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#1 |
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FFR Player
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Note: Forgive my sounding as if I'm writing a sort of moral essay or I'm sort of radical political blogger type individual, I apoligize in advance for any inaccuracies or conflict of opinion.
Greed is a part of human psyche. Say the word and many images pop into mind. People fighting for the last food object or an altercation between two individuals who have simply found a dollar on the street. Money attributes to greed, as does our needs of life, (IE food, shelter, etc.) and it seems to me that it won't stop growing until we realize the scarcity of everything. Sure, some things can be remade, plants and vegetables. It may even be possible, in my belief, to clone certain objects(EX:meat) in order to keep their existance continuous, even though cellular structure breaks down through repeated cloning. Greed is such an evil and driving instinct in humans. Greed also kills as well. Think of a person who has some sort of disease that has been known to be uncurable. He gets drugs to try and fight off the potential uncurable diseases. My heart goes out to those individuals. They've got hope when there's no possible way they'll survive to a completely natural end. I say this why? Think of the drug companies. The persons who get their drugs from them. There's probably a cure that the government has kept from the public to continue revenue from their drugs. Think of the money! Ah. Such greed kills. So we've established greed kills and greed stirs from humanity. What big point am I alluring to? I dislike our government as a whole. We've established in the past that the government of the United States is made by the people and so on. But is it really for the people anymore? To me, it seems it is only for the wealthy. The US has become a sort of greedy clique of some sort. How could we correct the problem? Why we'd have to teach the public to suppress urges of greed. But the government itself uses the media to corrupt the public into a state of non caring. I've heard it said on CNN a few days ago. We care more about the wealthy than we do our very selves. As well as that, we cannot correct the problem with the above listed method. The United States has created certain freedoms whereas we cannot do that. So essentially all forms of government are playing from power from years ago. This is not a free country. This is a gigantic ghetto with palaces spread round. The classic Marxism of the Bourgoise versus the Proletariat. In my views, I could seem like a lunatic, but we need to move more towards socialism, not purely, but we need to move it closer so we've got more control. I believe that everyone should work for one another and not for personal pleasures. Not entirely atleast. We must have our own small personal happiness, but we also must ensure the public and those in force should also be pleased as well. Sure, label me a communist if you please. I simply wish to state that the current state of the world displeases me, and I see it simply as something insanely radical MUST be done in order to create a better nation. Otherwise, we're doomed to eventually get ourselves bombed. I'm looking out not as a United States protector, but that of a protector of human lives. Many more have it worse than us, I understand that we all suffer in variant ways, but we must evolve, or we will perish.
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Formerly known as Almsty. (AlMsTy744, look it up.) |
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#2 | |||||||||
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Very Grave Indeed
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Marx never said that, and anybody who suggested it to him, he'd like as not call a fool to their face. Capitalism is a system that is based upon the concept of infinite growth. As long as growth continues to occur, capitalism will remain and become more entrenched. I'd argue that there's generally not a damn thing you could do about it either. To wit: Every attempt to forge a communist state out of a non-communist state through means other than the unanimous support of the population (hint: this has never happened on a large political scale) has failed miserably almost immidiately. You can't force the Marxist revolution. He always said that it was an inevitable consequence of the quest for infinite growth. It will plateau, and then collapse in on itself. Only when that has happened, can the workers rise up and sieze the means of production. |
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#3 |
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Little Chief Hare
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To the OP: Almost everything you said is wrong. I will handle it later when I have the energy.
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#4 | ||
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Very Grave Indeed
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#5 |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Storm Sanctuary!
Posts: 255
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I'm not going to take too much time to talk about the idea of greed, but I definatly disagree with greed being evil. I want people to be peaceful, but honestly, for my own personal desires. I want people to get along instead of fight pointless wars such as that being fought in Iraq. Sure, I only want peace because perhaps I would expect such things like hovercrafts, brainchips, and any other futuristic things, but where is the evil in that? Also, sure it is not pleasant at all to be greedy because they might not ever spend what they have to help others or even themselves, but it's not evil unless you do bad things to obtain what you have now (lie and say that cigarettes don't cause cancer). People actually worked for what they have now so they can keep what they have now if they choose. As for any person who doesn't have a chance to ever obtain money or any status, I would hope that they recieve help, but in my opinion, only if they want to ever want to be successful and not some person who sits around and does nothing. Unfortunatly, I don't feel as though anyone is obligated to help any poor person unless they choose to (I would help someone in need if I could spare it).
