Old 10-4-2011, 01:22 PM   #1
Big Xplosion
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Default FFR Arrow BPM

Hey guys, I don't post much but I was wondering how fast the arrows move (BPM) in FFR. Because I play stepmania and I feel like it would help if the arrows moved at the same speed as FFR when I created songs.. lol

Thanks.
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Old 10-4-2011, 01:31 PM   #2
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

FFR on 1x = C310
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Old 10-4-2011, 01:33 PM   #3
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

What Remedy said.

Just keep in mind, FFR doesn't have perspective; Overhead is the default/only perspective.
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Old 10-4-2011, 02:03 PM   #4
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

Quote:
Originally Posted by remedy1502 View Post
FFR on 1x = C310
So I would set my stepmania songs to 310 BPM?
I still use 3.9b version lol
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Old 10-4-2011, 02:08 PM   #5
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

I'm slightly confused about what you're asking.

The BPMs of songs vary based on the song which is what I think you're asking about. You need to find the BPM of the song when making a chart. BPMs of songs in FFR are all different.

Now scrollrate on the other hand is something completely different. That's just how fast the arrows APPEAR to be going when playing the game. Like when you play SM you can pick to play on an x mod such as 1x 2x 3x so on or a c mod C300 C400 so on so on. FFR even though it show's an X is just a constant like a C mod in stepmania

But I'm pretty sure you're looking for what BPM to set your song at for stepping and for that you just need to find it. You can try using mixmeister for constant BPM songs. For varying BPMs it wont work because it will only give you the average BPM.
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Old 10-4-2011, 02:18 PM   #6
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

Stepmania and FFR are slightly different on how the screen resolutions are configured, so you probably won't use the same in both. I know I play 2x on FFR, which is C620, and I play C700-C750 when I'm on Stepmania.

You phrased that last statement like you were trying to step something, is that what you are hoping? Basically each song runs in one way:

Arrows are made for a file, at whatever BPM the file is actually run at. If a song is 140 beats per minute, you'd want your step file to be that so it is properly synced to the song with the arrows. When it gets into FFR, if a user plays it at 2x, that means they are C-modding it to 620bpm. In stepmania you have x2, which would play the song at 2 times the bpm of the song itself. C### would modify the bpm. FFR does NOT have any variation of SM's x2, but instead uses x2 as a "name" of sorts for C620. FFR is like using C-mods on SM. Regardless of the song's actual bpm, you are playing it at 310. So, definitely sync songs to their proper bpm.

If you are simply talking about playing, yes, you would try to use x# to get to 310 if you play 1x on FFR, or just play C300 or C310 or whatever on SM.

I'll clarify something if you still need help haha.

/ninja'd, but w/e I'll leave it up.
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Old 10-4-2011, 02:28 PM   #7
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

Quote:
Originally Posted by justin_ator View Post
Stepmania and FFR are slightly different on how the screen resolutions are configured, so you probably won't use the same in both. I know I play 2x on FFR, which is C620, and I play C700-C750 when I'm on Stepmania.

You phrased that last statement like you were trying to step something, is that what you are hoping? Basically each song runs in one way:

Arrows are made for a file, at whatever BPM the file is actually run at. If a song is 140 beats per minute, you'd want your step file to be that so it is properly synced to the song with the arrows. When it gets into FFR, if a user plays it at 2x, that means they are C-modding it to 620bpm. In stepmania you have x2, which would play the song at 2 times the bpm of the song itself. C### would modify the bpm. FFR does NOT have any variation of SM's x2, but instead uses x2 as a "name" of sorts for C620. FFR is like using C-mods on SM. Regardless of the song's actual bpm, you are playing it at 310. So, definitely sync songs to their proper bpm.

If you are simply talking about playing, yes, you would try to use x# to get to 310 if you play 1x on FFR, or just play C300 or C310 or whatever on SM.

I'll clarify something if you still need help haha.

/ninja'd, but w/e I'll leave it up.
Thank you for the input! I guess I didn't really know what I was asking.. Basically if I jumped from FFR to Stepamania in the songs I've created I noticed my timing was kind of off. maybe coincidence idk, lol.

So basically I should set the BMP for stepmania at 310, which is the same as ffr 1x? haha by BPM I guess I meant the scrolll rate of the arrows.
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Old 10-4-2011, 02:40 PM   #8
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

If you're creating a stepfile on Stepmania, you need to find the MP3s BPM and use that in the "BPM" slot. Google how to find the BPM of music.
The 'Scroll Rate' is a player option which changes the rate at which the arrows move up the screen, FFR uses 310C.
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Old 10-4-2011, 02:42 PM   #9
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

Looks like you've got it now. =] 310 is 1x, so toy around with Cmods in SM to get what you are comfortable with.

