Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

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  • devonin
    Very Grave Indeed
    Event Staff
    FFR Simfile Author
    • Apr 2004
    • 10120

    #1

    Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

    It's been suggested that as a general service to the stepfile making population of the site, that an overview of how copyright works with respect to permissions for FFR would be a good idea.

    Speaking generally, any work created by somebody, especially artistic works or "works of the mind" (That's music, literature, etc) is their property and cannot be used without their express permission. With regards to FFR this generally must take the form of express written consent, and may need to be doublechecked by requiring the person claiming to have recieved such consent to put the site administration in touch with the artist to confirm that permission was given.

    FFR will not use any music that is someone else's intellectual property without such consent.

    This doesn't mean, however, that every piece of music you could possibly want to use requires permission from the artist. Copyright is not permanant in any area of the world that I know of, and eventually, all works enter what is called "The Public Domain"

    Works in the public domain can be used by anybody for any reason without any need to seek permission.

    The primary legal concept dealing with entry of works into the public domain is called the "Berne Convention" It is an agreement that has been signed by 163 different countries, including every major country I believe has any likely chance to have generated music we'd want to step for FFR.

    The basic premise of the Berne Convention as it regards music says this:

    1/ Countries can set the length of copyright to anything they want as long as it is NOT LESS THAN 50 YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF THE AUTHOR,

    2/ The copyright law applies in the country that the work is being used in now, regardless of where it originated

    3/ None of the countries are allowed to require formal registration of copyright to grant copyright protection

    So, for our purposes, anything that was made by someone who died FROM JANUARY 1st 1958 AND ON IS COPYWRITTEN AND YOU MUST GET PERMISSION TO USE no matter who made it, where you live, where they lived, anything. If they died from 1958 on, automatically you need permission to use it.

    But as point 1/ suggests, countries can extend this further if they are so inclined, and in fact many (read: most of them) have extended that minimum from 50 years to 70 years (This covers the United States, and the Entire European Union from the get go) That means ANYTHING PUBLISHED BY SOMEONE WHO DIED FROM 1938 ON IS PROTECTED and you must get permission to use it.

    As you'd expect, there are naturally exceptions to this, depending on when the countries signed on to the Berne Convention, and older stuff has seperate laws, so I'm going to go through a couple countries with specific differences from the 70 year standard.

    United States - 70 years after death for anything published after 1978. 95 years after publication, or 120 years after creation whichever is shorter, for anything anonymously published or made for hire since 1978. Anything published before 1923 is public domain regardless of the circumstances around its publication

    Canada - 50 years after death, as per Berne, not extended to 70

    The whole EU - A flat 70 years after death of the artist

    Japan - 50 years, as per Berne, not extended to 70

    France - 74 years, 272 days; 100 years for anything copywritten by somebody who died actively in service in either world war

    India - 60 years after death

    Mexico - 75 years after death

    Spain - 80 years after death (between 1879-1987) 70 otherwise

    United Kingdom - 70 except for music, which is 50

    So pretty much universally, anything made by someone who died after 1958 is protected, and anything between 1938-1958 will depend on the country you live in.

    That covers the legality surrounding simply using somebody's song with FFR. But then we get into the issue of remixes, and the permissions surrounding those.

    The primary legal term with regards to remixes is "Fair Use" which governs the legal ability of someone to use copyrighted material without permission from the holder of the copyright.

    Remember, Fair Use isn't a legal state, it's a legal defense. Falling under the usual definition of fair use doesn't make you immune to being sued, it just counts as one of the ways you could defend against a lawsuit. So don't think that fair use makes you immune to legal problems.

    Fair use is an element of copyright law that, as of yet, is still pretty unique to the United States, but then since Berne Convention countries (pretty much everybody) respect the copyright laws of the country where the use is taking place, rather than where the work came from, and FFR is American, generally fair use will apply.

    There are four aspects of your use that are considered when fair use comes up:

    1/ the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes.

    Basically, the less money you intend to make from using it, and the more contributory and useful your use is, the more likely it is to be ruled fair use. If you are intending to advance knowledge or the progress of the arts, you're in good shape. If your use is transformative rather than derivative, you are probably engaging in fair use.

    2/ the nature of the copyrighted work

    You're more likely to find a ruling of fair use if the work is non-fictional since the information involved can be arguably better off freely available for the public good. Works of fiction are harder to suggest why you should be able to supercede their copyright. It would seem to me, though I'm no lawyer, that with regards to music, this is a very minor concern compared to 1/

    3/ The amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole

    A 10-second sample used in a remix of a 5 minute song is much better than taking the entire song and say, adding cowbell. The less of the original you use the better.