Last edited by Master_of_the_Faster; 06-20-2007 at 02:14 PM.. |
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#6 | ||||||||||||||
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Little Chief Hare
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To make it clear, I think this is probably so correct that if it were possible to remove "greed" completely from the "human psyche", it would result in people not eating, drinking, or searching to satisfy any other basic desires. This is simply because desires and "greed" stem from the same basic processes, and to remove all "greed" would likely be to remove all desires. Quote:
I will treat this as your second main premise. Quote:
If you take it from Friedman's perspective, the cost imposed by regulation both limits the potential of a drug company to invest in new products, and results in a forward shifting of cost to consumers. From Rothbard's perspective, forward shifting of cost is logically impossible, so the effect of regulation is to impose cost entirely on drug companies. This results in some drug companies going out of business or becoming uncompetitive in a specific market and thus gives the remaining drug companies the ability to raise prices. Quote:
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[quote]I believe that everyone should work for one another and not for personal pleasures. [quote] I'm not sure this is possible, how do they "work for each other"? The monetary system, to the extent it is not interfered with (given its federalized nature though technically it is always interfered with), enables people to work "for each other". I give you money, you do something for me. I get something I want, so technically you "worked for me". Then, you take money, repeat the process. This is of course a labor centric perspective, you can work for a person by making them food or housing, but it is the food or housing itself that benefits the person, so although you did "work for them", you did so by providing them something they value, not by creating value through labor as many Marxists contend. Quote:
Also, what do you mean by those "in force"? Why distinguish them from the "public"? Quote:
Although you haven't been specific as to which of these perspectives you hold to, it should be noticed that both of these aims fail. Quote:
I think some perspective would benefit you. The world always has problems. However, as you yourself noted, some parts of the world have more problems than others. Of course, problems make us all unhappy. I think if you recognized that the current system represented much less suffering relative to other systems, and that there are other refinements which would create even less suffering, you wouldn't advocate such radical change. As a side note, your last sentence I really do find humorous. Did you know that in the Soviet Union, the office biological position of the country was one of Lamarckian evolution? Lamarckian, as opposed to Darwinian evolution, suggested that changes made to a creature, or even just environmental pressures put on a creature, would manifest as adaptations in the next generation. What does this mean? It means if you cut the tail off a rat, its offspring won't have a tail. Well, this was demonstrated to be false in very short order. However, that didn't prevent the Soviet Minister of Agriculture from claiming many years later that by putting Oak trees in Siberia repeatedly they would eventually, despite repeated death from the cold, start growing there. Well, turns out they didn't. |
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#7 |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 38
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how do you write so much...
Anway, I don't really agree with most of the stuff IceSide said, but I do think that if people were less greedy they would be more happy. Humans in general wan't things they don't actually need. There have been several wars over oil, diamonds, etc. that were all fueled by greed. Countless people died, more were injured, and in the end, more was lost than gained(most of the time) I remember having once read a joke about this monk, who, on his birthday, oppened all his presents to find them empty. The caption read "Nothing! Just what I've always wanted!" (for those of you who don't get it, please don't ask me to explain. I won't) I found it rather ridiculous at the time, but I think that if you can learn to want what you alredy have instead of leading a very materialistic life, you will be much happier. |
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#8 |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Jun 2007
Age: 32
Posts: 40
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America is a very greedy country full of very greedy people. I don't believe myself to be materialistic in the least. I find pleasure in life's simplest endeavors. I love camping, hiking, climbing, biking, making up games with friends...
If you let materials take over your life, they push away the things very dear to you...your family and friends. |
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#9 |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Jun 2007
Age: 32
Posts: 40
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The one thing I don't agree with is working for the public. While I'd love to see everyone happy and well off, I don't feel I should pay for someone to be lazy.
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#11 |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: lost, but not hopeless
Age: 28
Posts: 95
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of course we need a change. everything in our world sucks like i cant even say. greed and the greed for money is only half of it. everyone wants everything that they cant have. we're all so selfish! we're idiots stuck on this planet, hurting everyone and killing everything and getting rid of every little thing that bugs us. everyone may as well wear no clothes at all like it was in the beginning because people barely wear clothes as it is. doesnt anyone else see that we're slowly but surely destroying ourselves? we're all gonna die and rot in hell. its all we deserve. unless we change. NOW.
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#12 | |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: 北海道 釧路
Posts: 643
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Anyways, humans are part of nature, what we are doing is perfectly fine according to non existence of rules aside from the ones we come up with. Hope you see my point ;p |
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#13 |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2
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We are a bunch of Capitalists, so that's where this "greed" spawns from; the whole point is to make money.
Yes, it seems that money has engulfed the whole political system... So you say we need change then? Obviously, that's why we will take the positions of our leaders when the time comes. That's where History class comes in. |
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#14 | |
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Little Chief Hare
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for instance, food. |
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#15 |
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Little Chief Hare
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I think that economics class and philosophy class would make that history class a bit more helpful.
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#16 |
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Very Grave Indeed
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And amsuingly, a full half of the wealthiest CEOs in our "horrible, greedy, capitalist' state graduated their colleges with liberal arts degrees like history, philosophy, or labour studies.
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#17 | |
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FFR Player
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Greed in itself isn't a real problem. It's the means by which people satisfy their greed that becomes an issue.
Greed, and desire to have a better life for yourself isn't bad. If it weren't for greed, conditions would never improve. There would never be new inventions and such, as no one would be desiring better for themselves. It only becomes a problem, when people are willing to use counterproductive means of getting what they desire. For example lying and theft are when greed becomes a issue. Quote:
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#18 |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 8
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Greed is human nature.
But the way society portrays everything at the present, how can we make greed something benificial? We can't. We're following the natural order of things. Everything must come to an end, and we are close. Last edited by Magic187; 06-27-2007 at 08:01 PM.. Reason: Misspelled Word |
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#19 |
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Very Grave Indeed
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How is following the natural order of things not beneficial? It got us this far without rendering ourselves extinct.
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#20 | |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Jun 2007
Age: 32
Posts: 40
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You can camp without equipment. You can hike without gear. You can climb with no gear (very dangerous, but you can). Biking requires a bike, but I don't believe that to be materialistic. It's a form of transportation, like a horse would be 200 years ago. |
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