The Fitness Thread

[Reincarnate]

Re: The Fitness Thread

There has to be a way to order some Vector... srsly

[Senip]

Re: The Fitness Thread

I am also reading that people like Orange Triads?

Right now I am using http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product...rodid=11098484

That Animal Pak thing looks interesting, though... pricey, however

EDIT: I believe the fish oil I bought is http://www.vitaplus4u.com/product_im...82443_zoom.jpg also from Costco

Animal Pak is amazing, hands down. I havent gotten legitimately sick (other than bronchitis from moving in with smokers and some allergies) since I started taking it, in the year I've been lifting. Make sure you get a fair amount of DHA, studies seem to point to that being something all men need.

Because I don't think I've showed you guys, this is my strongest genetic point. My legs.


What are your genetic strong points? Which body part do you think you'll accel in?

So far it's been arms and legs, really. My chest is huge but it's unknown whether its from residual fat boy gyno or not until I get the last bit shredded off, but my arms are 18 inches which is pretty good for a guy who's been lifting for only a year (and really, only dieting). My legs are massive, the last time I measured them they were around 25-26 inches, and I've got really good connection with the hamstrings and quads. Just gotta get that sweep! My traps are huge because of my job, which is really a burden just because when I flex, I flex my traps instead of my lats.

You should try not leaning over so much, that's why it looks like your traps are so huge, and it hides your chest etc.

I swear I'm the only one who doesn't find oatmeal filling.

When I ate oatmeal, I'd eat it uncooked, with a few craisins, in milk. Like cereal. Kept me from feeling completely gross.

[Reincarnate]

Re: The Fitness Thread

sweet mother



Senip: You take all 11 of these every day? :O What other supplements are you taking, if any, and why?

[Senip]

Re: The Fitness Thread

That's actually no longer valid. But still, yeah, pak has everything you need on a daily basis.

They even throw in a uni-liver (also a supp I'd recommend if you can handle gas), which I love.

[Reincarnate]

Re: The Fitness Thread

My concern though, with supplements like these, is that they overdo it and throw the proper chemical ratios off.

I also came across something called AOR Ortho-Core which is one of the more expensive brands but uses good forms of vitamins/minerals in a decent chemical ratio. Have you ever tried this one?

[Reincarnate]

Re: The Fitness Thread

http://www.aor.ca/assets/Research/pdf/fall_2005_article1.pdf

Haven't spot-checked/parsed this fully yet but it seems like a decent source to check out

[Tidus810]

Re: The Fitness Thread

http://www.aor.ca/assets/Research/pd...5_article1.pdf

Haven't spot-checked/parsed this fully yet but it seems like a decent source to check out

As a chemistry geek I found this really interesting. Didn't read the whole thing yet, but the vitamin E explanation is pretty much spot on.

[Bahamut-X]

Re: The Fitness Thread

What the ****?

My problem with stuff like that is you could probably receive all or most of the vitamins and minerals in those pills from a simple meal like a chicken breast, side of broccoli and some wild rice. These vitamin companies are getting rich by convincing people that they are missing out on so much stuff.

I always like take my cue from nature. Look at how humans have BEEN doing things so far. We've been here many thousands of years, and for a massive majority of that time we haven't used vitamins and mineral "magic supplement pills" to be healthy and fit. All you need is a proper diet. Eat your veggies and fruits and you should be fine.

Like I said I'm starting to feel that the only supplement really worth looking into is fish oil, since unless you are an Alaskan nomad who goes fishing every day and lives off of salmon it's pretty hard to get all your omegas. Plus the vitamin D.

[Reincarnate]

Re: The Fitness Thread

While I agree with you, it is important to keep potential naturalistic fallacies at bay, too. A sufficiently balanced/sized diet suggests that supplementation isn't needed, but I think it's no different from using protein shakes to supplement meals so you aren't eating, say, chicken all the time in order to get what you need. A supplement is just something to help fill in the gaps if they exist -- but they certainly aren't panaceas, either.

Seems like the vast majority of vitamin supplements out there, though, are total shit. Right now I am just trying to understand the chemistry behind it so I can figure out which vitamins/minerals are provided from the food and how much might be needed from a multivitamin. This seems even more important when going on a cut since less food is being ingested.

Resolving my own ignorance is super tiring. ;-; Researching... gahhhh. Lots of bad info out there.

[Senip]

Re: The Fitness Thread

My concern though, with supplements like these, is that they overdo it and throw the proper chemical ratios off.

