Old 02-12-2007, 01:09 AM   #41
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

I don't like men but don't drink beer.
I'm gonna go 'jack' off.
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Old 02-12-2007, 10:38 AM   #42
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

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Originally Posted by Wlfwnd91 View Post
I'm not sure of the word you're looking for, I'm sure it will come to me at 4am though.

I'm one person who always tries to strive for truth, so I do see your point of view, however this is one thing that we can't simply know, and that's the only reason that I think religion is something that should be chosen based on what works best and what makes you happiest. Yes, we should all strive for truth, but we don't know what comes after this life, and we more-than-likely never will (Unless the rapture happens and we all realize that God is real or something, which is a possibility) until we die. We'll never know what the right one is, and that's the only reason I follow the "whatever works best" philosophy.

And I suppose there's a difference in Joseph Smith and Jesus Christ. But, it's only because Jesus claimed to be a savior, while Joseph Smith did not. Joseph Smith is no different than anyone else who wrote books of the New or Old testament. Jesus didn't add a word to the bible, however prophets of God did. If you believe those prophets, then isn't it safe to say that there's a possibility that God chose another prophet to write more to his Great Book? I'm not saying I agree with either side, I'm just trying to enlighten some people to the possibility. The Old Testament was written by prophets, the New was written by prophets, and The Book of Mormon was written by a prophet...Seems consistent to me.
Uhm... try again. The Book of Mormon was not written by Joseph Smith, only translated by him through the Uram and thumam or whatever. Also, many people believe that Christ did not have to die when he did being the literal son of God. They suggest that he merely died after he completed his atonement in which he suffered extreme pain to pay for all of our sins. Now thats not to say sinning doesnt matter anymore, it just says that now we have the ability to actually repent and be (for most cases) forgiven of these sins.
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Old 02-12-2007, 10:48 AM   #43
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

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Uhm... try again. The Book of Mormon was not written by Joseph Smith, only translated by him through the Uram and thumam or whatever. Also, many people believe that Christ did not have to die when he did being the literal son of God. They suggest that he merely died after he completed his atonement in which he suffered extreme pain to pay for all of our sins. Now thats not to say sinning doesnt matter anymore, it just says that now we have the ability to actually repent and be (for most cases) forgiven of these sins.
Sorry for not being all upto date on Mormonism, basically what you've said is all I know, so hopefully you're right, lest I look like an idiot when saying any of this to another mormon. What's the Uram or Thumam? And about the whole Christ's death thing, I have no idea, that's all on belief I suppose.
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Old 02-12-2007, 11:33 AM   #44
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Thanks for the website, Ill check it out as soon as I'm done posting.

Slipstrike, you said a few posts ago that murder is unpardonable, but then explain the biblical quote that all sins are equal.

Wlfwind, you make a good point however I feel that the difference between the new testament being added to the bible and the book translated by Joseph Smith is that the New Testament had a reason to bring in new rules, Jesus died, people could now repent for sins, all this was explained. There was a reason for a new book. I don't see the reason for a new book now.

Shashmakito, whaaa?!?
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Old 02-12-2007, 11:42 AM   #45
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Wlfwind, you make a good point however I feel that the difference between the new testament being added to the bible and the book translated by Joseph Smith is that the New Testament had a reason to bring in new rules, Jesus died, people could now repent for sins, all this was explained. There was a reason for a new book. I don't see the reason for a new book now.
And that's why you chose to stay Christian as opposed to go to Mormonism, and I respect that. I'm not trying to convert you, cause as I've made quite clear (I believe) I don't follow or believe either side, I'm just trying to get you to open your mind a bit to where they may be coming from, ya know?

EDIT: Same goes for you and respecting his side, Slip
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Old 02-12-2007, 12:02 PM   #46
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

The problem here isn't really that people have a problem with homosexuals. In fact, the problem was the way that homosexuals were portrayed. Mal got it, they portrayed homosexuals as un-masculine. I, myself, am a homosexual. And I'm certainly not feminine. I was a bit offended, but not to the point where I would want it taken off the air. Then again, it is just like any other general stereotype. Asians are nerdy kids who only do their schoolwork. Indians work at gas stations. Gays are not manly. All and all, it's just America trying to classify things into categories.

