What's with the hostility towards Christians?

[A2P]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

People are hostile towards Christians because people, deep down inside, hate diversity. They cannot handle an opposing opinion, and therefore go on a needless defense. That is how this world has been functioning for the past 500 or so years.

[gnr61]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

Here's the problem with you and many other non-Christians have with Christianity: you simply don't understand Christianity. This is no debate among Christians as to whether or not we were created by God or not. IT DID. WE KNOW IT DID. It's called a theory because that's what scientists call things that are known to be true but are not 100% testable. We know he had disciples, but it's still a theory. We know he died on a cross for us, but it's still a theory.

this is an unfathomably weak semantic argument, i can't even begin to imagine how people of these modern times--with such access as they have to scientific information and higher education--continue to project this kind of mindset as being either logically sound or permissible in intelligent debate.

what you are doing is committing the fallacy of equating (using scientific diction far outside its realm of meaningful application) the rational legitimacy of an opinion supported by consensus within the realm of its own group of followers to that of one substantiated by hard physical evidence that is entirely devoid of subjectivity or bias. when a scientist attempts to answer a question he employs the scientific method to best reach a conclusion not founded on his own predisposition toward one set of beliefs, but on a desire to obtain scientific truth. such is the case with a theory like evolution; you can go with your gut feeling that it just certainly must be wrong (i mean c'mon....surely we didn't come from monkeys!!), but don't try to pass that off as a legitimate counterargument in intelligent debate

[Squeek]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

But the point is not that we know it is wrong, it is that if we wish to take political correctness to extremes and say no one should tell us what is and isn't wrong (That is, if we have no moral backing) then we cannot say things such as murder is wrong because after all, who gets the right to say what is wrong and right?

So, listen to a book written 2000 years ago rather than establish a standard of society? Sorry, we did just fine on our own without using religion to establish our laws.

That is an awful reason. You continue bringing something up because you feel you must have the last word? But, this is another issue all together. Since you are also a mod and obviously approve having this still in play, response time.

No, I can't let a false claim be the last word. I was merely correcting you.

My point is this. We only "know" and say things are fact based on the limited knowledge we have. Christianity was presented and MILLIONS of people tested it and found it to be true. So can we also say we know that is the truth?

Wait, what? You're saying millions of people tested every historical aspect of the Bible and proved it to be true? You're confusing people who believe in God with people who believe in the science and history of the Bible. Scientists and Historians do not use the Bible as a source. There's no knowledge to be found in that book. It is a book that attempts to instill good moral values in people, so long as they ignore the horrible atrocities it also contains.

And yet every day they find archeological evidence supporting different events listed, it correlates with Roman history CONSTANTLY, and you accept that as "documented history". Your idea of proof is flawed. Here is what the dictionary defines proof as:

"evidence sufficient to establish a thing as true, or to produce belief in its truth."

So, enough evidence has obviously been provided to produce belief in its truth over and over and over again. So how can you go about saying we have no hope of proving any of it to be true when it has already been proved true to millions according to the definition of proof itself?

So millions of people in the old ages thought the Earth was flat. The Earth is flat, right? RIGHT?

Ok, so the Great Flood happened, despite zero archeological evidence of it. There was a big flood somewhere in the world at that time, but nobody named Noah is recorded in history. The man who commandeered a ship to transport some goods downriver during this flood did not bring two of every species of the millions of species of animals on the planet and then accurately redistribute them to every country on the planet.

There's no archeological evidence of people wandering the desert for 40 years. There's no historical evidence that the Pharaoh lost to Moses's reasoning and that there was a mass exodus of Jews from Egypt. These events DID NOT HAPPEN.

There is little to no scientific or historical accuracy in the Bible. Stop trying to prove it. It's not there. Just because you and several millions of people believe it, YOU AREN'T SCIENTISTS! What you believe is irrelevant in the face of facts!

I have the feeling you're going to reply to this with resentment and claim that I put too much "faith" in scientists, but that's because historians and scientists have a system that allows EVERYBODY to discredit them! Want to prove that water is not H20? You can! You won't, but you can try! Likewise, you CAN try to disprove Evolution. You won't be able to, but you can try! Thousands of other Christians have tried, and they've all failed.

