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#141 |
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shots FIRED
Global Moderator, User Support, Judge
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Ok I'll admit that although their demands are really stupid, their frustration is quite understandable. The issue is that such a large group of protesters cannot express their goals in a coherent way.
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#142 |
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Forum User
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i am speaking to you as an individual
what you seem to be incapable of registering, reincarnate, is that this occupation does not have grievances on one front. the grievances of this movement are extremely broad, ranging from education, oil, legislation, home-ownership, agriculture, ethics, war, etc. there is not a list long enough to state all the grievances of the 99% of the US population, so quit expecting one on that note, i would like to point out that the increase in knowledge spread via the internet has allowed the general population to become more aware in a worldly sense. for comparison: a person now has the capability to read articles from any number of sources worldwide via rss feeds like google reader, as opposed to being limited to the local newspaper and maybe the new york times or wall street journal 10 or so years ago. that said, this protest is by far the first one to gain the support of a large amount of conscious internet users. and in all honesty i dont feel like explaining the way things are decided because i feel like we are on complete different wavelengths. you seem to be urging me to vote, when all who even has a chance of winning is whoever has the highest-funded PAC. i cant afford to buy my own politicians, so now what the **** do you suggest i do with your 51% majority vote bullshit? why should the other 49% be dragged through shit for the next 4 years, or for incumbents, however long they maintain just the tiniest majority? to solve this flaw in policy, there is a process that they do not teach in school. it is new and it takes time to learn, but the end, actions are not passed without 9/10 consensus. if you cant wrap your mind around this fact, which i assure you is true no matter how many "stupid" protesters you meet, then i have no hope for your comprehension of anything i have to say. for instance, "would we like to allocate resources to such-and-such committee?" would be voted upon, and not passed unless there is 9/10 approval. "do we want to march at 6:00pm?" would be voted on and not passed unless there is 9/10 approval. by now you should be asking what we do when something doesnt reach 9/10 consensus. if youre not, like i said, it is because you are on an entirely different wavelength. when 9/10 consensus is not reached, anyone who is opposed to the proposal gets a chance to speak via people's mic. hand signals are used to express how you feel about what is being said. this is what people's mic looks like anywho, via people's mic, any one who opposes what is being said is given the chance to speak on people's mic for 2 minutes (thats our limit here, i'd imagine on wall street its even shorter.) the fact that messages take so long to relay allows you to actually think about what is being said, and knowing that you WILL NOT be given the chance to speak until that person is done speaking, your decisions will be much more thought-out. you can not interrupt peoples mic because you will just be drowned out. as you can imagine, these meetings can be excruciatingly long. but in the end, those who dont mind dont matter. like i said already, whoever the **** shows up to these protests. it would help if everybody were to say "i speak as an individual" like i stated at the beginning of my post before they go off babbling about why they're there. everybody has their own reasons, and as polarized as everyone is these days they'll either agree or disagree with THAT INDIVIDUAL. the sum is greater than its parts kinda thing. and dude would you just listen to yourself? youre calling a guy who got run over and arrested for getting run over (the most innocent that cop gets is if it were a genuine accident, but then why the **** would they arrest the guy?) would you want to get hit by a god damn pig on a scooter and then dragged across the ground and arrested? you show no sympathy, and i am seriously disturbed by that. maybe all the $$$ turned you cold, bro in my city when some people got arrested the cops felt bad for doing it. thats because texas pays officers and firefighters like shit. does it make you wonder who pays the nypd so much that they infringe on these people's first amendment rights? http://www.jpmorganchase.com/corpora...icle/ny-13.htm theres a good start. is it right of me to say that this is exactly a bad thing? no, i like the idea that a giant corporation would donate millions of dollars to a public service. i think more of that should happen. what im afraid of is, though, the fact that maybe these protesters are being intimidated by the police because the businesses are threatening to cut off millions upon millions of dollars to their force if they dont get them out of wall st. i refuse to believe that all of these people were arrested and beaten because they were asking for it, because i've seen people get arrested for much less, e.g. a sit-in. every time i see these videos though, i see people being blindly assaulted. not one of the videos i've seen is how you depict them, so either the "attention-whore" ones you see are discarded while the truly shocking stay at the top, or you and i think on an entirely different wavelength. i think the latter. you say it is so simple as a vote for the right person, but when only half the population decides who that person is, the other half gets ****ed. it is very simple. |
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#143 | ||
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Senior Member
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Quote:
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Last edited by MrGiggles; 10-19-2011 at 02:44 AM.. |
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#144 |
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FFR Player
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Thread tl;dr- a bunch of hippies protesting about money.
