I can't live with my dad . She would come over to my apartment and teach me how to cook so I'd stop using the microwave.

[devonin]

If you never get caught then there's no harm done So if I steal from you and don't get caught, there's no harm done? Not getting caught doing harmful things doesn't make them unharmful.

Further, if you do something morally wrong and while doing so, catch your kid doing something morally wrong, you don't exactly retain the moral highground to try and punish them.

"I was looking through your property without your permission and found cigarettes! You're in so much trouble!"

[Reincarnate]

Further, if you do something morally wrong and while doing so, catch your kid doing something morally wrong, you don't exactly retain the moral highground to try and punish them.


You suspect your girlfriend is cheating on you. You snoop through her email. You find proof.

[Cavernio]

And if the kid bought those cigarettes with the allowance you gave them, is it still their property? There comes an age when going through your kid's things becomes wrong, and I'll be damned if I'm going to know what age that is for any of my hypothetical kids. It would just be much simpler if adulthood came at the same time as financial freedom.

"You suspect your girlfriend is cheating on you. You snoop through her email. You find proof."

I smack myself in the head for having a girlfriend instead of a boyfriend, and wish her well :-p

[Louis8k8]

So if I steal from you and don't get caught, there's no harm done?
If in your "steal" = "spying", then I guess there is harm done. Not for me however.

Further, if you do something morally wrong and while doing so, catch your kid doing something morally wrong, you don't exactly retain the moral highground to try and punish them.
You are basing that logic that it is already morally wrong. But that is kind of the topic

And if the kid bought those cigarettes with the allowance you gave them, is it still their property?
That topic is such a headache. Laws try to enforce a specific age but they overlap and leave age gaps where parents just can't do anything. The riot in Vancouver for example, because some of the people are under 18, the court tries to charge the parents of the teenagers involved. Yet because the teenagers are over 16, the parents have no right to control what their kids are doing. <-- I probably worded this wrong, I don't remember what the 16+ law for kids are =(.

From a very technical standpoint, whatever money you give to your kids is theirs and what they do with it is not your decision. You can criticize but that's as far as you can go. The only thing you can do is not give them money again.

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Unlike a girlfriend/boyfriend, you will (or supposed to) always love your kids. I think its a big deal for parents to have that love returned. If you spy, your kids will hate you and distrust you just as you distrust them. I don't see spying (as long as they are living in your house without paying and living solely on the reason that you are their parents and providing free hospitality out of parental care and moral obligations) as immoral. That doesn't equate that your kids shouldn't feel offended by it and forgive you. I see it as a risky -win some and lose some- decision you can choose to make or not.

For me personally, I most likely will not spy because I know what it feels like and I hated my dad. I don't want to make my kids hate me. I'd invest more attention and effort in being a friend with experience to my kids than a supervisor so they would open up to me naturally without having me getting worried and suspicious. That's probably very hard to achieve in reality though =\, but it's not like its impossible.

[AquaTeen]

Spying on your kids is justifiable when they continually break your trust. If a parent keeps giving them chances to be trusted and they keep breaking them, there is a problem and the child should be spied on so that close tabs could be kept on them especially if they break the trust and lie about it that way if they are spied on then they really can't deny it because you'll have the records about their whereabouts and such but if a child is able to be trusted, I see no reason to spy on them.

[ScylaX]

Well, it makes the whole spying thing acceptable if once you found the reason they kept breaking your trust, you stopped doing that and calculate a proper solution to correct it. It's just an extreme mean to understand things and it shouldn't be abused in any way and be highly justificated. Parenting is all about understanding your kid and making the correct moves to avoid "bad occurrences" everytime it's possible.

[devonin]

I'd suggest that spying on your kids "because they've broken trust with you" is itself breaking trust with them. If their actions aren't able to be private or personal, then you're forcing them to break your trust by doing those things in a way you can't spy on. Kids and teens need some degree of private space in order to develop into proper adults. Taking that away from them is bad parenting.

[ScylaX]

True.
Well, it's a matter of possibilities of the occurrence, just as I said above it has to be used if there is nothing left to do, and if there is nothing left to do, the circumstances must be either really special or hopeless (or both huh), which isn't likely to happen (hence it needs to be "highly" justificated")