    4/ the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work

    If your remix is in the same style and genre as the original, and you're planning on selling it as an album of remixes of that artist, chances are you aren't engaging in fair use, because you're likely going to damage the market for sales of the original. Using some classical music in a hardcore death metal remix? Probably okay.

    So that's fair use. Once again, this is a legal defense, not a legal protection. You're ALWAYS better off contacting the artist of the work for permission than to simply remix and assume you are safe.

    The effect of this though, is that when we want to use work by remixers, if we have their permission to use their remix, we have a legal defense of the assumption that their work falls under fair use, and that if anybody tried to claim legally that we can stolen their work via remix, we could direct them to the artist whose remix we used, and have them argue fair use.

    I get the feeling that I've messed up some comparative numbers with regards to works produced by a certain year by people who've died by a certain other year, so if anything here seems off to you, or you want some more in depth explanation, please just let me know, and I'll do my best to fix it up.
  • robertsona
    missa in h-moll
    FFR Simfile Author
    • Dec 2006
    • 3997

    #2
    Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

    Fantastic thread and ninja of my idea (). Completely thorough.
    Great job.
    EDIT: p.s. put a ! after the "you" in the title hehehehe

    Comment

    • PsYcHoZeRoSk8eR
      Threat Emulation
      FFR Simfile Author
      • May 2004
      • 5184

      #3
      Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

      Very informative... This will really help me some of the works that I have in mind...

      Originally posted by Lightdarkness
      I'm light f**king darkness

      Comment

      • Afrobean
        Admiral in the Red Army
        • Dec 2003
        • 13262

        #4
        Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

        A few things, thrown together as mildly coherent rambling:

        Remix, as it is used here, really usually means cover. It's not often that songs around these parts are ACTUALLY alternate mixes of songs (only one coming to mind here is Silence) or samples, and are, instead, complete rebuilds of music, using little more than the source melody, recreated in a different style or with some other unique characteristic applied.

        So I guess what I'm saying here is, what's the story on covers? What about public domain covers? What if someone covers a song without making it unique in any way, we get permission from the performer of the cover, but do not get permission from the original writer? What about instances of songs being popular under the flag of a certain performer, but they had nothing to do with writing it; could someone cover the popular version of the song in an non-unique way and we could use it? How about same thing, except the cover is at least mildly different?

        The 70 year thing, that's 70 years from the performer right? Because if it's 70 years after the writer, couldn't we just use a cover of it and claim it as fair use, even if the 70 years are not up for the writer? And what about old-ish instrumental music-- does that mean the only way to claim fair use on this sort of thing would be for the song to be performed in a non-standard way? What if the song is not clearly defined as being connected to a certain style? Does that mean one could play the song on any instrument in any style and claim fair use?

        And what about copyright ownership not owned by the writer or performer? For instance, if Britney Spears gave us permission to use the song "...Baby One More Time", we might be morally justified to use it, but she surely doesn't own the rights, even to the particular studio recording. That would be up to the record label, right (and the writer, of course)? What if we got permission to such a song from both the performer and the producer? Does the copyright still "run out" at the 70 years past death point, and the record label is then just "borrowing" the rights until the 70 years past death runs out?

        What about instances of works being the collective effort of many people? When does the copyright run out then? And if the idea is as simple as "it'll be 70 years after the last contributing member has died", then how exactly would contributions be defined? Modern popular music has so many hands in the cookie jar that it would be basically impossible to clearly identify all contributing parties. Would it then be safe to say that only those who the are clearly credited as a contributing party count?

        What if, say, 9 people are credited as working on a song, from writing to final recording, and the 9 of them have been dead for 70 years. But there was actually a 10th person who was never credited and who is still alive. Would such a song as that be public domain regardless? Would it enter public domain unless the last remaining person was able to prove officially that they were involved in the production of the song in a noticeable way?

        As an example, could you identify some things which are not public domain at present, but will be at some point in the future, and also tell when they would be entering the public domain and identify specifically why? Not only will this help me (and possibly others) understand this with a little more depth, but it might even give some people some nice ideas

        ps I always thought works of art such as these only actually entered public domain if the copyright owner failed to publish anything using it for a certain period of time. Are the rules different for different media? Is there anything a copyright owner can do to stop his or her work from entering public domain, short of corporeal eternal life?

        Comment

        • Tasselfoot
          Retired BOSS
          FFR Simfile Author
          • Jul 2003
          • 25185

          #5
          Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

          Many of your situations are a bit far fetched... but in terms of the copyright holder. With a lot of artists we've contacted, they've said that it is fine by them, but that we'd need to speak with the label, since the label has the copyright. In which case, we get passed along to someone else... but can be like, "So and So said they want to do this."

