Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

[lurker]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

if you're near the top of game (and you fucking are) you don't need common goals as much
people like you are not my primary concern

[lurker]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

but anyway if the debate is seriously about adding an on/off switch then honestly fuck that shit

[DeadSignal]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

Why does the sm community always have an all or nothing attitude to everything

you are entirely free to feel this way

nor is anyone attempting to claim otherwise


however, the game meta's positive evolution over the years (even more noticeably so over the past couple of years) has been spearheaded by forward-thinking people that sought viable alternatives to the status quo instead of aimlessly bitching about it under a plethora of different pretexts, regardless of their actual validity

it's too easy to be other people's judge and jury, but ultimately if you have nothing constructive to contribute in a thread dedicated to such matters - you should not say anything in them for everyone's sake including your own


that is all

[Dynam0]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

just take it out, stupid mechanic

[EtienneSM]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

Fuck the mashers

Take it out

[leonid]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

Take it out. The problem with CC is that it is inconsistent with the rest of the system (and the rest of all the vsrgs) in terms of when to reward and when to punish. It allows players to split chords into disastrous degrees and still get marvs, and at the same time also drops fuck all if they hit three notes out of a quad perfectly and miss one note. Lower the judge option if you want sm to be more forgiving towards mashing. Spread a quad into four notes 1pixel away from one another and suddenly you are playing a different game. It makes zero sense. CC is an objectively wrong mechanic. Remember what GENRE we are talking about. It should reward accuracy and consistency. Nothing else matters

[DossarLX ODI]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

I'm surprised nobody mentioned the phenomenon of having the "color gimmick" and how it's basically a way to bypass chord cohesion. For example, place one 4th note, and then three more 4th notes after it and make the BPM something stupid like 1 million and put it back to normal after (this creates a quad with no chord cohesion). Not even mentioning accuracy or consistency, being able to create the same pattern two different ways but having to register it differently is more problematic in my eyes.

[lurker]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

you and leonid both thought of that and that's honestly a way better reason than anything i had thought of before

[Ristyy]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

just make it an option

[MinaciousGrace]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

the issue isnt whether or not cc should be removed its whether to scale or not scale down the additional points in each chord after removal to retain the same point distribution of files before/after


for the record:
cc is being removed and it will not be optional
dp is being removed and it will not be optional unless you theme it back in, in which case why stop there just go full retard and use sm6 scoring for +9 points for each mine you don't hit

I shouldn't even be spending time arguing why further fracturing the community by giving players a myriad of options for playing, which are at best stupid and at worst objectively wrong (as leonid has pointed out), is stupid and irresponsible

if you don't care about scores being comparable and think "wow more options is objectively better" then just fuck off and play j2l1 sm5default with nofail 6x nojumps added mines super shuffle noholds and haste mod

the important part of that is the "fuck off" part

this entire community and more importantly everything that it has generated, which you are an active recipient of, has only arisen because a group of players came together and agreed upon a consensus for set of defined rules for what constitutes valid score comparison

it is literally the foundational principle of the community-- to make any argument in any direction invoking "who cares just let people do whatever they want" is automatically invalid and you can feel free to go on reddit and co-ruminate with the other people there on how cmods are cheating and the like

if any of you ever want to see a functional leaderboard and scores/stats tracking site then you all have to adhere to a single standard of scoring anyway

[leonid]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

Don't scale anything; treat quad as if you hit four notes. As mentioned before, you can simulate a "quad" by putting four notes really close together. IMO the actual quad and the simulated quad should count the same way

[MinaciousGrace]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

and let me be clear the reason dp and cc aren't optional isn't because I'm vehemently opposed to the concepts in principle (which I am, but that isn't the reason)

the reason is because I'm not writing separate calculators and/or replay systems and/or scoring systems and then making those systems interact functionally with each other just so some of you can feel like special snowflakes

this isnt osumania where "chord cohesion" is going to be some fucking retarded score multiplier mod hahahahaha!!!! great system real sense logic!!!

i'm not making more work for myself when i'm already thanklessly doing everything in the first place just because some of you cry about change when, and this is important, none of you would fucking notice or care after a month of play anyway (unless you just blindmash handstream in which case idk either stop blindmashing handstream or quit not my problem)

so lets keep it on topic and idk at least try to formulate some sort of argument beyond "but that's what i want"

[MinaciousGrace]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

Don't scale anything; treat quad as if you hit four notes. As mentioned before, you can simulate a "quad" by putting four notes really close together. IMO the actual quad and the simulated quad should count the same way

for the record i initially came up with the idea of scaling for a number of reasons but after a lengthy amount of testing and thinking about how it affects numerous systems and further planned development i am leaning towards unscaled

also it took you like what 10 minutes to formulate literally the strongest argument for unscaling that i've seen thus far (and the only legitimate one other than my own reasons)

smh i mean i guess this is the community that took a half decade to figure out mirror isnt cheating

[Chocille]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

chord cohesion sucks

you don't get good with chord cohesion
see how all the top bms players play?
they dont need that, because bms made them good
bms doesn't use chord cohesion

now get good and stop complaining

[Ristyy]

Re: Public opinion poll on Etterna Chord cohesion removal

well dang i guess if it's not an option, i'd lean towards having each note count as a whole note; especially since as mentioned you can make 4 separate notes count as 4 whole notes already. I don't have anything to add other than what's already been said :\