O. |
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#145 |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Dec 2008
Age: 30
Posts: 6,205
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occupy white noise st
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#146 |
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x'); DROP TABLE FFR;--
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,334
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MrGiggles: Yeah, but the sad truth is that it's not far off. The kind of logic you'll get out of many of these protestors is pretty much the same crap you'll get from Aldentron up there. If you get a chance, go see the protest for yourself. It's embarrassing. There are a lot of ignorant, dogmatic, bigoted people out there. That's not to say there aren't protestors who understand that the nation is a mess and the gov't/financial system had something to do with it, but many others take it to the fringe.
Aldentron: Yes, the grievances are broad. I never implied otherwise. It's still a disorganized mess. Yes, knowledge is accessible via the internet, but that won't stop confirmation bias. You can find any news source out there that will support whatever bullshit view you want. You still need a basis of understanding and a knowledge of demonstrable evidence to intuit things for yourself and actually figure out where reality is best explained, and where people are just feeding you ignorance and fearmongering. "maybe all the $$$ turned you cold, bro" No, what turned me off are his obvious exaggerations and poor acting. http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runnin..._man_run_o.php http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/..._scooter_.html Besides, anyone with an understanding of weight physics would simply facepalm here. The guy was an obvious fraud just trying to start shit against the police and play the oppressed victim against the big bad police force. Anyways, I'm not joking. Go look at the protest yourself. Literally go to NYC. The only people getting pegged by the police, in large part, are idiots trying to be antagonistic. You can deny this all you want, but I actually friggin' live here, so pardon me if I'm not going to take the word of some ignorant dude speculating from miles away using nothing but shaky videos that hardly show the entire story. Some of the cops are getting a bit pissy, yes, but it's only because the crowd is like a huge mass of trolls. None of them are trustworthy and many of them are trying to play martyr/hero. Lots of weirdos here. "you say it is so simple as a vote for the right person, but when only half the population decides who that person is, the other half gets ****ed. it is very simple." This is so ignorant of how our entire voting process works that I'm not sure if I should even waste the time. Last edited by Reincarnate; 10-19-2011 at 01:17 PM.. |
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#147 |
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x'); DROP TABLE FFR;--
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,334
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#148 |
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I am the liquor
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Where ever evil lurks
Age: 31
Posts: 707
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I was about to post something, but forgot what it was once I saw this:
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#149 |
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Forum User
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ok how about this, since i'm so ignorant of how our entire voting process works, here is a simple work sheet i want YOU (reincarnate) to fill out, since youll obviously get it all correct and hopefully open some ears up.
what is lobbying? what is a synonym for lobbying? (hint it starts with b and ends with ribery) what is a PAC? what is a "connected PAC?" what is a "super PAC?" what is the limit for the amount of money a super PAC can raise? do you think it is fair for entire corporations, to donate more money to a PAC than the average citizen makes in a whole presidential term (4 years?) why or why not? how are laws passed? what is the main reason why laws DON'T pass? what is a democracy? (yes i realize that the USA is not a democracy. that is the point) how have you answered all these questions accurately without feeling completely ****ing disgusted with the way this country works? |
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#150 |
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missa in h-moll
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: nyc
Age: 25
Posts: 3,983
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This Thread OWNES
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#151 |
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FFR Player
Join Date: Sep 2005
Age: 29
Posts: 4,189
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Aldretron, you say the US isn't a democracy? If people wanted to they'd vote independent assuming you're talking about it being a two party system.
