Infiltration - Postgame

[User6773]

Here's what you've all been waiting for:

Black - MrESqueek
Blue (PATRIOT) - HansSky
Brown - Kilgamayan
Gray - Tasselfoot
Green - Flypie
Indigo - Alain
Magenta - Evilbutterfly
Maroon (PATRIOT) - Blah
Olive - Whorlichan
Orange (PATRIOT) - Guido
Purple - Stretchy
Red - Kefit
Teal - Afrobean
White - Cypher
Yellow - Roopert

I'll post my thoughts in a bit, and also throughout the thread. Good game, but the humans botched it on Day 1 and never recovered.

[Kilgamayan]

RE: Infiltration - Postgame

oop-c

EDIT: Req the room layout because I'm curious.

[User6773]

RE: Infiltration - Postgame

I'll post a more detailed game report later, but here you go for now:

A-1 Gas
A-2 Loctr
A-3 Map
A-4 Weapons
A-5 Gas
A-6 NPC-1
A-7 Lock
A-8 Gas

B-1 Combination
B-2 Map
B-3 Hstry
B-4 Loctr
B-5 Hstry
B-6 Messg
B-7 Superloc
B-8 Map

C-1 GHOST
C-2 Lab
C-3 Messg
C-4 Psych
C-5 Hstry
C-6 Lock
C-7 Cmdr
C-8 Swtch

D-1 Lock
D-2 Loctr
D-3 Power
D-4 Valid
D-5 Lock
D-6 Valid
D-7 Seer
D-8 NPC-2

E-1 Swtch
E-2 Power
E-3 Map
E-4 Gas
E-5 Messg
E-6 Seer
E-7 Guard
E-8 Loctr

F-1 Swtch
F-2 Map
F-3 Hstry
F-4 Loctr
F-5 Gas
F-6 Superloc
F-7 Guard
F-8 Hstry

G-1 Lock
G-2 Valid
G-3 *****
G-4 Messg
G-5 Psych
G-6 Loctr
G-7 Messg
G-8 Psych

H-1 Seer
H-2 *****
H-3 Psych
H-4 Valid
H-5 Guard
H-6 Psych
H-7 Guard
H-8 Loctr


***** = involved in a sidequest no one discovered

I've got my own thoughts, but I'm tired and want to hear what you guys have to say first.

[Kefit]

I utterly detested the anonymity factor of this game. I felt it added nothing to the game (since I had figured out who half the players were by movement two), and it was a huge pain in the ass for me to deal with, especially with AIM. Combine this with some social anxieties of mine around strangers, and it made this game a real chore =/

So, how exactly did we botch up this game at the beginning? I don't recall anything major happening, besides Gray's lynching. And seriously, who can blame us for doing that? I still can't believe that he wasn't a patriot

There were also major issues with class balance. Namely, warriors are completely useless. I chose the role since I figured it would allow my to both protect myself from patriots and kill guards, which I thought at the time time no one else could do. Turns out sneakers could kill guards more effectively than I, and that there was absolutely nothing anyone could do to defend themselves against a patriot attack.

Speaking of guards, what exactly are they here for anyway? It's not like they do anything except set off alert mode, since they can't actually kill anyone. They seem like nothing more than an unnecessary way to lengthen the game to me.

[GuidoHunter]

Well, that was fun. Not too much of a challenge, but fun anyway.

(By the way, I'm writing this while chardish writes his, so if I repeat anything, I don't care)

I've got to hand it to blah; he's the man of the game. Everyone trusted him with all the information they had and with that we were able to trounce the humans. Seriously, this game is supposed to be a lot more about lying and deceitfulness. The terminals are there to figure such things out and thereby deal with it. Cunning is the name of this game, not honesty.

If you want to see a record of all of our information, here it is.

From the start, the game was ridiculously against us. When chardish let us use the terminals in alert mode, it seemed like a good idea, but the game was still stacked. Then he gave us the power to kill without y'all knowing. This was an absolute necessity, as y'all's plan to lynch anyone who was in a room with anyone that died was too solid for us to beat. Now, the alert mode change was to avoid the humans abusing it, but all it did was let us abuse it. We set off alert mode every turn simply because we could; it didn't hurt us any.

