"Why should I never buy a Mac?"

[Spenner]

Graphic designers seem to lean to the Macs because it's a bit preorganized for all of that jazz. You can accomplish the same things on a PC, you just can't be dumb as dust. Or just using common sense-- if you have a font that needs to move to a mac to be printed, create outlines for the damn text so they don't print whatever you sent them with Comic Sans or whatever. And of course just always make sure your files are 100% cross compatible-- if you send an illustrator file over to a printing company and a layer has been rearranged because of some ****ty glitch then you're screwed, so I guess just be extra careful in that aspect of things.

But other than printing and maybe a cleaner organization of a much more limited aspect of computing, I'm gonna go with a PC. Maybe I'll get myself a cheap Mac later on to double check the final outcome of a project before it's printed. Meh.

They're not terrible machines by any means, they're just not a necessity over a PC.

Originally Posted by who_cares973

no right click seriously turns me off so much

At my school, one particular lab actually has right click mouses installed, which is really handy. Sometimes some of the features don't feel right on the Mac, like the right click, having the MinimizeMaximizeClose buttons on the left side of the window, not being able to minimize all windows with a quick keyboard shortcut, meh. If I HAD to deal with it working at a design shop or something I'd be okay with it, but on my own I want to be completely comfortable and efficient.

[fido123]

OrganisM basically summed it up. Thread over.

[Kage06]

Gah... APPLE.

I'm a graphic/music guy. I run on Windows with a PC.

I dislike Apple for their fashion approach.

I'd like to think I'm an Audio tech type of guy, and one thing I can't stand is the Ipod for the sound quality. It isn't up to par with many players out there.

I'm barely getting by using my Android phone as a source for music at the moment whilst I buy a new FLAC player. No bass what so ever, for me anyway.
The only thing it does do that my old MP3 player couldn't do is play module files.

[OrganisM]

Originally Posted by ninjaKIWI

I'm a ****ing dumbass, dude. The reason my argument was so horrible was because it was supposed to be a near-perfect comparison to a retard that I was doing a horse on. I spent literally ten minutes knobslobbing. Nice raging erection.

EDIT: This is my build, just for your information. Except now I've added this for my boot drive, and my brain isn't there because I never had one.

EDIT2: Like urrrrrrgh I'm a whiny twatmuffin I AM THE KING OF AWESUM.

But you yourself said you don't know the specs of several of the key parts. And you still didn't include the OS or a disk drive. And since we're going by "getting something comparable for half the price", does this rig include any support? No, it's OEM. Does it come with an OS? No. Does your rig come with a monitor as an all-in-one unit? Nope. Whoops. You're forgetting the form-factor. These two systems aren't even remotely comparable. You would have looked less stupid customizing a Sony Vaio, which makes the exact point you were trying to make and is an all-in-one unit with manufacturer support. But sure, I guess a ghetto home build with no OS or disk drive or monitor and no support totally equals an all-in-one unit with a suite of built-in software built by a reputable company with tons of support and compatible products. That's a 27-inch monitor, you douche.

And time is no excuse. I gave you those instructions in far less than 10 minutes. You omitted a number of parts which would have made it at least a semi-valid comparison.

Your other build reaches the level of "acceptable", but that's mainly because it seems you're as much of a Corsair whore as I am. This is commendable.

[MrGiggles]

Originally Posted by WTFBrandon

Organism, you could have summed it up and just said MACs are best for Photo, Video, Audio editing. That's what I use mine for.

what the

I just spent like an hour combing over his post and have decided that you read what you wanted to read and not actually what he wrote

also MAC is a networking term but now I'm just being silly

not being able to minimize all windows with a quick keyboard shortcut

apple-h

EDIT: actually this just minimizes the current application nvm. I guess if you hit it 3-4 times it does the same thing.

[ninjaKIWI]

Originally Posted by OrganisM

But you yourself said you don't know the specs of several of the key parts. And you still didn't include the OS or a disk drive. And since we're going by "getting something comparable for half the price", does this rig include any support? No, it's OEM. Does it come with an OS? No. Does your rig come with a monitor as an all-in-one unit? Nope. Whoops. You're forgetting the form-factor. These two systems aren't even remotely comparable. You would have looked less stupid customizing a Sony Vaio, which makes the exact point you were trying to make and is an all-in-one unit with manufacturer support. But sure, I guess a ghetto home build with no OS or disk drive or monitor and no support totally equals an all-in-one unit with a suite of built-in software built by a reputable company with tons of support and compatible products. That's a 27-inch monitor, you douche.

