Old 12-29-2010, 10:39 PM   #441
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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And so she says
Fixed. I'm a girl type thing. Thanks.

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We can all have opinions, back and forth about wrong and not wrong. Kilroy says God doesn't exist, and so it isn't wrong. What does that have to do with anything? That is looking skin deep at the problem.
Well here's the thing. Everything you typed after this point is total BS.


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If there is no God, then you believe in evolution.
.....what? Faulty inductive leap of the century.

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People talk about a gay gene, when really it is just some alterations in genetic makeup. If it was a gene, it would be bred out, because NO ONE would be passing it on. That leaves it being and error/mutation/disorder. It is obviously not beneficial, because it is the type of thing that if it was a gene, natural selection would always breed OUT of the human race. Only human "intelligence"(and I use this term loosely) would have caused it not be bred out, if it was a gene.
More to biology than genetics, sweetheart, and it's all just as immutable. Just the same, genetics is somewhat more complex than what your agenda-driven sunday school teacher told you.

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We can say God this, or No God that, but how about just looking at the topic of Gay being right or wrong in your Godless world, because we all know where the issue would stand in a world WITH God.
There is no God. God is a contradiction in terms. I'm betting an eternity of unimaginable suffering that I'm right, so you ought to take this seriously. In a Godless world, homosexuality is pretty much fine. I'm a utilitarian, so, I have a standard to refer to. Fags ****ing fags increases cumulative happiness. Seems good to me!
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Old 12-30-2010, 12:33 AM   #442
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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People talk about a gay gene, when really it is just some alterations in genetic makeup. If it was a gene, it would be bred out, because NO ONE would be passing it on. That leaves it being and error/mutation/disorder. It is obviously not beneficial, because it is the type of thing that if it was a gene, natural selection would always breed OUT of the human race. Only human "intelligence"(and I use this term loosely) would have caused it not be bred out, if it was a gene.
because clearly never in the history of the world with nearly all societies that led to the modern western world did anyone pretend to be straight for fear of persecution, or execution, etc. and get married and procreate out of the perceived social obligation to do so

also clearly the existence of this gene would create a binary where you're either super-gay or super-straight and your outward expression of your sexuality would only result from the existence of that gene rather than your environment and social pressures

also clearly in the modern world natural selection takes place because we have such a difficult time with our environments (which we built ourselves in order to not have to deal with the environment) and our only goals in life are to procreate
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:59 AM   #443
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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because clearly never in the history of the world with nearly all societies that led to the modern western world did anyone pretend to be straight for fear of persecution, or execution, etc. and get married and procreate out of the perceived social obligation to do so

also clearly the existence of this gene would create a binary where you're either super-gay or super-straight and your outward expression of your sexuality would only result from the existence of that gene rather than your environment and social pressures

also clearly in the modern world natural selection takes place because we have such a difficult time with our environments (which we built ourselves in order to not have to deal with the environment) and our only goals in life are to procreate
and also clearly genes can never be recessive, and lay dormant until a specific generation

also clearly every gene which doesn't help with reproduction has been rooted out of the human population, which is why there are no life-threatening genetic conditions. Nope. Not one in the entire world.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:39 PM   #444
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

And clearly all the passive-aggressive sarcasm makes you all look like very rational and reasonable people.
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Old 12-30-2010, 04:01 PM   #445
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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Being gay is not wrong. Like WAC said, there's literally a gay gene. I know countless gay people and they're not bad people, they lead normal lives just like you and me, they just have sex with someone of the same sex. Oh well, get over it.

This.

Yet I still wonder why this thread is in CT
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Old 12-30-2010, 04:18 PM   #446
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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And clearly all the passive-aggressive sarcasm makes you all look like very rational and reasonable people.
Appearences are in the eye of the beholder here. I'm not going to bother myself with trying to play to other people's biases just to try and make the point get through. It's too much damn work, it feels dirty, and I don't even get paid for it.
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Old 12-30-2010, 04:47 PM   #447
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

You'll bother to weight and bias your word choice and tone to communicate contempt and disregard for another's opinions. That seems like more work than just stating your response clearly and concisely.
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Old 12-30-2010, 05:10 PM   #448
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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You'll bother to weight and bias your word choice and tone to communicate contempt and disregard for another's opinions. That seems like more work than just stating your response clearly and concisely.
It would be if I didn't have more practice at it. Also, I was clear and concise, just catty at the same time. Of course, it doesn't help that the subject of discussion is PEOPLE. The discussion is literally "Are gay people's experiences valid?" Do you not see how the mere nature of the discussion already puts it way over the line in terms of unbiased discourse and turns it into a war? If I'm not allowed to self-define because another person uncritically privileges their perspective and then couples it with rejection, then I am inclined to undermine their sense of privilege in any way I can. At any rate I am not the aggressor, even if the actual aggressor is often ignorant of their status as aggressor.
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Old 12-30-2010, 05:20 PM   #449
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

Subjective experiences really aren't fair game for a discussion which demands "proof". If I was fond of stabbing people, and they were not so fond, would it be fair of me to ask them to "prove" that they experienced pain as a direct result of my actions? How would they even do this? How does one prove the validity of any personal experience when someone elects to question it?
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Old 01-2-2011, 04:07 PM   #450
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

also clearly in the modern world natural selection takes place because we have such a difficult time with our environments (which we built ourselves in order to not have to deal with the environment) and our only goals in life are to procreate[/quote]

From a Darwinian perspective, it is naturally wrong to be gay. ("our only goals in life are to procreate")

Is it moral to cause harm to yourself?
Is it moral to cause harm to others?

