Re: TWG CLXVI: Fall Of An Empire Game Thread Day 1
I guess it's about time I sit down and give some idea about what I've been doing to everyone.
First, I talked nearly to everyone 1 on 1 in the channel. You should have a seizable amount of info to evaluate me. I understand that I'm trying to force the game a certain way, but I do intend to keep doing that just for the giving everyone some sort of guide as to how I'm approaching this game so you can compare it with your own approach. I highly encourage everyone to talk to each others 1 on 1 as this has not been taken advantage of as much as it could be. (there's many players who I was the only person who talked with them)
Be careful while interacting because screenshots may get taken and players will talk in each others back no matter what because seriously, everyone needs information to get a clue about what to do with this game. That being said, creating a town circle should be done as soon as possible for sharing thoughts instead of playing an independant game because of the lack of cardflips. You can't just wait for a flip to decide to care about evidence shown in this setup. Note that NKs themselves should be evaluated because they're coming from wolves. You should consider that NKs are more important than lynches because the kills are performed by wolves. Therefore, each players they kill are becoming 100% confirmed towns because wolves can't kill each others and no one else can kill players. If you talked a lot with everyone, you will be able to get data out of this. So, even no cardflips has limitations in hindering reads.
Because of the above, everyone should try to talk to everyone as much as possible. Voice chat was also really fun and it's a great way to approach tone reads. You may want to consider organizing how to talk and taking notes about these interactions as voice chat doesn't leave logs/data unlike the channel/1on1/thread. This is a powerful tool considering how long these phases are.
Another thing as TyrantNeptune pointed out;
If you've been talking with me in 1 on 1 and in the voice chat you should know that the latter has not been discussed and that the "alliance" is as valuable as you want it to be.
It's more like a brainstorming center where everyone tries to express their stances about what is happening.
It's something I thought on the spot and that I'm going to develop here for the "lynch order".
Note that I only considered afterward the idea that NKs will give us town flips. So, I may have to reevaluate based on that and reconsider things. The idea of telling others who are the most likely to get lynched is to invite them to join us and take a stance about the game and discuss about what we both disagree with etc.
At the end of the day, everyone will vote whoever they want, but I still wanted to give a guideline to explain my stance and I'm curious about who will sheep join me on it.
So yeah, you want to be dependant of the alliance for information, but you still want to play independantly for getting reads and comparing them and the best way to do that is with communication.
This game has not as much interaction as I would like it to be for a 14 players game. I've seen more active games with less players.
This is bad if you want to get somewhere. It's okay if you don't trust others, but everyone needs to communicate as much as possible. If you avoid interactions/explanations, you're shooting yourself in the leg.
btw, if you looked up my screenshot, I intend to get choof, TyrantNeptune and Soundwave lynched up to this point in that order.
---
So, here we go Choof.
I don't believe you didn't knew that this game had no cardflips. You're usually the one who tells me to reread the setup. You expressed that you didn't intend to 1 on 1 anyone because of the logs. You're voting the only player who has no access to the channel and that is lost with what to do about the game. It's a decent vote, but flashflash account suffers from lack of information. In this game, lynches cannot be verified. So, I understand why you're voting him, but I don't understand why you didn't try to evaluate more everyone else. There are more interesting players to vote than him at this point and time. I guess you have a relatively low game investment, but it's hard to tell because you appear invisible on discord and you could have been talking all along to players for all I know. So yeah, that's starting to look like a wolf profile to me.
(Yes, I do also think flashflash account could be a master wolf based on what you quoted, but that's quite the easy read. I don't think a master wolf would bait D0 like that, but it's possible.)
Reference for above: #94
That is not something you should even want to post even as a joke after how you posted in WiFoM as wolf. Ref: #300 +#1580
I consider that a bad habit.
---
There's also a story about Nakah inviting TyrantNeptune to play while TyrantNeptune didn't knew LightKnight was Nakah and that's pretty weird.
It tends to make me assume that there's a lie for unnecessary reasons. It's possible it's a misunderstanding, but I want to force interactions around that to get more information. There's other players who knows about this and I encourage them to take a stance for that before EoD as well.
@flashflash account did you knew that LightKnight was Nakah when you got invited into this game?
---
Soundwave suspicion has to do with general thread interaction with me + neutral stance. It could be a playstyle thing, but it's really hard to evaluate in a good light. I want to note that he did participate in voice chat, but the neutrality has been relatively conserved. DBP also mentioned that he thought his vote on LightKnight was opportunistic. So, there's room for many possibilities here.
---
LightKnight is also up there in terms of suspicion, but he finally delivered explanations and appeared fairly genuine in the voice chat. I want to note that it can't be ignored that it took a really long time to get anything out of him and that he got close to replacing out over it which is NAGL. (I don't want to read into that, but it's hard to ignore)
Even if every actions have an explanations, the intentions remains unclear and I feel like the potential for being a wolf is still here somehow. You probably wanted to have some fun with baiting etc. but it simply shouldn't have taken that long. You took a while to prepare yourself to answer and I feel like it's more wolfy than not because I believe that town you should have been able to instantly know why you're doing things a certain way. I think you mentioned work and others reasons as to why you were busy etc. etc. So, if you can kind of explain that in more details, it could be appreciated. @ your general headspace around your own play.
...
"Lynch order" is a bad way to formulate things I guess. I think the above should be considered as a potential lynch pool for me atm.
