Quote:
Originally Posted by MixMasterLar
Oh people have given me examples before I'm good on that.
I'm asking for a definition so we can have a deeper conversation then our standard "be nice in a game about not being nice" discussions.
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I don't think a fine definition exists, if there was one, I would've attempted to supply it in my first post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MixMasterLar
No, but blaming me for being toxic (whatever that term means here) was more preferable to town then admiting their faults.
This whole thread sprang from those accusations and if this is going to just be a call out thread it'll be really cool if people dropped the pretense and just called me out like we're adults.
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I want to be clear, and I really should've done this in the first post, this is not calling out you or anyone specifically. Almost all of us have been toxic before. Bolth listed me as non-toxic, but I'd say I really crossed some lines in the Animal Crossing game, to name a recent(ish) instance. Its probably got no exceptions that, if you've been playing the game for as long as most of us have, you've been toxic at least once.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charu
I guess I should expand, time for shower thoughts (literally as I type this)
The act of name calling or challenging someone's logic isn't the issue. It's how players go about it at an extreme negative angle to purposely provoke a player.
For example...
"The hell are you talking about? I've explained why I believe (player) is (guilty/notguilty) if you look at my previous posts!?"
To...
"What the fuck are you talking about you fucking moron? I've explained why I believe (player) is (guilty/notguilty) multiple fucking times. Learn how to read dipshit or stop being bad at the game."
Both convey the same message, but its pretty clear which one is intended to provoke a player negatively.
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I think this is as good of a definition as it will get; the difference between these two.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MixMasterLar
Ok cool but that description of toxicity can really only be answered by me making the same response I already have and we've already started a circle.
The only consistant throughline in everyone's definition is that post made them feel victimized and unless the accusation is that people are intentionally victimizing players in the game then that's something largely iut of ny control unless I just adopt a game strategy that involves no pushing and that's honestly half the game. Or more, since when people don't feel pressure they don't play the game instead
As currently described, you're not going to get toned down responses/pushes unless you start a list of banned words like idiot, dolt, fuckface, whatever but everyone doesn't want censorship and since the sin here really is, when you boil the complaints down, people taking it personal and not the words themselves censoring isn't gonna matter.
Like if Airhead is the worst insult I'm allowed to say and I call someone an airhead and they recognize that I used the worst insult that I could, they're still going to get their feelings hurt regardless of what word actually got used.
"Don't use insults", while at least being quantifiable and enforceable, isn't super practical in a game that gets heated by nature (you know with the fact that you're either lying to your friends or know for a fact that if the game is still happening, a friend is lying to you).
Last post on the issue. I've no more to say and frankly this community's repeated unwillingness to actually play the game (inactivity, unwillingness for town to do basic town things like reads, cross examine or vote apparently) make me not want to engage it. Blaming this last game going sideways on me for being angry at Bug is just the cherry on top of the sundae.
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I'm not in favor of banning any specific words, aside from words that are already banned by FFR as a whole (and I don't really think there's a hard list of these anywhere).
Quote:
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Originally Posted by 4747500
I don't think anybody is saying that? I'm pretty sure people acknowledge that many town players fucked up hard in this game.
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Make no mistake, that was one of the worst town performances I've seen on FFR, both to Lar and to agree with raeko. This thought can be expressed in a way other than "none of the towns gave a fuck and lost to the worst fucking fakeclaim I've ever seen, which really goes to show how stupid town was"
I won't spend 1,000 words (or more xd) talking about this game since its not the postgame thread, but its just a singular example.
I would say that Lar played the best out of town, but that's not an excuse to behave in such a manner, especially considering I think bug played nearly as well and is the last person town should "blame" for a loss. (finding people to blame is another subject entirely)
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On this subject, I believe that this is a team game. You win as a team, and you lose as a team. Stats fall a bit short here in this department, and certainly its very hard to blame someone who had perfect reads on the first day phase, and died at the wolves hand on the very first night, but there is no such thing as a perfect game.
And most-most importantly, winning and losing just doesn't matter as much as I thought it did. I hope some other people are either here or get here. We can play this game 1,000 times under the same setup and find out as much as we can about the particular setup dynamics if we want, and we can even see who has the highest winrates, etc. It doesn't matter because we will never do this, and even if we did, its not really what we should be trying to get out of the game.
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On the subject of policing toxicity, its part of why I want another moderator (or maybe even two to bring it back to the size of 5 from the past). It shouldn't be just one person deciding whether or not something is toxic. I don't know what the punishments would be for being toxic, I don't know where the line would be drawn, but I think these are things that do need to be decided, probably after deciding on the new mod(s).