So I finally came clean to my parents.

[Aldentron]

Originally Posted by JiZ53

If there is no female mother figure, the child will usually find a female figure to look up to.

sounds good to me

[devonin]

Originally Posted by Aldentron

sounds good to me

If I were gay and in a gay relationship and adopted/surrogated/etc a female child, there are plenty of excellent female role models in my life that such a child could look up to. Just none of them would happen to be her mother.

[fido123]

Mother and Father are gender specific roles. Somebody can have two fathers, or two mothers, but when your parents are of the same gender you can't have both unless you throw somebody else of a different gender into the mix somehow.

[irionman]

Just a thought, but most parents seem to already know that their child is gay. I just find it weird that some people react so negatively when it is finally vocalized. It's not like they turned you that way, it's just something that they can't control. Congrats on coming out to them though.

[GuidoHunter]

Originally Posted by All_That_Chaz

My problem with this is that not everyone prescribes to the same philosophy. It's easy to say that a parent loves their child when they're trying to get their beloved child who is addicted to heroin to go into rehab. Why should the child stop doing heroin? Because it will kill you. Why should the child stop being gay? Because you'll go to hell. The parent's conviction is brought about by love in both scenarios, but the consequence for being gay is founded entirely upon the parent's interpretation of the Bible, something the child doesn't necessarily believe in.

Of course. I wrote my whole post from the perspective of the parents. It creates an even greater divide when parents and child aren't on the same religious foundation, but it does help to better understand the other side. At the very least, it's better than "You're gay and you can't help it, **** 'em if they say otherwise!" advice.

The only thing I disagree with is that it's Ken's responsibility to "fight his parents with love." Everyone here is an adult, and I believe his parents are in the wrong. If anybody should be fighting to restore the relationship, it's his parents.

I think you misunderstand. First of all, Ken has no responsibility to try to restore the relationship with his parents; if he wants to walk away that's totally his call. It's just my counsel that he doesn't.

It's because his parents are in the wrong (mostly, at least; without knowing more we can't say that Ken's 100% blameless for how things turned out, but we can agree that kicking him out was a very bad idea) that Ken needs to be the one to stand up and fight. It's clear that they're willing to put him out and forget about him, so rather than walking away, be the bigger man and stand up. Show them that he's more interested in mending fences than fanning flames, that despite being gay, he's still a good person.

--Guido

[ichliebekase]

Not sure if this was made clear or not, but Ken wasn't necessarily "kicked out", he was already planning on moving long before he told his parents, and they just requested that he move out sooner.

[Mau5]

Originally Posted by fido123

Also on everything else you said, like I said before. It's one thing if OTHER people are homosexuals, but it's a completely different one when it's their kids.

Homosexuality is not some sort of derogatory life choice, if anything i'd be proud that he has the balls to define himself to that extent and share it with the people that brought him into this world, I don't even think I would have the nerves to do something like that. Props to the OP.

[rushyrulz]

Originally Posted by irionman

most parents seem to already know that their child is gay.

Cool stat.

[fido123]

Originally Posted by Mau5

Homosexuality is not some sort of derogatory life choice, if anything i'd be proud that he has the balls to define himself to that extent and share it with the people that brought him into this world, I don't even think I would have the nerves to do something like that. Props to the OP.

The problem is not everybody has your reasoning.

[devonin]

Originally Posted by fido123

Mother and Father are gender specific roles. Somebody can have two fathers, or two mothers, but when your parents are of the same gender you can't have both unless you throw somebody else of a different gender into the mix somehow.

Gender roles yes. Sex roles no. Gender is an artificial construct, and there's no reason why a gender role can't be fulfilled by someone of another sex.

[Cavernio]

Women with young children are also likely to suffer from post partum depression monkeyman, something brough about by natural hormonal changes. I'd trust my baby to get a better bond with an undepressed father over a depressed me any day of the week.

[fido123]

Originally Posted by devonin

Gender roles yes. Sex roles no. Gender is an artificial construct, and there's no reason why a gender role can't be fulfilled by someone of another sex.

I didn't realize there's a difference between gender and sex. Anyway ultimately I have to say I'm uneducated on the topic as I'm not really a biology guy, but I'm not sure if I agree with your statement. Male and female beings are not the same. Different sexes have different hormones and hard-wiring than each other. I also wonder if people (baby's especially) react differently to different genders not just because of psychological reasons but recognizing one's sex in some sort of hormonal hard-wire way makes you act differently around them. My sister always hogged my youngest cat when she was a kitten, and now I think that the cat looks up to my sister almost as a mother figure.

Not saying your wrong, just offering my two cents and again, I'm uneducated on the manner so my opinion means squat anyway but it be interesting to hear what you have to say about this or somebody who's formally educated on the subject. Anyway perhaps we should make a new thread if we want to continue this discussion because this thread is about congratulating flipsta for his courage although we're at page 8 lol.

[kommisar]

that in itself is a lack of esteem. anyone has the potential to be a great role model for their child, as long as they don't have their heads stuck up their asses and are open to whatever their child will become.

[fido123]

I'm not saying two dad's or mom's aren't as capable of raising a child as a mixed gender relationship. I'm just saying there's a difference between a mom and a dad but it comes down to what kind of person they are. Sorry if there was any confusion.

[Mau5]

Originally Posted by rushyrulz

Oh my God.

PS sorry i worded that wrong. Haha obviously you're like born gay or w/e.. You know what i mean though, don't let other people tell you something like THAT is wrong.

[GuidoHunter]

"Obviously"?

--Guido

[Mau5]

Is figuratively better?

[devonin]

No, Obviously is a fine word. There's an overwhelming amount of good science that demonstrates that homosexuality/sexuality in general is largely a factor of genetics, chemicals in the brain, and effects during foetal development.

While I'm sure there are people who've chosen a non-zero sexuality on the Kinsey scale for whatever reason, the majority were, in fact, born that way.

[MaxGhost]

Originally Posted by devonin

the majority were, in fact, born that way.

inb4 lady gaga lol

[flipsta_lombax]

Originally Posted by rushyrulz

just gonna put this here >.>

I just watched the entire video.. moving. I can relate to Bobby entirely. I would never have suicidal thoughts now, but I did tell my parents I have thought of it because of their mentally abusive ways in the past. But what edged me to even thinking of suicide when I was younger was the thought of my parents disowning me for knowing "the" truth. The feel of rejection.

The irony of it all.

I know it seems impossible for even my situation, knowing my parents and their stronghold on personal opinion, but I'm going to mail them this movie after I move out and hope that they watch and understand it. My expectations after that: nothing.