Old 10-2-2006, 09:51 PM   #61
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

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Originally Posted by Ryusei_ View Post
While browsing around a while ago, I found an intersting story of how the devil is not even really an original creation of Christianity. (Well...The image of him, anyways)

As we all know, compared to most other well known religions, Christianity is like the newborn of the bunch. Many of Christianity's holidays and beliefs are actually borrowed from other religions. The same hold true for both the image and role of the devil.

In a lot of celtic religions, (I suppose this would be modern day Wicca or Paganism) they worship, for the most part, a god and a goddess. The goddess, essentially, is Mother Earth. The god, however, was their god of the hunt. They also knew him as "The Horned God" due to the fact that he did have antlers...Or what would be on the modern devil..."horns"

Now again, most of these religions practiced and studied magick, or witchcraft. Given most of the history of Christianity, they've basically tried to kill or wipe out anything that their god couldn't explain, or simply threatened their own religion. The same held true for these people, the worshipers of "The Horned God" and their practiced. (Salem witch trials are a good example) ...Christianity believed that this, because of their supposed evil natures and the ability to control things such as nature, or even people, had to come from some great sorce of evil. Basically, their anti-god, Satan.

So, upon learning what they did worship, and because of the image they did have for their god, Christianity thought that this was their Satan and in a sense, adopted the image. This is also why Wicca or any form of it, is viewed by most people to be satanic. Also the same reason that most Christians believe that the pentagram (my avatar) is a symbol of satanism as well.

*note* If there are any spelling or grammar errors in any of this, I do apologize. I will edit them as I see them but I wrote this just after waking up from a nap. Cut me a little slack
Yeah, that's actually something I try and point out to people that imagine Satan as some satyr-like creature. That all goes back to the Papacy in ancient days more or less trying to stamp out all forms of Paganism. What better way than to take something pagans revered and twist it into the ultimate symbol of evil?

The thing is, there is nowhere, Biblically, that mentions anything about the way that Satan appears. All the different variations we have on him/her stems from an artist's interpretation. I personally see him along the lines of how he's depicted in the movie "The Devil's Advocate" (not that I think that Al Pacino is the devil, but just the idea visualized in that movie, is more or less how I envision him.) or perhaps how Milton paints him in Paradise Lost. The whole grizzly beast that Satan is in many anti-pagan arts, or grotesque monstrosities that he appears to be in stuff like Dante's Inferno, it's just not how I think of him.
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Old 10-2-2006, 10:05 PM   #62
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

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The thing is, there is nowhere, Biblically, that mentions anything about the way that Satan appears.
"And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth . . . And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him." (Revelation 12:3-9)

Satan is a red dragon with seven heads and 10 horns.
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Old 10-2-2006, 10:29 PM   #63
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

I've been pwnt.

Although I believe that part is more or less one not to be taken literally. Partly, because "seven heads." There's rarely a point in the Bible where the number seven is used to actually mean one more than six and one less than eight, but is a number used more or less to mean "many" which is kind of bizarre.

Off topic, though. Also written long before there was a Papacy as we knew it, seeing as John the Revelator actually lived in Jesus' life time, so it's not invoking images sacred to other religions so much as it's just painting a picture that most cultures would recognize as a great evil.

Anyone else find it weird how large, firebreathing flying lizards seem to be a staple in so many of the ancient world's great works and mythologies, even in places that never had any contact with each other those particular stories were written?
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Old 10-2-2006, 10:36 PM   #64
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

We had a topic some time back that discussed the Bible itself, and this website was posted.

http://ffrf.org/quiz/bquiz.php

I'll tell you right now that it's an anti-religion website. That doesn't mean their information is wrong. The answers to this quiz come straight out of the Bible.

Now you know the answer to #22 =/
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Old 10-2-2006, 10:50 PM   #65
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

*reads a bit on their explaination to the answers*

Seems a lot of their problems stem from things written in the Old Testament which is Jewish law, rather than Christian law, which Jesus had more or less defined as a new starting point making a lot of the Mosaic laws outmoded and no longer practiced.

Still, it's an interesting read. I just wish that anti-religion sites were able to take things in context for a change of pace.
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Old 10-3-2006, 08:18 PM   #66
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

Back to topic, The Devil didn't create Hell, God did. God cast Satan into Hell for punishment. Satan supposedly I guess controls Hell(an assumption by most people? i havent read the bible really) but it probably wasn't intended that way, it just happened because of perhaps free will and the fact that he was the first to be sent there. I may be wrong as im not die-hard religious, but that is what I think.

Why would God kill Satan? Satan is one of God's servants. God has forgiveness for all of his creations, including Satan. During the Apocalypse supposedly all will be saved and allowed to return to Heaven, including Satan himself.
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Old 10-7-2006, 03:34 PM   #67
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

While I respect you think he is "evil", evil and good are sides of opinions. If you mean the devil is "immoral, unfair, or unjust" then yes, that's taken into account. BY THE WAY...did you know by rearranging the word "SANTA" you can make "SATAN"? I think I'm on to something
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Old 10-8-2006, 03:43 PM   #68
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

Well, I personally believe the devil is evil. If you think about it, and look at the context, the devil himself is not punishing the people, the devil is being punished by God. So anyone who is in hell is in a bad place, because the judgement is coming from God, not the devil. In hell, the devil does not rule, he is a prisoner there for eternity, and the people in hell are prisoners with him, not his "subjects" or "servants". Pretty straightforward.
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Old 10-10-2006, 09:38 AM   #69
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

Here's an argument that does not have the word "belief" or any of its conjugations (hell, I'm not even Christian, I'm just engaged to a religion major):

It doesn't take an etymologist to see that "Devil" is merely a consonant added to the word "evil". An etymologist could probably explain why the letter "D" preceeds it (my assumption would be because of the word Diablo).

Of course, the word "devil" does not always refer to Satan (consider how often it's used plurally). The fact that Satan and "The Devil" makes an argument that he is the epitome of that which devils represent.

Now, if we define "evil" as the opposite of good, and God is the supreme goodness, then the being that opposed God in holy war would be evil (opposite...opposed...heh heh).

Therefore, The Devil is evil.
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Old 10-10-2006, 09:56 PM   #70
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

Who is to say that the devil is a person or a being? Maybe it's the force that works against God. Maybe Satan was just the temptation that overtook the serpent in Genesis. Maybe Satan just categorizes all the temptations Jesus experienced in the wilderness.

That's not my opinion though. Satan does not punish us or rule over hell. He is simply the first being to be cast into hell. Hell is described as a pool of fire, where you experience infinite lonliness. What can Satan do if you never come in contact with him? Satan is simply the cause of all of our temptation and the reason why we can sin today. I would call that evil.
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Old 10-11-2006, 12:23 AM   #71
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

It seems like the majority of people here realize that Satan is a prisoner of Hell and not ruler of it.

This makes me wonder why all forms of media portray him as the ruler of Hell rather than what he is: a desperate, bitter fallen creation of God trying to spite his maker by corrupting some of God's other creations.
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Old 12-16-2006, 11:30 PM   #72
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

i didnt read if people wrote this already but, the devil WANTS you to do bad stuff cus he wants to hurt you/cause pain. therefore devil=evil. take the d outta devil and waddya get?
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Old 12-17-2006, 12:28 AM   #73
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Default Re: The Devil (Evil or misunderstood?)

You get a bumped thread from two months ago.
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