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#152 |
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Forum User
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the usa is a republic. look it up for yourself if you want. be aware that there is a difference between a democratic republic and democracy.
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#153 | |
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x'); DROP TABLE FFR;--
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,334
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Quote:
First recent example of this stupidity off the top of my head stream-of-conscious style: There was a Republican debate recently. Cain claimed that government bureaucracy would have killed him while he was seeking cancer treatment if the affordable healthcare act had been passed when he was diagnosed; the audience applauded. Huntsman presented a reasonable solution to amend the act, but nobody in the audience went for it. Bachmann repeated her unfounded HPV claim, and the audience applauded again. This is the kind of shit I am talking about. http://www.cnn.com/2011/09/27/opinio...rnment-voters/ This interview, in particular, is spot-on regarding this point. http://www.balloon-juice.com/2011/10/10/long-division/ "The greatest hoax of the last couple of decades has been the ability of the right wing to co-opt members of the struggling lower middle class and lower class and pretend they speak for them while enacting policies that enable the super-rich. They’ve used wedge issues like gay marriage and abortion and the baby Jeebus to alienate folks from their own economic interests, feeding them a steady diet of hatred of minorites, the educated, science, and, well, reality to create a voting block of people so guided by hatred of the “other” that they would crawl over broken glass to cut their nose off to spite their face." Again, like I said, if you want this to change, you need a smarter goddamn nation that will stop lining the pockets of complete retards. |
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#154 |
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Forum User
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so what do you suggest i do about that? why should i wait for these ignorant ****s to ramble on about their petty morality arguments when there are real issues around? the general action to execute when you think society is ****ed up is to protest, so that's what I'M doing. i don't care how many floppers and jackasses you find on youtube. i will always be an individual before being a part of any group.
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#155 |
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x'); DROP TABLE FFR;--
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,334
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Promote education and spread good information. Make difficult concepts easy to understand. Make sure you aren't spreading ignorance and fearmongering. Research.
Protesting is only effective when you're getting people talking about the right things and asking the right questions and making the best choices when it comes to voting. If you're just protesting to say that you're angry, or wasting time bickering with police and trying to incite a scuffle, you're not really accomplishing anything. I'm not being facetious -- the best thing you can do is educate yourself. In turn, you help educate others and help bring about change. Write your representatives often and give clear, concise, cogent arguments. Vote responsibly. When you spend money, figure out who it is you're ultimately supporting. If you're a God-following anti-evolution crank who thinks lowering taxes on the rich is a good idea, you're part of the problem -- and if you're not sure why you're part of the problem, then you're illustrating why the problem is so hard to fix. The OWS movement is well-intentioned, but it's being diluted by tards and preventing it from being a much more substantial movement than it currently is. |
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#156 |
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Forum User
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perhaps you will be glad to hear that the fort worth occupy is based on information. i have held and continue to hold infoshops about the petroleum and pharmaceutical industries, other people do infoshops on the agriculture, war, education, etc. industries. everyone is invited to contribute their own information but we urge people to be weary of the information they hear because it may or may not be true. you get a lot of people who bring their bullshit blogs, but its obvious when some one actually did their research (e.g. students read their research papers concerning these subjects.) we also are working on organizing a people's library. dallas already has one.
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#157 |
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x'); DROP TABLE FFR;--
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,334
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This is ****ing ridiculous, I must say. I have a friend who lives in Oakland and he was able to confirm for me that... it was pretty much a warzone over there. |
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#158 |
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FFR Simfile Author
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interesting. That was an Iraq war veteran?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/1...n_1033159.html |
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#159 |
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Frau Bow
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Kansas
Age: 30
Posts: 9,200
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I think people are forgetting the number one rule of campers. If you leave them alone they will get bored and go away. Giving them so much attention with the police and media is just giving them what they want. Oh well, guess that means everyone is happy.
Not like you can really solve "political corruption" by standing around. |
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#160 |
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Banned
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: on the farm
Posts: 1,135
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they need to take a look at how citizens of libya handle business
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