Here's the problem with you and many other non-Christians have with Christianity: you simply don't understand Christianity. This is no debate among Christians as to whether or not we were created by God or not. IT DID. WE KNOW IT DID. It's called a theory because that's what scientists call things that are known to be true but are not 100% testable. We know he had disciples, but it's still a theory. We know he died on a cross for us, but it's still a theory.

Christianity is about providing people with what we have found to be true and allowing them to see if they find truth in it themselves. When we did this and thousands of Christians confirmed it to be true, it became more than just a hypothesis. It becomes a religious theory--one step short of fact but it is not a fully testable series of events. Compare this rigorous testing and multiple recorded sources of confirmation to "it just does", and you'll see why I'm a little peeved that you try to discredit Christianity.

This is why I have hostility towards scientists. Attempting to overthrow Christianity. They believe that just because they don't think it is true, it isn't even a possibility. We base our beliefs on what we know and find to be true, just as they do. And yet, somehow, their findings and beliefs are superior? That is ridiculous! And then, when our equally valid theories get taught in schools and similar settings, they throw a fit!

They believe that just because things don't occur in a simple and completely testable way, they can't happen. We base all of our science off of a counting system we developed and find patterns in. Just because one thing occurs one way, all things must occur in that same way. It is completely idiotic! But oh no, don't tell them they are wrong! They are doing Science!

Seriously? You're using this? Do you have any idea how stupid this argument is? I don't think I have to respond to this, do I? If you honestly believe that this is a valid argument, then there's absolutely no reason to talk to you anymore, because you're blinded by faith and refuse to understand anything that goes against your religious tenets.

[Dorby]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

The only reason I look down upon them is because they

1. Believe in someone that never existed
2. Some (not all are like this) base their life off of christianity, once again, something that is not real, it did not happen, etc.
3. Think less of others because they are not christian i.e. my ex's father disowned his own daughter because she married into a different religion... that's just going too far.

[ieatyourlvllol]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

The problem is that many theists adhere too piously to sacred writ, resulting in beliefs that are incompatible with scientific findings. The presence of evolution is quite apparent (and again, I say that as a theist); we have more than enough evidence to support such a conclusion. Thus, rather than trying to deny (probable) fact established by empirical method, a devoted believer should acknowledge evolution and make the appropriate accommodations by reassessing his/her central ideologies. This aspect of adaptability should be applied universally to the entire extent of a person's religious belief. However, here a conflict stems from an absence of religious autonomy. In other words, because theological introspection entails questioning and possibly altering belief, religious establishments often perceive it as a threat to their institutionalized dogmas, and they denounce it accordingly. For them, religious belief is absolute, and concession to other possibilities is not an option. This principle is in turn communicated to followers. As a result, many theists are largely unversed in the historical reasoning that forms the foundation of theology. If you were to ask such people to defend their belief in a deity by utilizing rational thought, most of them would probably fall back upon circular logic, rather than employing legitimate devices such as Aquinas' cosmological argument or Paley's teleological analogy. The implication is clear - "irrational" theists aren't necessarily uneducated - instead, they are simply uninformed.

P.S. - I know I don't represent the majority of theists, but I respect all beliefs, so long as they are supported by sound reasoning and grounded by personal investment. In fact, one of my very good friends is the president of an atheist/agnostic student organization. We get along just fine. 8)

[qqwref]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

I have the feeling you're going to reply to this with resentment and claim that I put too much "faith" in scientists, but that's because historians and scientists have a system that allows EVERYBODY to discredit them! Want to prove that water is not H20? You can! You won't, but you can try!

This is a really good point. And, for related reasons, if you provide undeniable evidence to the scientific community, they will actually say "OK, you're right". Scientific theories aren't written down in an ancient book somewhere - they're actually constantly updated, whenever someone does an experiment and determines that the current theory doesn't quite fit. If you know where to look (typically the paper that first proposed the theory), you can find the data that supports scientific claims.

