The legalisation of marijuana

[bender5]

This is a subject that has been highly debated. The topic would be the legalization of Marijuana. I don't want this to be some "OMG DUDE SMOKKKEEE WEEEED" thread. This is aimed to be a high profile debate. It is a most serious topic that I have actually put in quite a few hours of research into. I wrote a paper on the pro's/con's of legalizing marijuana, and my teacher said although that this is a highly controversial topic it was probably the best supported and written paper in the class. I myself do smoke marijuana from time to time, but this isn't just some i want to smoke every day because I can kind of thing. I want some serious responses as to what people think on this topic, and I will be weighing in quite frequently to give my opinions. So all of you thinkers out there, I want you to react to the situation at hand. Would it be a good or bad idea to have marijuana legalized?

[arsonistsgetallthegirls]

I'm glad someone made this into a new CT thread, the old ones are ancient.

Though I do smoke Marijuana from time to time, I believe full-legalization could be a bad thing for smokers, who are really the only people aside from doctors in support of medical marijuana. For starters, legalization will lead to taxation. Though the new prices will be cheaper than street prices, you can bet the plant will be lower grade. What's even worse is there have already been cases in Amsterdam of cafés cutting their marijuana with an unknown green substance that has no chemical or physical relation with any form of cannabis. While searching or the link to this claim, i came across another disturbing story, only this time from a dealer's perspective rather than a buisness oriented one. This only further proves a media should be reached before it impacts peoples health. (http://www.drugs-forum.co.uk/forum/s...d.php?p=360544)

Warning, the link may contain inappropriate language, drug references, and generally nasty forum stuff. (no pornography)
I personaly don't care, but I know some are offended by the subject matters discussed. Click at your own risk.

Medical Marijuana seems to be the best option for smokers and patients. High grade plants bred specifically for their healing properties don't cost that much more than the ridiculous street prices some people are forced to pay to get low grade in smaller amounts. Drug deals are also avoided, leaving out hard drugs entirely.

The best median between full blown legalization and strictly medical use would be partial legalization forbidding the sale of marijuana by anyone but a licensed practician, but allowing the consumption and possession of marijuana. Those who don't need it for medical reasons will see no change for the worse, and avoid legal penalties for a ludicrous "crime".

[bender5]

Your post really intrigued me. I myself have never thought of a median in between the two choices of completely legal, and totally illegal. The idea of a licensed seller is also a very good one. In my studies I had summarized it to come down to the quality being regulated then taxed by the FDA. Which would not only help the economy, but it would help with regulation and cut down on things randomly being laced or cut with various fillers.

What I liked most about you post was the fact that it basically becomes Amsterdam. In the way that the laws work. In an ideal world this would improve quite a few things. Including the fact that jail trafficking would be severely reduced in both adults and teens as well.

[tyl110]

With legalization, the currently "illegal" sellers would probably lose much of their business, leaving them with less profit, therefore driving many away from selling. Then, the higher quality, "legal" weed would become more prevalent. Net result: medicinal users get high quality weed, druggies get cut off from a destructive habit, and part-time users can fit into the middle.

[bender5]

I don't understand your post. You don't really seem to go with anything that anyone has already posted.

However, what I can gather is that you say people won't sell weed or smoke it. If Marijuana becomes legal no one will smoke it besides people that need to?

[arsonistsgetallthegirls]

Originally Posted by bender5

I don't understand your post. You don't really seem to go with anything that anyone has already posted.

However, what I can gather is that you say people won't sell weed or smoke it. If Marijuana becomes legal no one will smoke it besides people that need to?

I think he's saying that by legalizing cannabis, dealers will be put out of business, which prevents users of hard drugs (or otherwise) from buying cannabis illegally. It's all but difficult to obtain medical marijuana via prescription given the area.

[blackbuterfly451]

Personally, I think that having legal or licensed dealers would make the situation worse. As such is the situation with doctors.. there would still be illegal dealers. Marijuana should be fully legalized; if it was then you wouldn't have to worry about quality because you could grow your own.

Or maybe there'd be more of these:

(http://www.thrillist.com/archives/20...dwilshire.html)

[arsonistsgetallthegirls]

Originally Posted by blackbuterfly451

Personally, I think that having legal or licensed dealers would make the situation worse. As such is the situation with doctors.. there would still be illegal dealers. Marijuana should be fully legalized; if it was then you wouldn't have to worry about quality because you could grow your own.