If both of these are seen to be immoral, than I feel certain aspects of homosexuality are immoral. [Mod Edit: removed very inappropriate remark] At the same time, nobody should be denied the ability to follow their emotions. Who are we to keep people from loving each other?

I don't think it is wrong to be gay, but I do feel that certain "gay acts" are wrong.

Last edited by devonin; 01-2-2011 at 04:34 PM..
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Old 01-2-2011, 04:17 PM   #451
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

If God exists, then it's wrong. If God doesn't exist, then it's not.

So let's just prove that God exists.

Come on guys...
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Old 01-2-2011, 04:34 PM   #452
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

You'd have to prove a lot more than just existance for God, to use that to conclude that homosexuality was wrong.
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Old 01-2-2011, 05:01 PM   #453
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

You're right, but if God exists, can we prove Him wrong (he believes being gay is "wrong," right?)?

Also, let's start with proving that God exists, and then we can move on to the other topics lmfao
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Old 01-2-2011, 05:05 PM   #454
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

Prove God exists. <-- May never truly happen.

Translate the bible to ONE universal translation. <-- This will never happen.

Life is an opinion. It's different for everyone.
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Old 01-2-2011, 06:27 PM   #455
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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Translate the bible to ONE universal translation. <-- This will never happen.
Also, prove God wrote the Bible. Huge uncritical assumption. If I were a theist I would be more inclined to think the devil wrote it, considering how much hatred and misery has been caused by the Christian religion.

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From a Darwinian perspective, it is naturally wrong to be gay. ("our only goals in life are to procreate")
Nature contains no right and wrong, it only contains matters of fact. From an evolutionary perspective, being gay decreases the chances of reproduction for a given animal. It does not decrease the chances of reproduction for a given species though, at least not in any form in which it is actually found in nature. Is it wrong for a specific animal not to reproduce? For that matter, would it be wrong if an entire species didn't? Well if it is, it's not because of evolutionary theory because evolutionary theory is a description of reality and not an ethical system. Good work getting the two mixed up. By which I mean something much crueler which I probably couldn't get away with posting.

But I would mean it.

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Is it moral to cause harm to yourself?
Is it moral to cause harm to others?
Maybe and no. Anyways, homosexuality and even "homosexual acts" don't do either of these.

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Old 01-3-2011, 03:59 PM   #456
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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Also, prove God wrote the Bible. Huge uncritical assumption. If I were a theist I would be more inclined to think the devil wrote it, considering how much hatred and misery has been caused by the Christian religion.
Good point, never thought of that actually. To be honest, I never thought of who actually did write the bible. Very nice point, respect given.
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Old 01-3-2011, 04:43 PM   #457
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

Just hypothetically:

It is a pretty big assumption, but (and this is just an opinion) if you could prove or disprove the existence of a specific God you could probably extrapolate to figure out whether or not the Bible was the writing of God channeled through humans.
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Old 01-3-2011, 05:37 PM   #458
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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Just hypothetically:

It is a pretty big assumption, but (and this is just an opinion) if you could prove or disprove the existence of a specific God you could probably extrapolate to figure out whether or not the Bible was the writing of God channeled through humans.
Well, if you could prove the existence of the biblical god then of course it would follow that the bible was the word of god. That would be an oddly extremely specific sort of proof though. Considering the difficulty in finding proof of any variety, even abductive, for even a supernatural occurence (let alone a specific supernatural occurence). I mean, hypothetically speaking looking at an Eldritch Abomination causes madness, but clearly issuing admonitions against the danger of this is a waste of breath.
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Old 01-9-2011, 09:23 AM   #459
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

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And clearly all the passive-aggressive sarcasm makes you all look like very rational and reasonable people.
This post isn't on topic. If anything, it's a catalyst for more off-topic comments.

Being gay is not a choice. It is part of who you are, and should not be viewed as right or wrong. This thread is a mockery. What's next? "Is being black wrong?"



p.s. - Cenright might want to read the fallacies sticky.
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Old 01-9-2011, 10:28 AM   #460
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Default Re: Is it wrong to be gay?

You'll notice that the OP wasn't suggesting it was wrong to be gay or even that there was any basis to assume that being gay was wrong.

The actual opening statement of the thread was "I'm gay, and I simply don't understand where the people who have a problem with that are coming from, please, explain to me why you think being gay is wrong"

ie. The dissenting opinions you're taking as a horrible affront were specifically asked for -by- someone who is a part of the group the opinions are directed against.

Further, while a great deal of evidence suggests that there is a large genetic componant to homosexuality, that's not actually something that has been -proven- or at least, it's not been proven that 100% of all homosexuals were born that way and have no choice in the matter, and that nobody chooses or develops that way later in life.
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