Oh and the whole religious debate going on... I am honestly not Chrisitian. But when I came out as a homosexual, I got so much of this stuff preached to me. A sin is a sin. There is no sin that is greater then the other. But the Christian institution has demoralized homosexuals to the point where nobody even knows why they hate on them. I don't know how many of my friends left me when I told them and all I could say to them was "You liked me a week ago. How come you dont' feel the same way now?" And they never could answer that.

My point is that the institutions have brainwashed society. It really doesn't matter what the Bible says literally. It's the teachings of Jesus that you should be following with the Bible as a guide. God is forgiving and all-knowing. And you are supposed to follow that doctrine. Being discriminatory towards ANYONE is against all that you are supposedly living for. And THAT is the sin that you should be taking in to consideration.
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Old 02-12-2007, 02:01 PM   #47
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

Ok, I know I'm probably going to be involved in a smack-down for posting this...but I feel my point is valid, and I would hope this isn't an issue of proving people wrong...

Anyway, I've never been much of a religious person. I grew up Catholic, and I really think that's the reason why I'm not very religious. Catholicism in itself is so hypocritical that it's really no wonder why people are flocking to different religions. I found it hysterical that the Catholic Church is going crazy over the fact that within the next 50 years most of Europe will most likely convert to Muslim. About the post that everyone should strive to find the truth, the one religion, I think that's a little moot. Yes we all want to know what the "right" religion is so that we can play by the "right" rules and just mosey on up into Heaven, or whatever happy place you believe in once we die (if you believe we just decompose, then perhaps your soil is of excellent quality). However, I think many people are missing the key point in all of this: the Bible, Quran (sp?), etc are all guidelines for people to live their lives by. These aren't stereo manuals where you insert plug A into port B and live happily ever after. I mean, what do all these "words of God" have in common? The simplest way I see it is that all these different books, doctrines, etc, are ways for people to live their lives in a way that they respect themselves and everyone they interact with.

Now, I'm sure we all remember the Catholic Reformation, and the Protestant break-away (not that I can blame them) some centuries ago. Catholics got in trouble for saying people could "buy their way into Heaven". Now seriously, how the hell is that possible? Well, it's not, and we learned our lesson, but it goes to show my point. Life is a journey: we're not supposed to know the end of it, but try to make the part we travel as good and honest as we possibly can. All these religions (for the most part...I'm not a know-how on cults) are related in that they try to teach people how to have good morals. Treat your neighbors as you would treat yourself, respect everyone equally, forgive others so that you may be forgiven, do unto others as they would do unto you, etc.

If you've ever met a, what I like to call, "hard-core Catholic" I bet you've heard that Catholicism is the "right" religion, and that you need to convert in order to save your eternal soul. Well that's just crap; if God loves everyone and says everyone is equal to him, then why would he favor ANY person over the other? He wouldn't. Also, I do believe God adapts to the changing era's. Is it not also possible that He adapts to the different religions? There are so many connections between Judaeism, Christianity, Muslim, Hindu, etc. that is it really that hard to see that maybe God adapted to all of these? Why not? He knows us better than anyone, and He knows that the human psyche can only be bent so far. I really believe He's taken different forms in order to guide all of us as best as He can. Otherwise it just doesn't make sense. I mean really, if there's only one true religion, then Catholics are somewhat right: everyone not of that religion is going to Hell (or some equally unpleasant place). I really can't see God going around and dictating something like that. It would contradict so many things that it's just ridiculous. That's why I really believe that it's not so much the title of your religion, or the numerous beliefs instilled by that religion that matters: it's the lessons you learn from it.

Ok, feel free to drop loads of crap onto this post...I always love seeing how people react when someone says they're not as unique as they'd like to be
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Old 02-12-2007, 02:18 PM   #48
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

You didn't say much that I, or others, haven't already said, just wording it differently with a few extra stories here and there. I agree with what you said, but it's all already been said in this thread.

Quote:
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The problem here isn't really that people have a problem with homosexuals. In fact, the problem was the way that homosexuals were portrayed. Mal got it, they portrayed homosexuals as un-masculine. I, myself, am a homosexual. And I'm certainly not feminine. I was a bit offended, but not to the point where I would want it taken off the air. Then again, it is just like any other general stereotype. Asians are nerdy kids who only do their schoolwork. Indians work at gas stations. Gays are not manly. All and all, it's just America trying to classify things into categories.
I'm bi, yea, that means that gays hate me and straights hate me, but I love men just as much as any other gay guy, and that commercial made me crack up. We should all be able to laugh at ourselves. Being gay does make you less masculine than a straight guy. Who cares? It bothers me when people come out of the closet and feel insulted by being called feminine, or fags, or dykes, or fudge packers, or anything like that. Be proud of you! Despite who you are, be damned proud of it.
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Old 02-12-2007, 02:28 PM   #49
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

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Ok, I know I'm probably going to be involved in a smack-down for posting this...