Also, on Movement 1 the three of us happened upon TWO victory rooms and a history terminal. Score. Then, we find out about a gas terminal. Game over, GG nubs, next map. The map was far too big for anyone to find a history or seer terminal (funny story about that), save for Magenta hitting the superlocater, to check out our movements, so we didn't really worry about any of that because we weren't arousing much suspicion at all. That, and we killed off anyone who knew too much =).

Movement 2 was the best, though. We knew where Green and Indigo were going, so we went there then killed them, I went to a gas terminal and gassed White and Olive who revealed without shame that they were going to the same room (good strategy, bad planning). On top of that, we got Gray lynched. He knew way too much and had me and Blue at the top of his suspicion list.

After that it was cake.

Now, we wouldn't have done nearly as good if we didn't have blah. He's got the skillz to get people to trust him, apparently. I didn't try too hard because, I'm going to face it, I've forgotten how to be human. TWG IV was the last time I tried. I had little motivation to go to people and try to extract information because I didn't want to arouse suspicion or something like that; I don't know. But yeah, he ran our team and y'all's team, so that was pretty pathetic. Not only did I not contribute much to the team, I came off like a complete dumbass at times (even though the question of where Gray went is STILL a logical question). But, despite that, he knew everything, so we had to run any sort of plan by him so that it didn't go against any information he had. It was pretty much like we were at his sexcellent-playing mercy.

What I'm getting at is that the greens do need to cooperate, but I don't think they need to so early in the game. Wait to collect some information, don't give the reds any, then start sharing when you think you can get a plan together.

Oh, about the funny story... From the beginning of the game, Hans kept telling us he had a gut instinct about E-6. Well, first two phases we had more important things to do, but on the third movement he goes there. Lo and behold, there's a seer terminal. Just imagine how him being on the greens' side would have changed the game.

Regarding the anonymity thing, I liked it. It was extremely easy to figure out about half the people (especially those who TRIED to get others to know who they were coughTasscough), but not knowing who the rest were was pretty cool. It also let us roleplay, and I'm always for that.

So, balancing issues:
Let the wolves kill before the people in the room know they're there. This is a must for the reds to have any chance at winning, since without it, they're reduced to lynchings and gassings. Lynchings are too hard and gassings will hopefully not be so easy in the next one.
Reduce the building size. Far too big, humans couldn't find anything. If they could find it, we could destroy it.
Reds in Alert Mode: Something has to be done about this; it was far too cheap. Maybe if you keep this and take out the Patriot Report it wouldn't be so broken, but the Patriot Report was extremely nice. I'd like to see a game where both teams have to avoid guards.

Anything I missed?

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[User6773]

Far too big, humans couldn't find anything. If they could find it, we could destroy it.

If I had let Movement 4 play out the humans would have had 4 of the 5 necessary rooms to win the game.

[Kilgamayan]

Brown: (Swore as well; not Squeek)

lmao

<3

I personally thought it was pretty damn obvious I was who I was, since I changed nothing about how I normally acted.

[GuidoHunter]

But then they would have had to cooperate with each other without any of the reds knowing.

What I'm getting at is that you need seer, history, and superlocater terminals at your disposal if there are multiple reds about; knowing where the rooms are won't help if you can't get the people there at the right time.

@Kefit: The round one mistake was telling blah about the gas and superlocater terminals. GG alain and EB.

EDIT2: You're no longer funny, chardish

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[Kilgamayan]

Fission Mailed is another MGS reference.

[Kefit]

Just so you know, I never evade the language filter. Too much work. It just so happens that FFR doesn't filter some words that contain swears within them.

As it is right now, I think that the patriots have far too much power with being able to kill anyone in a room before they get a chance to react. All they have to do now is find out where someone is going, and that person is dead. This makes it almost impossible to work together; in a normal TWG, you can usually trust people a little bit without fear that misplaced trust will equal your immediate death. Not so in this game.

Of course, leaving the patriots with no options except for lynchings and gas terminals makes them far too powerless. I'm not sure what to do about this, but some sort of middle road needs to be found.

Two more things: the facility was definitely far too big, and too many of the terminals were useless. I ran into a guard terminal, an anonymous messege terminal, and a lock terminal, and even if I could have used them (GRR Alert mode GRR) they wouldn't have done anything worthwhile for me.

[GuidoHunter]

See, Kilga, I couldn't figure you out because I couldn't discern between the styles of Black, Brown, Red, or Yellow. I had a suspicion that roop was Yellow, but had nothing but that suspicion. I figured Teal was Afro but again I had nothing on which to base that.