I guess it's about time I sit down and give some idea about what I've been doing to everyone.
First, I talked nearly to everyone 1 on 1 in the channel. You should have a seizable amount of info to evaluate me. I understand that I'm trying to force the game a certain way, but I do intend to keep doing that just for the giving everyone some sort of guide as to how I'm approaching this game so you can compare it with your own approach. I highly encourage everyone to talk to each others 1 on 1 as this has not been taken advantage of as much as it could be. (there's many players who I was the only person who talked with them)
Be careful while interacting because screenshots may get taken and players will talk in each others back no matter what because seriously, everyone needs information to get a clue about what to do with this game. That being said, creating a town circle should be done as soon as possible for sharing thoughts instead of playing an independant game because of the lack of cardflips. You can't just wait for a flip to decide to care about evidence shown in this setup. Note that NKs themselves should be evaluated because they're coming from wolves. You should consider that NKs are more important than lynches because the kills are performed by wolves. Therefore, each players they kill are becoming 100% confirmed towns because wolves can't kill each others and no one else can kill players. If you talked a lot with everyone, you will be able to get data out of this. So, even no cardflips has limitations in hindering reads.
Because of the above, everyone should try to talk to everyone as much as possible. Voice chat was also really fun and it's a great way to approach tone reads. You may want to consider organizing how to talk and taking notes about these interactions as voice chat doesn't leave logs/data unlike the channel/1on1/thread. This is a powerful tool considering how long these phases are.
Another thing as TyrantNeptune pointed out;
If you've been talking with me in 1 on 1 and in the voice chat you should know that the latter has not been discussed and that the "alliance" is as valuable as you want it to be.
It's more like a brainstorming center where everyone tries to express their stances about what is happening.
It's something I thought on the spot and that I'm going to develop here for the "lynch order".
Note that I only considered afterward the idea that NKs will give us town flips. So, I may have to reevaluate based on that and reconsider things. The idea of telling others who are the most likely to get lynched is to invite them to join us and take a stance about the game and discuss about what we both disagree with etc.
At the end of the day, everyone will vote whoever they want, but I still wanted to give a guideline to explain my stance and I'm curious about who will sheep join me on it.
So yeah, you want to be dependant of the alliance for information, but you still want to play independantly for getting reads and comparing them and the best way to do that is with communication.
This game has not as much interaction as I would like it to be for a 14 players game. I've seen more active games with less players.
This is bad if you want to get somewhere. It's okay if you don't trust others, but everyone needs to communicate as much as possible. If you avoid interactions/explanations, you're shooting yourself in the leg.
btw, if you looked up my screenshot, I intend to get choof, TyrantNeptune and Soundwave lynched up to this point in that order.
---
So, here we go Choof.
I don't believe you didn't knew that this game had no cardflips. You're usually the one who tells me to reread the setup. You expressed that you didn't intend to 1 on 1 anyone because of the logs. You're voting the only player who has no access to the channel and that is lost with what to do about the game. It's a decent vote, but flashflash account suffers from lack of information. In this game, lynches cannot be verified. So, I understand why you're voting him, but I don't understand why you didn't try to evaluate more everyone else. There are more interesting players to vote than him at this point and time. I guess you have a relatively low game investment, but it's hard to tell because you appear invisible on discord and you could have been talking all along to players for all I know. So yeah, that's starting to look like a wolf profile to me.
(Yes, I do also think flashflash account could be a master wolf based on what you quoted, but that's quite the easy read. I don't think a master wolf would bait D0 like that, but it's possible.)
Reference for above: #94
That is not something you should even want to post even as a joke after how you posted in WiFoM as wolf. Ref: #300 +#1580
I consider that a bad habit.
---
There's also a story about Nakah inviting TyrantNeptune to play while TyrantNeptune didn't knew LightKnight was Nakah and that's pretty weird.
It tends to make me assume that there's a lie for unnecessary reasons. It's possible it's a misunderstanding, but I want to force interactions around that to get more information. There's other players who knows about this and I encourage them to take a stance for that before EoD as well.
@flashflash account did you knew that LightKnight was Nakah when you got invited into this game?
---
Soundwave suspicion has to do with general thread interaction with me + neutral stance. It could be a playstyle thing, but it's really hard to evaluate in a good light. I want to note that he did participate in voice chat, but the neutrality has been relatively conserved. DBP also mentioned that he thought his vote on LightKnight was opportunistic. So, there's room for many possibilities here.
---
LightKnight is also up there in terms of suspicion, but he finally delivered explanations and appeared fairly genuine in the voice chat. I want to note that it can't be ignored that it took a really long time to get anything out of him and that he got close to replacing out over it which is NAGL. (I don't want to read into that, but it's hard to ignore)
Even if every actions have an explanations, the intentions remains unclear and I feel like the potential for being a wolf is still here somehow. You probably wanted to have some fun with baiting etc. but it simply shouldn't have taken that long. You took a while to prepare yourself to answer and I feel like it's more wolfy than not because I believe that town you should have been able to instantly know why you're doing things a certain way. I think you mentioned work and others reasons as to why you were busy etc. etc. So, if you can kind of explain that in more details, it could be appreciated. @ your general headspace around your own play.
...
"Lynch order" is a bad way to formulate things I guess. I think the above should be considered as a potential lynch pool for me atm.
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