          I'll let devonin pick apart the rest of your stuff.
          RIP

          Comment

          • Coolgamer
            Old-School Player
            • Sep 2003
            • 677

            #6
            Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

            You should include a section covering Creative Commons licenses.




            Originally posted by Synthlight
            St1cky only proves that he has no life and that his parents are alcoholics. They probably abused him with rubber duckies when he was a baby. Why else would you exploit scores on FFR?

            Comment

            • nev670
              FFR Veteran
              • Aug 2007
              • 452

              #7
              Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

              lol, this explains everything now !!
              Click >>><<<Click

              Avg Rank: 174 AAA: 40% FC: 99%
              nev670 & SnS ^_^ !
              This video is Dedicated to Tasselfoot
              Jason Key's Best Friend

              Comment

              • AfterNoon
                FFR Player
                • Jun 2008
                • 14

                #8
                Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

                FFR I give you premission to use any of my songs for FFR purpose's

                Noon's profile including the latest music, albums, songs, music videos and more updates.


                <3

                Comment

                • t-rogdor
                  tane orb
                  FFR Simfile Author
                  • Jun 2007
                  • 2685

                  #9
                  Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

                  Wait. Even after reading this, i dont understand. What if a song was created anonymously, never published under a record label, and was put in a giant mix CD on bittorent with every song related to, and the entirity of Disc 2 created by 4C**n (Censored because i dont want some dumb 10 year old kid to go google it)?
                  Originally posted by cetaka
                  I saw a flyer on a bulletin board at school asking for high-functioning aspergers/autism people to participate in some kind of experiment, and all I could think was, that sounds like a great place to meet girls.

                  Comment

                  • fayt2491
                    FFR Player
                    • Apr 2007
                    • 1

                    #10
                    Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

                    Sorry to run my noobish ideas by all of you, but i need help on a certain topic.
                    How do i put a song on FFR? What do i need to go through to do it? I have permission from the band. How do go about all of this?

                    Can some one shed some light on my situation please?

                    Comment

                    • Tasselfoot
                      Retired BOSS
                      FFR Simfile Author
                      • Jul 2003
                      • 25185

                      #11
                      Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

                      this thread isn't the right place for that... you can use this other sticky! http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/...ad.php?t=72047
                      RIP

                      Comment

                      • MooMoo_Cowfreak
                        Abraxas Hydroplane
                        • May 2006
                        • 1746

                        #12
                        Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

                        Let's say I want to step a song that was made by a man who died in 1937. That's PD, but is it free to just use someones performance of it?

                        AND DO NOT MOCK ME FOR BUMPING. This is a sticky.
                        Originally posted by hi19hi19
                        dumps abstractly represent the song with arrows

                        post-dumps abstractly represent the existential nihilism that the song invokes in the listener with negative space, evoking the ephemeral nature of the mind - the journey of stepmania begins in hope yet soon becomes corroded into a dialectic of futility, leaving only a sense of dread and the unlikelihood of a new synthesis

                        Comment

                        • MooMoo_Cowfreak
                          Abraxas Hydroplane
                          • May 2006
                          • 1746

                          #13
                          Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

                          Originally posted by Sprite-
                          You'd need to have permission from the performer. This is what usually happens with classical music.
                          Thanks.
                          Originally posted by hi19hi19
                          dumps abstractly represent the song with arrows

                          post-dumps abstractly represent the existential nihilism that the song invokes in the listener with negative space, evoking the ephemeral nature of the mind - the journey of stepmania begins in hope yet soon becomes corroded into a dialectic of futility, leaving only a sense of dread and the unlikelihood of a new synthesis

                          Comment

                          • Bolth mannn
                            FFR Veteran
                            • Aug 2008
                            • 2228

                            #14
                            Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

                            ok, say 'person' made a remix of one of led zepplin/linkin parks songs, and i got 'person's permission, would I have to get linkin/led's permission also if its a remix?

                            Comment

                            • -KIDTHONG-
                              FFR Veteran
                              • Sep 2007
                              • 578

                              #15
                              Re: Copyright, Permission, Public Domain and You

                              Originally posted by Bolth mannn
                              ok, say 'person' made a remix of one of led zepplin/linkin parks songs, and i got 'person's permission, would I have to get linkin/led's permission also if its a remix?
                              I don't think so.
                              Please keep your sig to the 250 x 600 size outlined in the site rules. BAM!

                              Comment

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