And time is no excuse. I gave you those instructions in far less than 10 minutes. You omitted a number of parts which would have made it at least a semi-valid comparison.

Your other build reaches the level of "acceptable", but that's mainly because it seems you're as much of a Corsair whore as I am. This is commendable.

I could have sworn I'd said something about a monitor. I forgot about a disk drive because I haven't had one for about a year, so I guess you're right there. It's not all-in-one because I'm trying to advocate custom-built instead of pre-made bull****. It's a completely valid comparison because they're mostly the exact same parts. Slap on 250-300 dollars to account for a monitor/disk drive and it's all the same stuff. Even with that, you're saving over two thousand dollars.

And to be honest, who pays for an OS any more? I have USB key whose only purpose is W7 Ultimate.

I didn't omit any parts that would have made it a good comparison, apart from the monitor and disk drive.

[OrganisM]

If you include an OS, monitor, and disk drive, the price is no longer half of the iMac. A monitor equivalent to the 27" iMac's monitor will often times cost more than $250-300. And even then, it's still not an all-in-one unit with support. Why do I say the OS is a must? Because you're comparing it to a system that provides an OS and is one of the primary reasons you'd buy such a product. If you're looking to custom build, you don't want to purchase an OS, and you don't want an all-in-one unit, then the Mac is not for you. But for those who do want these things, a manufactured all-in-one is a far better option.

It is not a valid comparison because it matters who is buying the product. The average consumer is not going to want to do all of these things, and for many it is not worth the hassle. If you say everybody should build their own, then by that token you should become a master carpenter and build your own house, a master shoemaker and make your own shoes, and a master mechanic to make your own car. You CHOOSE to build the system because hardware interests you. Not everybody wants to go knee-deep into spending hours and hours researching and making costly mistakes when they can just plunk down some cash and get what they want. Many of us actually have jobs or payments to make or kids to feed. That means that not all of us can spend all of our time on a whim designing something that is not a necessity. This is precisely why there are experts who build the hardware for the dummies.

Should people be more computer literate? Definitely. Computers are becoming more and more prevalent and crucial to the inner workings of our society, and the backbones of our infrastructures. Soon changing a computer part will be like changing a tire on a car is today. But once again, there is a difference between changing my tires/oil and buying a chassis and filling it out with parts. This takes time, energy, concentration, and skill. Quite frankly, not everybody is going to be an expert. So for those, the most important thing aside from cost/product is ease of use. When I got my MacBook Air, it came in a shiny, pretty package. I opened it, and everything was arranged neatly. A few crisp booklets with easy-to-read instructions, and a couple of neatly packaged cables. I plugged it in, and it worked like magic. That is the experience that matters the most.

I remember two years ago when I spent $3500 on parts to build a hardcore gaming and music production system. I ordered from Newegg and got the parts. I set it up, and it failed to boot. I contacted EVGA and spent hours and hours trying to figure out the problem (and I'm an experienced builder). I tried everything. Diagnostics of every kind. Every time I called a support line, some Indian guy responded and then asked me a few stupid questions before telling me to RMA ****ing everything. And my music production classes were starting in a week. They finally released a BIOS update, and with a successful flash I was able to boot properly and configure everything. But then a windows update screwed everything up for me. Had to rebuild the registry and then spend a ridiculous amount of time (3+ hours) on the phone with Microsoft to deal with their back-end **** (which it turns out I knew more than they did anyways), and of course they were unintelligible most of the time as well. Then after I got everything working, my RME FireFace 800 kept stuttering on my audio, and this was some of the most powerful hardware available. Finally, I switched mobo's (still didn't work), switched to 32mb cache hdd (those were a bit new back then), and upgraded to Vista, which had better MME/ASIO drives than XP. Then it FINALLY worked.

Keep in mind that this entire experience was one where I'd checked compatibility for everything, went through every step possible, and knew what I was doing. Can you imagine such a thing for a newbie? When you buy OEM, you are on your own. This can be a nightmare from time to time. For me, it is worth the risk because I have the technical skill and training, and the freedoms custom building brings me are quite important to me. For somebody who just wants to surf the web and watch movies, play music, and look at pictures of their kids, all that matters is a solid product that is easy to use. The iMac definitely fulfills those requirements, and if you have a problem with OSX or the pricing, Sony has an all-in-one Vaio that is far cheaper and has many of the same design traits and comes with XP and a host of Sony's products that work well with the Vaio. The other manufacturers also have all-in-one units, but I don't recommend them.