And yeah, I liked the figuring Squeek wasn't brown or red, too. Like I said, I had nothing to go on, but that was good enough for me.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[Kilgamayan]

I knew Kefit was Red the instant he mentioned being delayed by his job.

I'm somewhat disappointed that you missed that. >_>

[Tasselfoot]

I'll add a NEW postgame later in the day. It is 5am, and I'm very tired. This is what I wrote as soon as I saw that I had died (about 3am, few hours after my lynching):

OK. Here is my rant that I wish I could have posted on the 24th. (written on the 24th.)

I left to go back to school around 10. The trains were delayed from the snow and extremely slow. What normally takes about 2 hours total took me til 3am to get home. And, what do I find? I have been assreamed. Once again, I get lynched without being able to defend myself. GG wolves and idiot humans.

To answer every single comment about my behavior, starting from the top:

Purple: You told me of the entrance to MGGhost in C1, and everyone knew you had been in C3 (Anon Message). C4 was a psychic terminal and C8 was a switch terminal. Now, the switch terminal is not helpful to foxhound at all, is it. Not really. And, the psychic terminal is fairly common, not that helpful either. You just asked me one time, and I gave you my honest answer. Had you pressed me, I likely would have revealed a room or two to you, although I didn't see any reason to do so.

I didn't turn down that much info. Maroon, Magenta, Olive, Yellow all picked up info from me. And, I had contacted others as well, politely asking if they would share. A few declined, a few accepted. I never pushed, never was forceful, and was quite willing to trade info like I tried to do with Orange (who I think is a wolf).

I, amongst MANY others, knew that Indigo went to F6. You could blame 5-6 others as easily as me for that. Plus, I said to multiple people that I was in a locator terminal room, and was willing to share the location with Maroon had he been willing to tell me the location of HIS locator terminal.

Orange: no intel provided, no comments able to be given. I think you're a wolf. Thought that when I talked to you. You, Red, Blue.

Red: I had sent in my request to use my locator terminal on you, could have proven or disproven that statement that you were still on E-floor. Black informed me that the guard terminal told one the future location of the guards, but I really don't know either. And, I think you're a wolf not a warrior, so you could have used it.

I made up no reasons. You said your initial statement because you were planning on doing it. When everyone jumped on you, you changed. And, every other reason I voted for you was listed.

Blue: Very wolfish, like I suspected. It is why I contacted you and Orange. I didn't expect to get any intel from you, when about 10 other people had told me info. Why? wolf. And then you use that to lynch me. Retarded. Hopefully your ruse will be seen through. I asked you nicely about your rooms, you said you'd think about it, I said ok. That was it. And, I know too much so I have to die. Excellent to kill off the most knowledgeable human, IF YOU ARE A WOLF!

And, I think Red is a Red, so of course I'm going to try and get him lynched.

And, ALL OF YOU ARE #$#ing STUPID! IF A RED DOES NOT ATTACK A GUARD, THE GUARD WILL KILL THE RED. ABOUT 3 DIFFERENT PEOPLE SAID THAT THE REDS DON'T HAVE TO KILL THE GUARDS, AND NO ONE CORRECTED THAT STATEMENT!!!! God, you people are stupid.

White: I pushed hard for votes? I made my 1 post on why I was voting him, Maroon agreed and voted. Magenta did also, although I never talked to him about it. And, then I come up with some logic, so I post that. If I were allowed to live, I could have verified that Red didn't kill Indigo. Pity you idiots killed me.

Who ever came out and ASKED me for info. None of you. Maroon wished some info back if he was going to help me with my plan, and I gave it. I hope he still follows it. Anyone who asked me for info, I gave some. How am I supposed to give you all my information IF YOU DON'T ASK FOR IT!!!

No one asked me what room I was in. I was in E8, a locator terminal. And, sure, I could have been lying. I wasn't.

Maroon: Dude, $*%# you. I put so much trust in you, and you dick me in the ass like a piece of prison meat. See above about the guard comment. Fool. And, I was dead serious that I would use my locator to locate purple if he didn't tell me. He told me of his own free will. So I said the same thing to Yellow. He also told me of his own free will. So, I located Red. I could care less where your damn Locator Terminal was Maroon, except to rule it out of places to go. We had this game won, Moron, and you kill me. We were going to get 10 new rooms tomorrow, and maybe 10 more the next day. My plan was excellent, and you screw me over. I'm so #$#ing pissed off at you, more than anyone. The other 5 voters are 3 Wolves and 2 Fools. But I expect more from you.

