So apparently people are mad that Stepmania was on AGDQ

[Charu]

Dude...

Nekodancer was confirmed game of the year even before it was a thing.

It's too good for AGDQ.

[Xayphon]

nah man this is the shit

[Dark Saga]

So, you didnt saw this next gen game...

[Arch0wl]

Originally Posted by MinaciousGrace

no dude u don't understand

tennis has a higher learning curve than sprinting the 100m

therefore every tennis player in the world is a better athlete than every 100m sprinter in the world

I knew always I liked you for some reason

[CaptainAhab]

Pretty incredible how many elitists who seem jealous of SM's massive exposure have come out of the woodwork to vitriolically spew "play IIDX/o!m 7k, not some shitty 4k game that's not impressive lol."

One of the main reasons I dabbled in SM a ways back and – now that my semesters have calmed down –*have come back to play more regularly, is because of how easy it is to download, fire up, and get into compared to LR2 and its incredibly unstable client. Also 4k is fun for me, so whatever.

[_Zenith_]

RG Wars

[Arch0wl]

Originally Posted by bmah

Well I am familiar with the IIDX community, and I understand that they may feel slighted at the fact that IIDX continues to remain as a niche/underground game, while thousands of people will now be familiarized with Stepmania.

IIDX is:

- a proprietary game by a large corporation

- that cannot adjust to changes in competitive play for risk of losing profit

- that has the majority of its home versions playable only by owning a PS2, and only one on PC

- that requires a significant dollar investment to play the majority of songs

- that requires a significant dollar investment to play on a standard competitive device (i.e. an arcade controller)

- that requires *even more* money to play its harder modes on a standard competitive device (double)

- that is promoted almost exclusively in japan

- that is culturally *extremely* japanese -- the text or layouts are not designed to make sense to anyone not from japan

- that cannot be changed to make sense to people who are not this audience

- with a community that is extremely antagonistic toward anything mainstream music game

- and a community that allows no adaptability for promotion to new audiences

- and a community that is actively antagonistic toward even custom charts

yeah, IIDX being popular is never going to happen.

you'd think IIDX players would realize this and not care. I never expected this to happen to Stepmania, because that's what any reasonable person would have told you. I'm still extremely skeptical that much will come of this popularity boost.

yet the IIDX fanbase seems to think it could still be a mainstream game somehow; they have a sense of how esoteric and alienating their game is, but so many are dumbly deluded into this idea that normal people will just... think the way they do, by default.

it's unreal how bad the audience awareness is in this crowd. but then, can you really expect anything else when the community doesn't engage other communities and they tend to be the kind of people whose entire circle of friends is also the same people who are in the community for the game? they're in a social bubble of people who have extremely poor social awareness to begin with.

[Arch0wl]

Originally Posted by PhantomPuppy

lol if nobody volunteered to play iidx or ddr at agdq, why are they complaining?

because -- and I am not even exaggerating -- they are entitled enough to think someone should have contacted them about it by now.

as in, they think something along these lines:

"if someone who knew what music games existed could have contacted an AGDQ person to do a music game, well then of course they would have wanted IIDX on there, it's obviously the hardest."

very few of them will be able to wrap their brains around the fact that it's equally difficult to be the best at SM despite its four key layout. they think that increasing the complexity of an activity = increasing how hard it is to be top-tier at that activity. so, seven keys and a wrist/elbow movement will necessarily be harder to them.

while it's true that the *potential difficulty* is harder since peak note density is harder, but no one is at that point. as long as there's a skill ceiling for either game -- and there isn't -- winning will be extremely hard in both activities.

but they will never understand this. their time investment in this community (and the fact that, for many people, their entire social circle is the community) means that they can't imagine IIDX *not* being the hardest (it isn't; BMS has harder 7k charts), the "highest quality" (this is an arbitrary goal as countless debates in SM have proven) -- whatever excuse or outright delusion they have to tell themselves to justify their money/time they will.

it wouldn't be so frustrating if it weren't so clearly self-deluding. this is the same kind of thought process that keeps people from resistance training because weights are for 'meatheads', just applied to a single game and not an activity. it's ridiculous.