[word vomit about Catholicism]
Probably.

Quote:
Catholicism in itself is so hypocritical
REEEE!!! Try again.

Quote:
people are flocking to different religions.
Strike two! Pitcher's count.

Quote:
I found it hysterical that the Catholic Church is going crazy over the fact that within the next 50 years most of Europe will most likely convert to Muslim.
Would you care to, I dunno, base your comments on anything? That statement is just plain ludicrous.

Quote:
Catholics got in trouble for saying people could "buy their way into Heaven". Now seriously, how the hell is that possible?
Suggested reading: Indulgences. In school you learn that Indulgences were sold as free passes into heaven. First of all, there's the misunderstanding that that's what an Indulgence is; they're still around and are perfectly reasonable things. Secondly, there may have been some unscrupulous Church members who indeed took money and promised entrance into heaven. Certainly possible, but never condoned by the Church.

Quote:
If you've ever met a, what I like to call, "hard-core Catholic" I bet you've heard that Catholicism is the "right" religion, and that you need to convert in order to save your eternal soul.
Being a Catholic in a very Catholic family and growing up in a very protestant community, the ONLY people from whom my family and I ever heard that were my Baptist friends and neighbors, and we heard it a LOT. It's been my experience that Catholics are FAR more laid back about that stuff than Baptists.

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Well that's just crap
Nice to see how you can tell God what's what.

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She has an asshole, in other pics you can see a diaper taped to her dead twin's back.
Sentences I thought I never would have to type.
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Old 02-12-2007, 02:35 PM   #50
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

Hmmm religion debate.

The question is not the homosexuality of the commercial but rather the extremes of the homosexuality.

I know that not ALL homosexuals are femine acting/sounding. But if I had to put money on if they were or weren't, I'd say they were, which is what the commercial was saying.

Ultimately, IMO, jewp said it best that the majority doesn't matter much anymore. We are a society of helping the minority and "insignificant" because they know how to make the most noise about it.

It's extremely harsh and judgemental yes, but I believe in sterotypes and majority actions. Yes there are exceptions that will get you into a mess sometimes, but for the most part, they don't.
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Old 02-12-2007, 02:41 PM   #51
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

The thing about homosexuals being manly or not is that one of the most identifying characteristics of a man is that he has sex with women.

Take that away and yes, you're less manly (also, ckj, aren't you a self-proclaimed "fob"? =) ).

But what's the big deal about that? Generally being accepted is either not a problem or the main problem for most homosexuals, so worrying about whether or not you're considered manly doesn't seem like a pressing issue.

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She has an asshole, in other pics you can see a diaper taped to her dead twin's back.
Sentences I thought I never would have to type.
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Old 02-12-2007, 02:42 PM   #52
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Guido- SMACKDOWN (so un-CT of me...)

Wlfwind, your a wise man, respect to you. I'm sorry if I sounded like I was disrespecting Slips religion, my words can just come out as confrontational on here when I don't mean them to be...
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Old 02-12-2007, 03:11 PM   #53
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ok well i read all the posts in here and they are all very interesting. I am a Catholic and i have been taught that 2 men or women together is wrong. God put us on this earth to reproduce(thats what marriage is suppose to be for reproducing he said). Now when either 2 men or women are together they cannot do that together and if they perhaps want a child they either have to find a sperm or egg donor or they have to adopt a child and thats not how God wanted it to be. He wanted it to be where a man and a women love each other they should get married then have sex and reproduce. I havent seen any posts on this theory. We are not supose to have sex with another person untill we are married and abortion,condoms and anything else that could prevent a women from getting pregnent I thought that God saw that as wrong because we are preventing life *the ultimate creation*. So do I believe that it is wrong for 2 men or women to be together yes, unmaly no, a sin of course. I also believe if their was a scale that it would be one of the biggest sins someone could commit in thier life because we are preventing a new life from coming into this world. Now could this or murder be forgivable I am not the one to be able to answer that only God can answer that when you die. So let us live our life in happiness and await for our time to come where we will ascend into heaven and be closer to God *the ulmighty*.
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Old 02-12-2007, 04:03 PM   #54
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eVo, I only have two questions for you. What if being gay makes someone happy, because it's accepting who they are and liking themselves? Should we condone that because it's a sin? In that case you're going against your statement that we should all strive for happiness. If you could please answer, I'd really appreciate your response.
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Old 02-12-2007, 04:26 PM   #55
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

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I havent seen any posts on this theory.
That's because it's not at all germane to the thread. You said you read all the posts, but did you catch the OP?