I also came across something called AOR Ortho-Core which is one of the more expensive brands but uses good forms of vitamins/minerals in a decent chemical ratio. Have you ever tried this one?

Nope, but Universal has always been known for quality, which is pretty rare in the supp biz. They've been around since 1978, which is a long time for a supp company to hang around.

If you put too much thinking into it, you'll just stress yourself out and affect your outcome. They did the research, and millions of people swear by it (it's been the number 1 multi for decades by people who do any sort of fitness.)

[Bahamut-X]

Re: The Fitness Thread

I'm curious though, these people who "swear by it", what differences do they notice taking the multi? And are they able to undeniably contribute any differences to the multi alone?

While I agree with you, it is important to keep potential naturalistic fallacies at bay, too. A sufficiently balanced/sized diet suggests that supplementation isn't needed, but I think it's no different from using protein shakes to supplement meals so you aren't eating, say, chicken all the time in order to get what you need. A supplement is just something to help fill in the gaps if they exist -- but they certainly aren't panaceas, either.

I don't think it's quite accurate to compare it to a protein shake, only because many multis and supplements aren't absorbed very well by the body (or at all). Hence the argument "multis just make your piss expensive", since a great majority of it will slide right through your body and end up in your urine. With a protein shake I don't think this is as much of an issue since whey is a natural product of milk and not a synthetic man made conglomeration, so the body responds to it more naturally and treats it like any other source of protein.

Now this may not be the case with all multis. For all I know that animal pack or whatever it's called could work wonders. But from the little information I've gathered this is what makes sense to me right now.

[Reincarnate]

Re: The Fitness Thread

I feel like a lot of it is likely placebo effect TBH
</might be totally wrong but maybe not>

I don't think it's quite accurate to compare it to a protein shake, only because many multis and supplements aren't absorbed very well by the body (or at all). Hence the argument "multis just make your piss expensive", since a great majority of it will slide right through your body and end up in your urine. With a protein shake I don't think this is as much of an issue since whey is a natural product of milk and not a synthetic man made conglomeration, so the body responds to it more naturally and treats it like any other source of protein.

Now this may not be the case with all multis. For all I know that animal pack or whatever it's called could work wonders. But from the little information I've gathered this is what makes sense to me right now.

Well I mean clearly the two differ in many ways that make the analogy imperfect. I am just pointing out that supplements in general are, well, supplements. They're not meant to necessarily replace what is lost, but rather just help keep you from being deficient.

Personally I don't yet know all the nuances of how the body absorbs stuff and if there are any other complicating factors by taking different types of minerals/vitamins together or what happens if there's an imbalance, etc. It seems like a pretty complex problem.

[Senip]

Re: The Fitness Thread

I feel like a lot of it is likely placebo effect TBH
</might be totally wrong but maybe not>

Honestly, it's up to you man. But here's how I see it: I used to get sick constantly, colds, flu, random fevers. I didnt process things very well, I didn't ever have any energy.

I started taking animal pak by itself, and I have not gotten sick, I don't feel bloated/full all the time, and I feel so much better just in general (other than some general aches and pains), and almost across the board people agree with me.

So for me, unless I go completely broke, I'll keep using my animal pak.


One of the things I like (and dude above touched on) is that most multis are heavily pressed: this makes it SUPER DIFFICULT to process, and you tend to just crap em/piss em out.

Animal Pak has different pressing levels, so that everything breaks down at a specific rate, giving you nutrients when you need em. Yeah, you get "pak piss" as they call it, but thats because they put enough b12 in there to kill a small yak.

[Reincarnate]

Re: The Fitness Thread

Have you tried anything besides Animal Pak, out of curiosity?

EDIT: To be clear I'm not saying Animal Pak is placebo or anything -- I just feel like I need to understand supplements on a chemical level as opposed to "a million people use it and feel great." If it actually works then that's fantastic, but I still want to figure out *why* people feel great when using it and if they'd feel just as good using, say, OT or Ortho.

[Senip]

Re: The Fitness Thread

Have you tried anything besides Animal Pak, out of curiosity?

EDIT: To be clear I'm not saying Animal Pak is placebo or anything -- I just feel like I need to understand supplements on a chemical level as opposed to "a million people use it and feel great." If it actually works then that's fantastic, but I still want to figure out *why* people feel great when using it and if they'd feel just as good using, say, OT or Ortho.

I've used yours, and I've tried orange triad, etc. A lot of supp companies are copying Animal Pak, but not very many actually get it right. I touched on one of the reasons Pak is so good above though.
I also have used gland-all, which I liked, and I use sportpharma (owned by uni)'s multi-v.