Maybe it's just my preference, but my SM seems to be slightly faster than my FFR Cmod
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Old 10-4-2011, 04:02 PM   #10
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

I still think he's confused.

Notice how some songs on FFR have a lot of colorful streams and others have red and blue only streams (colorful: Speed Limit 38, red and blue: Kidney Stone).
The BPM (Beats per minute) of Speed Limit 38 is extremely low which is why there are 48th and 64th notes in it without the player getting overwhelmed with speed. In Kidney stone, the majority of the streams are only 8th note based (red and blue notes only) but it's still significantly faster than Speed Limit 38 because Kidney Stone's BPM is well over 400 as Speed Limit 38's is under 50.

If you're stepping a file on StepMania, you need to use a program that analyzes the actual BPM of the MP3 since there is no one BPM that will work for all songs. If you're just curious as to what the scroll rate is on FFR for the purposes of playing SM at the same speed as FFR, multiply your speedmod on FFR by 310 and put C before the result for the corresponding stepmania speedmod. (For instance 1.75x on FFR would be (1.75 x 310 = C542)) But like justin_ator said, the screen is larger on stepmania so you might want to just add 50 and round up to your result.

Hope this clears things up.
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Old 10-4-2011, 04:23 PM   #11
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

Quote:
Originally Posted by justin_ator View Post
Maybe it's just my preference, but my SM seems to be slightly faster than my FFR Cmod
Perspective.
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Old 10-4-2011, 04:43 PM   #12
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Xplosion View Post
Hey guys, I don't post much but I was wondering how fast the arrows move (BPM) in FFR. Because I play stepmania and I feel like it would help if the arrows moved at the same speed as FFR when I created songs.. lol

Thanks.
While ffr 1x is as fast a velocity as sm C310, what you actually want is to equalize the reaction times, so you hit a note the same amount of time after it appears in both games. (This will make ffr look like squished stepmania after a while)

If you use a theme like sm 3.9 default with the bottom covered, multiply your ffr mod by between 328 and 368 and make that your c-mod.
If you use a theme like sm 5 default or itg with the bottom uncovered, multiply your ffr mod by between 382 and 420 your c-mod.
(I don't know the exact number)
This will equalize reaction times so both games will be read the same way.
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Old 11-22-2011, 12:06 PM   #13
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

How many post do you need so you can start new threads?
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Old 11-22-2011, 12:21 PM   #14
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

Hello. Please don't bump threads with irrelevant information.

As far as I remember, the minimum post count to make any threads is 1. Time might have to pass before you can make one though.
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Old 11-22-2011, 12:22 PM   #15
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

sorry but yea cause I have like 10post and I still can't post new stuff
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Old 11-22-2011, 12:50 PM   #16
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

That's odd. Maybe you should send a private message to one of the forum administrators about the problem? (Sprite-, Velocity, aperson, Zageron)
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Old 11-22-2011, 12:54 PM   #17
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

thanks I'll do that
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Old 11-22-2011, 10:13 PM   #18
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Default Re: FFR Arrow BPM

Going back to the OP:

We have to make a distinction between BPM, which is a parameter of the song (beats per minute) and scroll rate, which is the rate at which the arrows move across the screen towards the receptors.

To clarify:
BPM applies to the song.
Scroll rate applies to the steps.

Now that we've got that out of the way, Patashu is correct. The game screen for the Legacy engine, for example, is 550 pixels wide by 400 pixels high. This is slightly off from the 4:3 ratio that most computer monitors use, and most people when running Stepmania run it in full screen, so your timing will be slightly different. Also of note is the fact that the FFR perfect window is slightly wider than SM's default (Judge 4) marvelous window, a consequence of the way FFR is coded.

ONE IMPORTANT DIFFERENCE: In SM, chords (two or more arrows at the same place) have cohesion: That is to say, they are graded as a unit when the last arrow is hit, and the player receives one grading for the entire chord on the results screen. This is why step grade totals don't add up to the max combo of the song.

In FFR, on the other hand, each arrow is graded separately, forcing you to hit all the arrows in a chord at more or less the same time, which has its own set of issues. There is also the issue of "boos", where hitting a key when FFR does not sense an arrow to be graded leads to you receiving a small deduction to your score. Due to the limitations of the engine, "freeze arrows" are also impossible to include in a file.

The moral of the story: Play around until you find settings that you're comfortable with for both games. Some people even change their settings to try to do better on individual songs.
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