Admittedly, two posts ago of mine I was a little off-topic myself, but let's try to stick to the scope of the OP and not turn this into an "Is homosexuality okay?" thread.

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Sentences I thought I never would have to type.
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Old 02-12-2007, 04:39 PM   #56
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condoms
Hmm that brings to mind another debate topic which I will imminently be making....
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Old 02-12-2007, 05:17 PM   #57
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eVo, I only have two questions for you. What if being gay makes someone happy, because it's accepting who they are and liking themselves? Should we condone that because it's a sin? In that case you're going against your statement that we should all strive for happiness. If you could please answer, I'd really appreciate your response.
Ok yes if being gay is what makes some people happy that is not a problem i am just saying that yes it is a sin to be. Now I know for alot of gay people it is hard to be open about their sexual orientation because most people do not accept it. But I dont think any1 should keep how they feel about people from ay1 because if people cantaccept who you are then they really arent your friends. No we should not condone it because its a sin nor shall we allow it to be okay for 2 male or females to get married reason being is because it is a sin and if we did allow same sex people to get married the church would be hypocritical and then people would look down on the church for allowing a sin to happen when they could have prevented it. Does this make it clearer for you now Wlfwnd91?


sherbtail can you please but the link into here for the thread you are going to create for me thank you.
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Old 02-12-2007, 07:05 PM   #58
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

A couple of things:
1. Just because it makes you happy doesnt mean you should do it or that it isnt a sin. Im sure that for some people torture and murder makes them happy but that doesnt make it any less serious.
2. I agree that with evo in the fact that God gave us the ability to reproduce with the opposite gender and we are going against nature itself to be gay but i dont agree that it is the MOST serious of sins.
3. If you are wondering why God would only favor one religion and only they can return to his presence then you should look the Mormon church. We do baptisms for the dead because as it is said in the bible, no man can enter into the kingdom of heaven if they havent been baptised. For those who hadnt had the opportunity to be baptised, we stand in their place and perform the ordinance and from there they can choose in the spirit world whether to accept the service or not. Also, we believe that what most people refer to "Hevean and Hell" is what we call spirit paradise and spirit prison. People that have not accepted the gospel or havent had the opportunity go to spirit prison (and its not torture) where they are preached the true gospel by the missionaries (so to say) in spirit paradise. Then the millenium of christs rule on earth happens and then final judgement where you are placed into 1 of 3 kingdoms of glory.
4. Homosexuality is the opposite of what manly represents, just accept it and go on with life.
5. Of course you should not judge another and you should be nice to everyone. However, the way i see it is that the more time you spend around sin, the more willing you are to give into it. The only reason i think we shun homosexuality so much is that we do not want to be condemned to being worn down and eventually giving into sin. If you ask why we hate it so much then just think about it, we also shun smoking and drinking, and adultery. The only reason people seem to think this is more reasonable is because it is bad for everyone on an earthly mortal level.
6. I respect the ideas of all religions because (as has been mentioned) most all of them promote service and living that resembles the life of christ. However, the only reason i fight it so hard is because fact is to me some of it flat out is not correct doctrine and even the smallest divergence from the true gospel will lead further and further off the straight and narrow path as history has shown.
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Old 02-12-2007, 11:22 PM   #59
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

I'm not offended at the fact that gays are stereotyped as being unmanly (look at the media, Will&Grace, Queer eye for the Straight Guy, among otherse...). I'm offended at the fact that they could make a mockery of it and think it was ok. Sure, I thought it was funny. But it was still offensive, and it obviously was to the point where someone had to go and get it pulled. It's not that I want homosexuality censored, it's what people wanted ME TO DO when I came out. "Cameron, we don't care. We don't need to know that." I got those bull**** responses from kids. And do you know why? Ignorance. Ignorance in the American society as I like to see it. It might be a bunch of crap in your eyes but that's what I think. Corruption of everyone in the country. And the main source of this corruption is media. The second would probably be religion.