I said on page 1 that I wouldn't lie to ANYONE during the game. No one remembered that, but I didn't. I didn't lie one time to anyone during the entire game. I had the location of MGGhost, the Stinger room, the Generator. Needed 2 more pieces and we win. Now you have no leadership to coordinate. Stupid.

With that said, I'm done with TWG for the forseeable future. I couldn't sleep last night because of how furious I was with how stupid you people are. And, that has been a regular theme throughout all the TWGs. Me doing amazing things for the Humans, and other fools going behind my back and undermining me.

-Tass out.






PS - I still have MY map, which on day 2 had 3/5 of the needed winning items. I will post it tomorrow.
PPS - I am still undecided if I will play again. Most likely, I'll miss playing too much within a week and be back. Also, I'm sure you all are going to beg me back. Anyway, I will post again after some much needed rest.
PPPS - My apologies to Blah. I was so furious about what happened that I overlooked the obvious. When I re-read everything the next day, it was so clear to me that you were a wolf. Which means you weren't being a fool, but everyone else was for not seeing what you did to me.

Seriously. Bed. No more edits from me.

[Squeek]

Hey, it's Squeek. The guy that deceived you all.

Apparently, my initial plan worked out quite well. Sure, I ended up deceiving my own teammates so that nobody knew who I was, but that was the plan. I had to drag out the game longer and since some people see me as a power player, I had to keep my anonimity.

So, both on AIM and on the forum, I decided to leave out apostrophes and punctuation from sentences. I also neglected capitalization for a bit. It hurt my moral values, but life goes on.

There was one thing that threw me off and I congratulate Whorlichan for pulling it off.

She made a post in a random Chit-Chat thread and signed it "Q". It was promptly deleted, but I saw it first. I knew something was amiss when he didn't login under "The_Q" to post it again, but I figured he just didn't want it posted in the first place. I thought Olive was Q the entire game.

I personally thought Alain was Gray due to the amount of involvement he had, but I forgot Tass was in this game, apparently.

Ok, onto what I did.

I started at C4. I found a Psychic terminal. The most useless thing to find on Day 1.

I move to E7 and find a dead guard. This prompts me to ask Gray who was there. Red was there. Red killed a guard and never fessed up. I make a "subliminal" comment about it, but ABSOLUTELY NOBODY PICKS UP ON THE HINT EVER.

I moved back to C4 to see who died and what role they had, but Alert Mode is called AGAIN.

Then Alert Mode was called again and everybody dies. Frown.

Oh, I was also a hacker. I figured Alert Mode would be a rare occurance due to the 1/8 chance per floor. All I really cared about is whether or not intel would be legit.

~Squeek

PS - One thing I do recommend so you don't accidentally post in the wrong forum or do something incorrectly on AIM is to get two separate programs for each. I used Firefox for posting and GAIM for AIM. I told Chardish that the easy way to resolve the forum situation is to restrict the players' postings to only be in that forum. We'll see how it goes.

PPS - I swear if nobody else noticed that the guards are named after the floor they were supposed to be on, I'm going to go ballistic. I found the dogtags for "Evans" on floor "E", so I figure it's a good way to make sure somebody is not lying to me.

[stretchypanda]

And Guido gets his revenge for getting owned last game.

I'm actually very, very happy for this to be over. When I ran into a guard the first day, Chardish told me I could either fight or die, and that he thought he knew what I wanted, and I was tempted to tell him to kill me off. I shouldn't have signed up in the first place, but once I was in, I was going to try my best to keep up and participate actively. I was pretty sure I shouldn't have been trusting Blah (yeah, the anonymity was kinda ridiculous), but I also didn't really care. Fun times.

That's about all I have to say except, Tasselfoot. Get the fuck over yourself. If a room is "unimportant," you should have no problem telling me what's in it. This is what you get for trying to win the goddamn game on your own. Stop making such a big deal out of this. IT'S A GAME. ON THE INTERNET.

Sorry it didn't work out the way you wanted, Chardish. It was a good idea, just ridiculously complicated.

EDIT: By "last game," I meant that game where I stole information from Guido in exchange for sexual favors. ; )