11 Things the Bible Bans, But You Do Anyway

[Secks69]

Originally Posted by rushyrulz

I'd like to see the statistics on this.

He's saying that not necessarily Christians do more volunteer work than others do, he's just saying that Christians do volunteer work because their faith promotes it. He's not trying to say "CHRISTIANS ARE BETTER LOL", he's just saying that there are good things to religion but nobody in this thread has acknowledged that.

[BigBoss37]

what doesnt the bible ban

[Andrew Mitchell]

they don't ban burkas but the french do, also shaving armpits

[Reincarnate]

Yes, Aldentron, what are you accomplishing by quoting me? There's nothing wrong with holding the opinion that religion is retarded. It's no more or less retarded than believing in Leprechauns. Would you call someone sane who believed in the Flying Spaghetti Monster? Would you respect that belief if their faith said it was OK to be hostile against those that did not believe?

And nobody says Christianity hasn't been a promoter for good in some cases. The point is that you don't need faith to do that. We don't get our morality from the Bible. We do good unto others because of secular, societal optima. The reason why few people care to really talk about the upsides is because the upsides are arguably negligible when compared to the downsides. It's like trying to say "But there are benefits to using asbestos!" Fine, but do we really need to settle for that?

[ScarletSky]

Originally Posted by BigBoss37

what doesnt the bible ban

I think molesting children is fine. :3

[Andrew Mitchell]

your a petafile

[~kitty~]

Originally Posted by Reincarnate

That's absolutely wrong lmfao thought you were smarter than that.

There's a very serious problem with telling people that it's OK to blindly justify faith. As an example you've got ~kitty~ in this very thread saying crap like

Whoa whoa whoa there, Reincarnate. You misunderstood what I meant. I thought about what I said, and I realized the government interferes with what I mentioned, so it's an issue of controlling the people by the state rather than Religion, which used to control the people of the past and keep everyone from killing each other. My issues are slightly more political and somewhat more personal on some levels. I didn't mean it the way you think. I'm sorry if I ever gave you the impression I was excusing Religion for all the conflicts it has caused in the past, present, and will in the future.

EDIT: the only reason I posted everything of what I said was to balance the issue and my inner conflict with Religion (actually more or less a thing of a creator and what it could mean and what it does mean for others) which I resolved as being agnostic, pretty much. However, I'm the type of agnostic which I would prefer to believe one exists, because I don't like the world I see, and a good way out of it is to believe in one. Like I mentioned before, I haven't been very well exposed to the world, but there are lots of things that cause me emotional distress if they remain the way they are. I think Religion could help fix that issue, and I know that there's going to be a lot of the whole existential arguments and stuff in response, but you have to realize not everyone "exists" the same way. Respect it, please. I understand why you feel the way you do, and you probably don't have the same sense of morals I do... too many distractions to complete this, but I agree with you Reincarnate on the vast majority of what you said. However, there are some things I would like to agree to disagree with you on as well.

[ScarletSky]

Originally Posted by Andrew Mitchell

your a petafile

Not saying I've ever done it.
But the catholics have been doing it for years.

[Andrew Mitchell]

peatfiles will be detained

[Reincarnate]

Originally Posted by MrGiggles

Just because the chances of successfully convincing someone to question their beliefs are slim doesn't mean you shouldn't make the minimal effort. The person on the other side of the debate won't take you seriously unless you take him/her seriously. If you attack people's beliefs aggressively the way you are apt to do, they'll get defensive and retreat back into a "DONT LISTEN TO THE DEVIL" mentality. Grats, they're now probably less likely to make a committed intellectual effort in the future. Approaching them with a modicum of respect and civility makes you much more likely to get people to at least consider thinking about what you say.