And then we come to one of the reasons why I have a problem with Christianity. Try to tell the Christian community that you did experiments and have actual evidence that they're wrong (such as objects which are carbon-dated to >10000 years old, for those who believe in Genesis as a literal historical work), and they will at best ignore you for decades or centuries, and at worst torture or kill you. When Galileo proposed his theory of a sun-centered solar system (which explains the movement of the planets better than any other theory), the Church sentenced him to house arrest and forced him to recant his ideas. It took until 1992 - almost 350 years after Galileo died - for the Vatican to officially concede that the Earth was not stationary.

[Bolth mannn]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

The only reason I look down upon them is because they

1. Believe in someone that never existed
2. Some (not all are like this) base their life off of christianity, once again, something that is not real, it did not happen, etc.
3. Think less of others because they are not christian i.e. my ex's father disowned his own daughter because she married into a different religion... that's just going too far.

1) do you have proof he never existed?
2) again, do you have proof?
3) I too, agree that is going too far, thats not how all christians act.

sure christians dont have physical proof, thats where faith comes in. christianity actually has a lot of evidence to support it. the only thing noone is entirely sure about is about jesus/big man in sky.

but theres heaps of evidence that support some of the stories in the bible.

sure we might not have proof, but neither do you, so dont say with certainty that it doesnt exist.

[Izzy]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

sure we might not have proof, but neither do you, so dont say with certainty that it doesnt exist.

Nice logic..
How can you have faith in something because there's no proof it doesn't exist.

[dean_machine]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

sure we might not have proof, but neither do you, so dont say with certainty that it doesnt exist.

Are you serious? You should look into apologetics either on the internet or in books. There's plenty of proof.

[Bolth mannn]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

Nice logic..
How can you have faith in something because there's no proof it doesn't exist.

thats what faith is. believing in something we have no proof of.

if we all 'knew' god was real, christianity would be more like a clan. religion is based on faith.

EDIT: dean, list up some evidence then.

[dean_machine]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

thats what faith is. believing in something we have no proof of.

if we all 'knew' god was real, christianity would be more like a clan. religion is based on faith.

EDIT: dean, list up some evidence then.

I'd rather not, but since you say you're a christian you really should know that it's true and it would be good for you to find out all you can yourself.

[Bolth mannn]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

What is the meaning of life?

if your an atheist, there is none. you live life, then you die, then thats it.

cause honestly, if theres no meaning to life, we should all kill ourselves to get it over with, all lifes going to bring is more troubles and pains.

whats the point?

oh and dean, every atheist argument Ive read on the internet so far is counter-claimed. so unless you can list some evidence that PROVES theres no such thing as christianity, im going to stick with my belief.

[Squeek]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

What is the meaning of life?

if your an atheist, there is none. you live life, then you die, then thats it.

cause honestly, if theres no meaning to life, we should all kill ourselves to get it over with, all lifes going to bring is more troubles and pains.

whats the point?

What is the meaning of life?

If you're a Christian, there is none. You live life, then you die (and go to heaven, the better place that you all strive to go to). Then that's it.

Cause honestly, if you're just going to go to heaven anyway, you should just all kill yourselves to get it over with, all life is going to bring is more sin.

What's the point?

ps - you're the ones telling us there's a magical being in the sky. Burden of proof lies with you.

[wickedawesomeful]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

1) do you have proof he never existed?
2) again, do you have proof?
3) I too, agree that is going too far, thats not how all christians act.

sure christians dont have physical proof, thats where faith comes in. christianity actually has a lot of evidence to support it. the only thing noone is entirely sure about is about jesus/big man in sky.

but theres heaps of evidence that support some of the stories in the bible.

sure we might not have proof, but neither do you, so dont say with certainty that it doesnt exist.

You can't validate a claim by saying there's no proof it's wrong. If there's no evidence of any existence at all, we CAN say with certainty that it doesn't exist.

[wickedawesomeful]

Re: What's with the hostility towards Christians?

ps. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Lie

If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it....