Or maybe there'd be more of these:

(http://www.thrillist.com/archives/20...dwilshire.html)

Interestingly enough, there is a thread on the front page about these machines. I don't think the situation can get much worse with jailtime for possessing prescription marijuana occuring all the time.
Take it from someone who has seen the drug culture in a small town take down many a friend. It's the deals, the hustles, and the burns that lead to ruined lives. ANYTHING that cuts down the business these guys run is a step towards defeating organized crime, wasted police activity, and running the people who want to hurt others for their own personal gain out of town. Maybe then the cops can focus on real crimes like theft, rape, and murder instead of arresting a couple teens who are getting baked in their own homes.

[sxcboi1491]

I've got to say that a lot of your posts really intrigue me, I might consider widening the fields in which medical marijuana is used, for example, it is currently used for chronic pain relief as far as i know. I think that other fields should use other positive "side effects" of the drug, such as it relaxes, could also be used by chiropractors and (pardon possible incorrect spelling)-> massueses to relax muscles and improve results, also another "side effect" that could be used is it's ability to enhance sexual pleasure, could be sold over the counter in small amounts for that as well. are there any other properties of the drug that might help in other medical fields?

[dooey100]

Marijuana has often been described as a gateway drug, because people have marijuana, and then want to try harder drugs like cocaine or ecstasy. Do you think that legalizing marijuana might reduce this effect?

For example, someone might not want to try cocaine because they have heard it is bad for you and it is illegal (and feels good). But they have heard marijuana is not really bad, and is pretty fun, although it is illegal. So they try marijuana, and like it, and there is no real problem.

But then they look at cocaine at cocaine and say that it may be bad for you, but they have already had marijuana, which is illegal, so cocaine being illegal is not as big a thing as it seemed like before. Do you think this would be enough to reduce the amount of cocaine users?

<- long time lurker, first time poster (in CT)

[devonin]

Alcohol is legal because the process involved in making -good- alcohol is quite involved, time consuming and expensive. You can't make quality brandy in your basement, or quality vodka etc etc.

So the government can legalise it, knowing only specialised businesses will be producing it, allowing it to be easily regulated, taxed and controlled.

Marijuana can be turned from plants into joints basically with no actual infrastructure in between. If it were made legal, anyone with an interest in using it could easily and simply grow their own, with not that much time, effort or money.

It would be incredibly hard to regulate and control, and thus tax, which would generate very little revenue for the government.

This, completely apart from any reasoning on moral grounds, will prevent the legalisation of marijuana any time in the near future.

[arsonistsgetallthegirls]

Originally Posted by dooey100

Marijuana has often been described as a gateway drug, because people have marijuana, and then want to try harder drugs like cocaine or ecstasy. Do you think that legalizing marijuana might reduce this effect?

For example, someone might not want to try cocaine because they have heard it is bad for you and it is illegal (and feels good). But they have heard marijuana is not really bad, and is pretty fun, although it is illegal. So they try marijuana, and like it, and there is no real problem.

But then they look at cocaine at cocaine and say that it may be bad for you, but they have already had marijuana, which is illegal, so cocaine being illegal is not as big a thing as it seemed like before. Do you think this would be enough to reduce the amount of cocaine users?

<- long time lurker, first time poster (in CT)

By far the most valid argument made here, but the government has found ways to tax plants and farmers before...

Yes, because legalizing marijuana would keep people away from dealers who sell illegal drugs. There was already no solid evidence to show marijuana as a gateway drug (I can provide the link if needed) and legalizing makes hard drugs even more difficult to switch to, saying marijuana is the most common psychoactive being sold by drug dealers, who sell hard drugs.

Alcohol is legal because the process involved in making -good- alcohol is quite involved, time consuming and expensive. You can't make quality brandy in your basement, or quality vodka etc etc.

So the government can legalise it, knowing only specialised businesses will be producing it, allowing it to be easily regulated, taxed and controlled.

Marijuana can be turned from plants into joints basically with no actual infrastructure in between. If it were made legal, anyone with an interest in using it could easily and simply grow their own, with not that much time, effort or money.

It would be incredibly hard to regulate and control, and thus tax, which would generate very little revenue for the government.

This, completely apart from any reasoning on moral grounds, will prevent the legalization of marijuana any time in the near future.

By far the most valid argument posted, but the government has found ways to tax plants before...

[bender5]

Sadly enough devonin is very right. I have never myself thought of this point, but it is very true. I have myself actually made my own liquor and it does lack in quality from the professionally made substances. I think that if they really wanted to they could legalize marijuana and there would be quite a few good things that would happen. However, devonin has made a very good point, so I'll revise and summarize.