You say you tend to follow NDT's methods and reasoning rather than Dawkins, and NDT is A+ awesomesauce, but look at Aldentron's list of quotes and tell me you honestly don't think you're being too abrasive towards people who honestly believe they're making the world a better place through practicing their beliefs.

edit: plus, it's just straight up not nice to refer to someone as retarded, even if they are. This ain't the gBin yet.
ps you're retarded ;o

Why am I obligated to make an effort to convince/convert someone? That's damn near impossible to do.

As for people taking things seriously, but there's no way to have a serious debate with someone who is literally operating outside of logic. It's why Dawkins doesn't debate Creationists anymore. You give them credence by agreeing to debate in the first place, and, as the famous quote says, it's like playing Chess with a pigeon who shits on the board, knocks over all the pieces, and then flocks home to claim victory. What if a biologist agreed to get into a discussion with an advocate of the Stork Theory? Or a geologist versus a Flat-Earther? Are we really supposed to take crackpot claims seriously, as you're implying? These are not beliefs we should respect, validate, or take seriously -- especially when they cause harm.

There's a certain point where you have to put your foot down. To take the opposing side "seriously" is literally appealing to nonsense -- it's intentionally giving weight to demonstrably false claims and outright crazy logical absurdities. Even by giving it respect when debating otherwise harmless theists, you propagate a meme that faith is OK. That concept is the very core of the greatest weapon of destructive religious backing.

As for calling people retarded -- I completely agree, don't get me wrong. But this is the Internet which is srs bsns rite.

[Reincarnate]

Kitty: It's kind of hard to twist "Latter point for you as well, I meant I didn't want to just have it where I "lived life the way I want to live it." This may seem weird, but I kind of don't want others to live life they want to live it either" into anything remotely positive. How can this imply anything other than butting into how others live their lives?

[Andrew Mitchell]

christaians will be detained and mentally trained, atheists will be punished and detained for the big fishys

[~kitty~]

Originally Posted by Reincarnate

Kitty: It's kind of hard to twist "Latter point for you as well, I meant I didn't want to just have it where I "lived life the way I want to live it." This may seem weird, but I kind of don't want others to live life they want to live it either" into anything remotely positive. How can this imply anything other than butting into how others live their lives?

I can see why you would think that, and at the time I was writing most of these things, I was tired and my wording was misleading. I don't want to butt into peoples lives and make them change exactly, but that's what the government does. I don't really know how to word this, but I don't think it's wrong to shape people while still letting them be free to do what they desire (to an extent).

[-zeroSKILL-]

Originally Posted by ~kitty~

Personally, I would like to believe there is a God. Some benefits may come out of it, but believing in an organized Religion comes with lots of logical flaws, such as the fact that I was taught that God loves all things, God knows everything, and God can do anything. According to the Bible, if this all was true, God doesn't exist. I'm pretty sure it states that if God isn't all of those things, he doesn't exist. That, or I heard it from somewhere else. However, if I say it benefits me to not believe in a God (non-traditional), then I would be a bit more stressful. However, this does bring up the "you don't really believe in God, you're just psychologically reacting to the environment by deluding that such a thing exists." I've thought about it, and I struggled over what to believe because I prefer to believe in something and believing in no theism makes the point of life less valuable, thus less enjoyable, and I want to enjoy my life. This really seems like I'm just trying to be deliberately delusional, or maybe I'm right.

A problem I've encountered numerous times, however, is how people die sometimes. If God exists and there's a soul, what about the people with mental disorders or what about all these organ functions that actually make us live? If we had souls and God existed, why do we die so easily? It just becomes a complicated mess. Anyway, I just think, from a point of view of actually being inside the Religious circle, that people are "retarded" about religion because rejecting these ideologies destroys their purpose of life, and they want to stick to it no matter what. Probably means nothing can change them. I don't know, I'm rambling now.

I'm still reading through the thread, and might offer more later, but for now I'd like to at least reply to this with something I've been saying since I was 13.