[Arch0wl]

oh, and their attitude towards games is inherently proprietary.

as in, most of us think it's a good thing that we can make custom charts.

their attitude is never stated directly, because if it was they'd realize how dumb it was. so they say it implicitly when they talk about custom charts.

and when they do, it's VERY CLEAR that they think charts need to be made by some kind of authority to be good, where authority = a company, and ideally Konami. it's absurd and pathetic; it's the mentality of the kind of person who can't buy clothes that aren't a certain brand but applied to a video game.

some of them haven't even been able to accept BMS as a distinct thing.

but

before I finish

let me just note that I have been pushing back against this kind of mentality since 2004 which means I have been dealing with these dumbfucks for over twelve fucking years. they are easily in my top 10 least favorite kinds of people, but I rarely ever have to interact with them so I'm not conscious of how much I hate them until the rare moments I remember they exist

[rushyrulz]

I don't play IIDX and Osu! because they are total and complete weebfests, to put it lightly.

I mean FFR and SM can get pretty weeby as well, but at least I can jam out to some Protest the Hero instead of playing 8 hours of
いくつかのクソ曲のタイトル [ANOTHER] all day.

Plus I can step whatever the fuck I want, whenever the fuck I want and have an easy platform to release it to others for their enjoyment.

[rushyrulz]

New rhythm game players (sans those from Japan, because I'm not entirely certain there is such a thing as a new rhythm game player in Japan) don't want to play a bunch of shit they have never heard of before. Why do you think Guitar Hero got so damn popular? Most of the songs can be heard on the radio.. in America.. where they are from..

Relatability to the music is probably the top 3 things that are required for introductory interest in a rhythm game and I haven't really seen that from IIDX, although Osu might have a case.

[Nyokou]

wtf is a stepmania

[L.B.D.D]

Originally Posted by rushyrulz

New rhythm game players (sans those from Japan, because I'm not entirely certain there is such a thing as a new rhythm game player in Japan) don't want to play a bunch of shit they have never heard of before. Why do you think Guitar Hero got so damn popular? Most of the songs can be heard on the radio.. in America.. where they are from..

Relatability to the music is probably the top 3 things that are required for introductory interest in a rhythm game and I haven't really seen that from IIDX, although Osu might have a case.

exactly this

i mean like i've watched some anime before but as a person i just don't like anime music that much

basically i'd rather be listening to something else when i'm in the car or something, and that translates to my rhythm game as well

i swear osu is like 99% aNiMe so i can't relate to any of it

[Buta-san]

So a lot of people have been wondering

[TC_Halogen]

jesus fuck Arch0wl your last three posts were fantastic, thank you so much for not only taking the time to make them, but also for taking the time to be blunt and eloquent at the same time

[Arch0wl]

:')

[bmah]

Yeah, I pretty much concur with just about all of your points, Arch. If any rhythm game by Bemani is to be popular, that's in the hands of Konami, and their business decisions haven't been all that great lately.

[shenjoku]

Wow, I had no idea the IIDX community was so bad. I guess I've just missed that side of things all these years I've been playing it. Then again, I think the only "community" I interacted with was on the Outphase forums, which is super small.

[MixMasterLar]

See, the thing is I actually really like IIDX. Like I just received my order of 7th Style in the mail yesterday.

But damn, if SM doesn't have it beat in all the areas that matter--especially for newer players. To be blunt, I probably wouldn't be playing IIDX if it wasn't for SM even though I had heard about it before coming here to FFR. Still, I don't let the fact take away from my enjoyment of IIDX and neither should anyone else.

and I FOR DAMN SURE don't let my enjoyment take away from the sweetness that was Staiain ripping those charts up. I think that is the most tragic part in all this: You can basically claim that the man made thousands of dollars that go to save fucking lives just with the power of spread alone and we are barely talking about that.

[Arch0wl]

"you may be good at Stepmania but are your wristjacks so powerful they can stop cancer"

-- a real sentence Staiain could say