/AUGH

[Reincarnate]

Just get a beastly desktop like mine and you can do anything with it.

[OrganisM]

I would like to see a quality part open-source competitor that works with both hardware/software. But no proper solution exists yet. I think if Microsoft works on building a brand identity and all of the manufacturers work to lay some groundwork for certain standards, then the PC will end up turning Apple's products back into a niche market. But the PC market is disorganized as ever, and so Apple will continue to take advantage of that. Which is good, because competition drives innovation.

[OrganisM]

Originally Posted by MrGiggles

also MAC is a networking term but now I'm just being silly.

Don't be such a CAD.

[ghost-]

Originally Posted by OrganisM

If you include an OS, monitor, and disk drive, the price is no longer half of the iMac. A monitor equivalent to the 27" iMac's monitor will often times cost more than $250-300. And even then, it's still not an all-in-one unit with support. Why do I say the OS is a must? Because you're comparing it to a system that provides an OS and is one of the primary reasons you'd buy such a product. If you're looking to custom build, you don't want to purchase an OS, and you don't want an all-in-one unit, then the Mac is not for you. But for those who do want these things, a manufactured all-in-one is a far better option.

It is not a valid comparison because it matters who is buying the product. The average consumer is not going to want to do all of these things, and for many it is not worth the hassle. If you say everybody should build their own, then by that token you should become a master carpenter and build your own house, a master shoemaker and make your own shoes, and a master mechanic to make your own car. You CHOOSE to build the system because hardware interests you. Not everybody wants to go knee-deep into spending hours and hours researching and making costly mistakes when they can just plunk down some cash and get what they want. Many of us actually have jobs or payments to make or kids to feed. That means that not all of us can spend all of our time on a whim designing something that is not a necessity. This is precisely why there are experts who build the hardware for the dummies.

Should people be more computer literate? Definitely. Computers are becoming more and more prevalent and crucial to the inner workings of our society, and the backbones of our infrastructures. Soon changing a computer part will be like changing a tire on a car is today. But once again, there is a difference between changing my tires/oil and buying a chassis and filling it out with parts. This takes time, energy, concentration, and skill. Quite frankly, not everybody is going to be an expert. So for those, the most important thing aside from cost/product is ease of use. When I got my MacBook Air, it came in a shiny, pretty package. I opened it, and everything was arranged neatly. A few crisp booklets with easy-to-read instructions, and a couple of neatly packaged cables. I plugged it in, and it worked like magic. That is the experience that matters the most.

I remember two years ago when I spent $3500 on parts to build a hardcore gaming and music production system. I ordered from Newegg and got the parts. I set it up, and it failed to boot. I contacted EVGA and spent hours and hours trying to figure out the problem (and I'm an experienced builder). I tried everything. Diagnostics of every kind. Every time I called a support line, some Indian guy responded and then asked me a few stupid questions before telling me to RMA ****ing everything. And my music production classes were starting in a week. They finally released a BIOS update, and with a successful flash I was able to boot properly and configure everything. But then a windows update screwed everything up for me. Had to rebuild the registry and then spend a ridiculous amount of time (3+ hours) on the phone with Microsoft to deal with their back-end **** (which it turns out I knew more than they did anyways), and of course they were unintelligible most of the time as well. Then after I got everything working, my RME FireFace 800 kept stuttering on my audio, and this was some of the most powerful hardware available. Finally, I switched mobo's (still didn't work), switched to 32mb cache hdd (those were a bit new back then), and upgraded to Vista, which had better MME/ASIO drives than XP. Then it FINALLY worked.

Keep in mind that this entire experience was one where I'd checked compatibility for everything, went through every step possible, and knew what I was doing. Can you imagine such a thing for a newbie? When you buy OEM, you are on your own. This can be a nightmare from time to time. For me, it is worth the risk because I have the technical skill and training, and the freedoms custom building brings me are quite important to me. For somebody who just wants to surf the web and watch movies, play music, and look at pictures of their kids, all that matters is a solid product that is easy to use. The iMac definitely fulfills those requirements, and if you have a problem with OSX or the pricing, Sony has an all-in-one Vaio that is far cheaper and has many of the same design traits and comes with XP and a host of Sony's products that work well with the Vaio. The other manufacturers also have all-in-one units, but I don't recommend them.

/AUGH

dude WTF

[OrganisM]

Originally Posted by ghost-

dude WTF

ya, iknorite? amirite? HA HA