"There is no meaning to life and the only purpose in life, is to give life a purpose."
-Brian Baldwin

I first came up with that line while I was a forum moderator (forum leader of the philosophy and physics sections) on a science forum I had found many many years ago.

I had grown sick of all the "philosophical debates" people kept coming into the forums with asking why are we here? what is our purpose? what is the meaning of life? etc... I set my mind to trying to provide an answer that would end even a philosophical debate, and that was the best I could come up with. Probably one of the most profound things I've ever said/written publicly (I tend to prefer making an asshat out of myself, makes life enjoyable for me ;P).

Any how, it's been a doctrine I've adapted, and I'm sure others as well. If the purpose you seek is filled by religion, so be it. But please don't make your purpose in life trying to change or influence others purpose with religion or anything else of similar nature. Let people create their own path.

[Reincarnate]

To MrGiggles, who brought up Dawkins' hostility:

Richard Dawkins: Respect for Religion Enables Religious Extremism: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXHJ-hLjuxM
Richard Dawkins - Hostile to Religion: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtC65...eature=related
Richard Dawkins - Absolute Morality: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxdgCxK4VUA
Professor Richard Dawkins on creationism, evolution and religion: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KqebPkh6qo

Some other videos that sum this stuff up quite nicely (with some more poetic elements of science, for those who need emotional appeal):

Why should we fight religion | Hitchens : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YmQe...rec_grec_index
Hitchens: religion degrades humanity: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-J5o...eature=related
Hitchens: deism, theism, wishful thinking: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPlMS...eature=related

What does Neil Tyson think about Intelligent Design?: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPLn9nv26NM
(These two videos actually make me tear up lol):
Neil deGrasse Tyson - The Universe : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOzkEwaMnaE
The Known Universe by AMNH: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17jymDn0W6U

Of course you guys are probably not going to watch any of these and then yammer on with the same BS, lmfao

I have a hard time seeing why anyone who isn't ignorant of the situation could possibly argue that we need to be more respectful to religion.


EDIT: One of the top rated comments for The Known Universe is pretty funny: "With any religion, let's put this into perspective: It's like saying God just built the entire USA all by himself in 6 days. Once done, he took out a microscope and looked at a small speck of dirt in an arbitrary spot in some arbitrary town. He says "This is a ****ing awesome speck I made! I will devote all my efforts into this speck, the rest of all this land can just do what it wants.""

[robertsona]

without religion internet forums would be boring

[MrGiggles]

Rubix, even if you aren't trying to convince or convert anyone, attacking them won't do anything besides lock them further into their beliefs and make everyone more hostile towards atheism/agnosticism. I guess I'm OK with that attitude towards religions as a whole and religious organizations, but I do think you should be more tolerant of personal beliefs (edit: the benign ones, though you may disagree on whether they exist or not. Not the personal beliefs of, say, a WBC member).

I mean really, it takes like, zero effort to not be mean to people in a text-based debate (same edit: okay, i just checked my facebook feed and maybe 'zero effort' is a little on low side), and the benefits of doing so can be pretty substantial on both ends.

brb finishing those vids i only watched about half of them before writing this but I loved the NDT - Universe one the most bestest

internet srs bsns

I wish more people had this burned into their retinas or at least had it pop up whenever they tried to submit something online

edit 2: "Professor Richard Dawkins on creationism, evolution and religion" video is awesome and brings up that whole "devil will try to persuade you" complication thats so annoying.

[MrGiggles]

wow **** you i came into this thread all "lol religion threads" and then I had to go and get involved **** you all you piece of shit ****** ****s jesus ****ing dick on a biscuit

[Mans0n]

/lock

[-zeroSKILL-]

No need to lock it. There's no flaming, and just because you don't like what's being said doesn't mean it should be locked. Another similar thread will just pop up later.

If you don't like your views/beliefs being threatened by logic you don't have to read the posts here.

Now it's my turn to watch bix's vids.

Has been an lol thread btw. Enjoyed the read so far.