Making marijuana partially legal. With licensed sellers. Much like Amsterdam only being able to buy in certain places and/or markets and stores. There could also be an age restriction on it just like alcohol or cigarettes. Which wouldn't change anything for teens, but would change quite a bit for adults. There would be laws against personal growing. Which would instate professional growing situations. Which would also create job opportunities. And if it becomes a state/federally run business there most certainly would be enough tax revenue to make it worth the morality of legalizing marijuana.

[tyl110]

Bingo. Oh, and the partial legalization, is that where the government can grow and sell it only, or am I completely wrong and something else is happening in that scenario? Now, based on what i've heard recently with the houses used in grow-ops put back on the market, wouldn't legalization reduce that or possibly eliminate it?

[devonin]

Generally, partial legalization movements are based around the idea that the government could authorize and tightly control the growing and selling of marijuana, but that growing your own would remain illegal.

There are plenty of things like this already at work in the world. A prime example is the control of alcohol in, I want to say Holland maybe? (Probably wrong country) where the government maintains a number of liquor and beer stores which are the -only- places to legally obtain alcohol of over 3.5% abv. Anything under that can be sold anywhere people want to do so, but the government has direct control over everything else.

[Bynary Fission]

Frankly, marijuana should be legalized, as it once was. Pot used to be used for many necessities in life, such as paper and textiles. In fact, one of acre of marijuana would save 4 1/2 acres of trees. The reason it became illegal is because people like Randolph Hearst vilified marijuana with claims that were, for the most part, false. (He owned a very large tree farm, and because hemp was cheaper than wood, he risked losing a lot of money). Only then did it become illegal.

Yes, pot can be more destructive than regular cigarettes. Yes, it is nasty, and making it legal could benefit stoners and pot smokers. But personally, I believe the benefits far outweigh the cons. Hemp is environmentally friendly, and some of what was produced from it, like paper, is superior to what is made today. Marijuana is a drug. But people who smoke it deliberately use it for the wrong reasons. In the past, hemp was smoked little, and mostly used for other purposes. Perhaps, if Congress and the American public were made to realize the benefits legalizing it would have, then perhaps it would provide a reason to once again legalize it.

Considering that over 50,000,000 people in America alone have smoked pot at least once in their lives, and I'll bet that at least 5 million of them use it at least once a week, what's legalizing pot going to do that's bad anyways? Millions just smoke it anyways. It's not like ten million people are going to decide to become stoners on a whim when it's legalized. Frankly, I believe it won't do anything but good should it be legalized.

Read these:
http://www.associatedcontent.com/art...alization.html
http://www.perkel.com/politics/issues/pot.htm
http://www.alternet.org/rights/47815/


~Bynary Fission

[bender5]

I actually am surprised at the amount of people have really good points. At this point I'm not going to comment on anything much more. However, I do need to ask who changed the name of my thread and misspelled legalization.

[devonin]

Misspelled? I'm pretty sure that Canadian/British english is just as correct as American english. I edited the title to be more reflective of the contents of the thread. If it really galls you that I used a non-american spelling to do so, I can change it to -ize for you.

[atalkingcow]

Originally Posted by bender5

I actually am surprised at the amount of people have really good points. At this point I'm not going to comment on anything much more. However, I do need to ask who changed the name of my thread and misspelled legalization.

Umm...Probably devonin, because in canada and most of europe..it would be spelled with an "s", so...from his point of view, your spelling PHAYLS!

[bender5]

No it's quite alright. I've never seen it spelled that way, and I never thought that you spelled it as you saw fit. I'm sorry for questioning your reason.

As for the topic at hand. I find it kind of funny how much more amazing and sensible legalization sounds as you are smoking. I did find myself getting all philosophical in my euphoric state. However, this lead me to look into comparing the laws that could be here to the laws that are in Amsterdam.

If we were to have "Cafes" like in Amsterdam it would be an open place to enjoy marijuana, and you could card like people currently do in bars. It would pretty much be a club for smoking. This would be the only Legal place for public Marijuana smoking, but that doesn't mean that smoking on privately owned property couldn't be open to the public for smoking grounds. Basically this would enforce a keep weed of the streets kind of thing. Public intoxication/smoking in public would be comparable to drinking in public. All in all it would be more of a if we don't see it, it isn't there kind of tactic approach.

So adding this to licensed sellers, an age restriction, and governmental regulation; I'd say we have ourselves an outlook that looks extremely reasonable on paper. However, something that the people of the era we live in now probably won't see in our lifetimes. Maybe one day someone will realize that it does happen to be just a plant. Yet, until that things won't change.