I don't mean to sound blasphemous but it is very hard not to because of all of the holes I see in Christianity. SURE homosexuality is a sin. I agree with it. I'm fine knowing that. But a sin is a sin. I said this before. Murder is no worse then lust. Homosexuality is no worse then cussing or using the Lord's name in vain. Every sin is equal. The thing that ticks me off about the Chrisitan institution in general is that they elevate certain "sins" in order to gain power or to gain support from people.

Why do people really hate on gays? Just answer that. Do YOU hate gays? And for what reason. You can't tell me "I'M MAD BECAUSE THEY CAN'T MAKE BABIES AND THUS THEY ARE WASTED POTENTIAL." If anything, you should be happy there are gay people who can't reproduce, especially since there is a problem with overpopulation. But you tend to overlook the logical reasons and just go "Because it says in the Bible." Nowhere does it say in the Bible that it is wrong to be homosexual. NOWHERE. Look it up. It just says it is a sin to have sex with the same gender. Am I having sex? No. Am I sinning? No.

It's the same thing as saying "I'M THINKING OF MURDERING SOMEONE AND THEREFORE I AM A SINNER AND I'M GOING TO HELL." If that was the case, everyone would be sinning too many times to count a DAY. That's unreasonable. Being gay and being automatically labeled for something I have no control over is even more unreasonable.

I'm going to bring it up again. BEING GAY IS A CHOICE BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH [insert bull**** here]. Do you know that for a fact? Please tell me WHAT PERSON WOULD CHOOSE TO BE OPPRESSED IN SOCIETY? Tell me a person who would willingly ask for more drama and pressure in their lives and like to make their life more difficult. If you can answer that, you are beyond me. Because I am a homosexual. I don't want to be this way. But I'm happy with who I am and that's what matters. And in all honesty, if God doesn't accept me for the mere fact of a CIRCUMSTANCE, I have no respect for Him. At all. Zero.

And yes I am a fob. And I'm not the most manly person but hey! I'm happy with who I am and no institution is going to bring me down.
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Old 02-14-2007, 05:31 PM   #60
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Default Re: Snickers commercial controversy

Quote:
Originally Posted by ckj846 View Post

Why do people really hate on gays? Just answer that. Do YOU hate gays? And for what reason. You can't tell me "I'M MAD BECAUSE THEY CAN'T MAKE BABIES AND THUS THEY ARE WASTED POTENTIAL." If anything, you should be happy there are gay people who can't reproduce, especially since there is a problem with overpopulation. But you tend to overlook the logical reasons and just go "Because it says in the Bible." Nowhere does it say in the Bible that it is wrong to be homosexual. NOWHERE. Look it up. It just says it is a sin to have sex with the same gender. Am I having sex? No. Am I sinning? No.

It's the same thing as saying "I'M THINKING OF MURDERING SOMEONE AND THEREFORE I AM A SINNER AND I'M GOING TO HELL." If that was the case, everyone would be sinning too many times to count a DAY. That's unreasonable. Being gay and being automatically labeled for something I have no control over is even more unreasonable.
O_o
First off, i dislike the gay community because being homosexual is an abomination against Gods creation and reason for gender. It is like they openly mock the traditional way of life where men like women and vise versa and i am not one to stand for mockery.
Second of all, being tempted to do something is not the same as dwelling on a thought. Being tempted to kill someone is not a sin in itself as long as you dismiss the thought and not continue thinking and contemplating it in which case you would be sinning. Cause if you think about it you are saying it is just as bad to think on the spur of the moment, "ahh, i wanna kill that kid" as it is to sit there and plan out in your mind how you are going to go through with it and imagine their pain as you think about it? You've gotta set limits.
Its not that i have a problem with people who cant control it, its more like i have a problem with people saying they cant because A: they think its alright so they dont really wanna change, B: they are an attention whore, or C: because they like being rebels against nature in the modern flow of things (obviously an overstatement, dont get all tightly wound now). So sure, be gay, i just think its insulting for everyone to think its alright.
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Last edited by GuidoHunter; 02-14-2007 at 05:42 PM.. Reason: We'll have none of that.
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