Is it wrong to be gay?

[MrGiggles]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

This is the same sort of logic behind date rape -- "they didn't say no" when they were incapable of doing so. "Her body language was saying yes."

So, make restraining an animal so it can't effectively communicate discomfort or dislike illegal. Sure. But if the animal isn't stopped from resisting and doesn't resist, then I see no problem. Like I said, I want it to be strictly regulated.

[MrRubix]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

So, make restraining an animal so it can't effectively communicate discomfort or dislike illegal. Sure. But if the animal isn't stopped from resisting and doesn't resist, then I see no problem. Like I said, I want it to be strictly regulated.

Again though, not the point -- you can get hit with a rape charge even if the person you have sex with doesn't say yes/no and doesn't resist. Non-resistance is not enough to prove consent.

[MrGiggles]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

Again though, not the point -- you can get hit with a rape charge even if the person you have sex with doesn't say yes/no and doesn't resist. Non-resistance is not enough to prove consent.

Maybe it should be, in the case of animals.

[mhss1992]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

So, make restraining an animal so it can't effectively communicate discomfort or dislike illegal. Sure. But if the animal isn't stopped from resisting and doesn't resist, then I see no problem. Like I said, I want it to be strictly regulated.

I can't possibly imagine in what circumstances it would be allowed, assuming it would be "strictly regulated".

[MrGiggles]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

I can't possibly imagine in what circumstances it would be allowed, assuming it would be "strictly regulated".

Okay, let's say NFD bends down in front of his uncle's husky and the husky gives it to him. The husky is obviously enjoying itself, as is NFD. I see no reason this should result in NFD being put in da slammer.

[mhss1992]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

Okay, let's say NFD bends down in front of his uncle's husky and the husky gives it to him. The husky is obviously enjoying itself, as is NFD. I see no reason this should result in NFD being put in da slammer.

Well, since I have no idea what the husky will think about NFD after this, I'm not so sure... I don't know if this sort of thing can have an impact on the animal's behavior, making it more "dominative", perhaps...
It's complicated, and I think it's completely unnecessary. People and animals can live without this.

[MrRubix]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

Maybe it should be, in the case of animals.

The problem is that, if you legalized it, you'd basically open the doors for people to abuse and rape animals. How is an animal going to be able to inform the authorities that they were raped? You're going to essentially trust the human to do that for himself? Animals can't give or withhold consent, and consent is the line between sex and rape.

[mhss1992]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

huh? isnt that the same as saying 'well gays dont NEED to be gay'

No. You can tell how a human feels after this, but not how an animal feels.

[MrRubix]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

I need not also mention the numerous disease/health exposures.

[mhss1992]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

I need not also mention the numerous disease/health exposures.

Yeah. Well, that happens between humans too, but on a smaller scale.

[MrGiggles]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

The problem is that, if you legalized it, you'd basically open the doors for people to abuse and rape animals. How is an animal going to be able to inform the authorities that they were raped? You're going to essentially trust the human to do that for himself? Animals can't give or withhold consent, and consent is the line between sex and rape.

Well, to be honest there's not a lot stopping people from raping animals as it is. I think it would be possible, if difficult, to enact new laws that would permit genuine lovemaking between species while still not giving rapists an easy loophole in court.

Well, since I have no idea what the husky will think about NFD after this, I'm not so sure... I don't if this sort of thing can have an impact on the animal's behavior, making it more "dominative", perhaps...

Maybe. Worth looking into. It's entirely possible he shaved five years off of the husky's lifespan.

It's complicated, and I think it's completely unnecessary. People and animals can live without this.

Complicated, undoubtedly. But it must be frustrating to have your love be denounced by everyone and made illegal.

[mhss1992]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

Complicated, undoubtedly. But it must be frustrating to have your love be denounced by everyone and made illegal.

How do you know the animal loves you the same way?
If they create a machine that lets people read the minds of animals, it won't be such an issue, but, right now...

[MrRubix]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

Yeah. Well, that happens between humans too, but on a smaller scale.

Right, but why make the problem worse? This is my point.

Well, to be honest there's not a lot stopping people from raping animals as it is. I think it would be possible, if difficult, to enact new laws that would permit genuine lovemaking between species while still not giving rapists an easy loophole in court.Maybe. Worth looking into. It's entirely possible he shaved five years off of the husky's lifespan.
Complicated, undoubtedly. But it must be frustrating to have your love be denounced by everyone and made illegal.

There's nothing stopping people from raping animals now, but legalizing it is basically giving them a guilt-free legality card to keep abusing animals. Why not legalize human rape, while we're at it? The logic doesn't hold. There's absolutely no way such a law would ever be passed. There's really no argument that works -- an animal simply cannot give consent, and by that alone, it will forever be illegal. You also have no way of telling whether or not the animal loves you. There's no rule that says we can have sex with a human if we love them and they don't resist. That is what we would characterize as a rapist mentality.

[MrGiggles]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

How do you know the animal loves you the same way?
If they create a machine that lets people read the minds of animals, it won't be such an issue, but, right now...

You don't. Maybe the animal dies a little inside each time, or maybe it's all it looks forward to each day upon waking up. I don't know if assuming the worst is the best way of thinking about it.

There's nothing stopping people from raping animals now, but legalizing it is basically giving them a guilt-free legality card to keep abusing animals. Why not legalize human rape, while we're at it? The logic doesn't hold. There's absolutely no way such a law would ever be passed. There's really no argument that works -- an animal simply cannot give consent, and by that alone, it will forever be illegal. You also have no way of telling whether or not the animal loves you. There's no rule that says we can have sex with a human if we love them and they don't resist. That is what we would characterize as a rapist mentality.

whaaaaaaaat

I just said it has to be possible to create a system of laws that allows interspecies love while keeping interspecies rape illegal. I refuse to believe it isn't possible, though I will readily admit the odds are astronomically against it ever happening. I don't actually care that much, not being into that sort of stuff. I just think it's a shame that the few people out there who are in love with another species have to put up with it.

I don't think applying the same mindset we use for human relations to human-animal relations makes sense. The inability to communicate thoughts between species requires thinking differently.

Diseaseses, I don't really know anything about. I haven't really done a ton of research on this, seeing as how I don't care a ton about it, so I'm probably gonna go google this up or something.

EDIT: Yeah there's a wikipedia article on zoophilia and health.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoophilia_and_health

[Izzy]

Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

I think you need to understand the reality of how the congressional system. There is absolutely no way that interspecies sex is going to become legal. You and rubix are pretty much arguing two different things.