[Afrobean]

Originally Posted by devonin

Is there an "Outside the game info" rule that might be coming into play here? If they were posting on not this forum, and not on AIM to another player, can that stuff even count?

Not unless I'm getting info from someone who isn't playing. So long as the people are playing, any medium of conversation is acceptable. AIM, MSN, IRC. Why wouldn't a message board be viable forum of discussion?

The only exception is IRL, I think. That was definitely made a rule back when I played that people who knew each other IRL couldn't play together because it gave them an unfair advantage of being able to read body language. You guys probably don't enforce this anyway though.

Originally Posted by devonin

I'm very sure that afro is a wolf

That chat we had yesterday doesn't indicate this. You say it, but your words belie your true intent. The real situation is that you're afraid of me. You're afraid of what I might say or do. You claim unfounded confidence that is very out of character considering all of the other things you have said (question me for saying "killing freaky was a dumb move for the wolves", but then turn around and have utmost confidence without good reason?).

If you want to lynch me, whatever. I can totally see why you would want me dead, regardless of your role. Kind of foolish for a green to try to lynch a green, but I can totally understand you thinking I'm a loose cannon and that I'd be more harm than good for the team. I myself have gotten behind plenty of lynches where I figured the person being lynched was probably green, but it was justified in one way or another. For example, last game, I figured makilaz was probably green, but I figured he was a decent enough process-of-elimination choice. Prior to that, I voted to lynch A2P even though I had great confidence in his being green. I did it to save myself. There are plenty of good reasons for a person to vote to lynch a green and only one of them requires you being red.

So just ****ing admit it. Don't lie through your teeth. Don't claim confidence that you clearly don't have. Just say "I think Afro is dangerous to the team even as a human". At least that would be honest.

Originally Posted by iggymatrixcounter

That's not entirely true, do not underestimate me afro. I can pick out wolves with better than random picking.

I know. That's why I said "isn't much more of a threat". You're more valuable as a human than most active players, just not WAY more valuable (which is what you'd be if this was a blue-centric game, I'd say).

If you want to find wolves, do not look in the spotlight, wolves are 80% hidden but under the radar. It takes a special kind of skill to be a wolf in the lime light. They always get caught or slip up or something. For instance, most of the votes are based off what the loudest people are saying. Look at people's posts, but also look at their lack of posts, how they post compared to other times they post. More wolves find themselves being on the brink of being inactive at times.

How many times has Manti posted so far??

Then you really shouldn't vote for manti, he also falls into the same, better alive than dead, category as you. Even if you do not like to admit it, he's a good player.

You're more valuable than Manti. He's no more helpful to the cause than any other active player, and if you notice, he hasn't been active either.

Originally Posted by FictionJunction

arfo wants devonin dead but is voting for manti to try to survive the lynch.

Not exactly bro. I want you dead. I want to attack devonin. And I'm voting Manti because:

#1: relatively high up on my list
#2: save myself
#3: manti isn't even being active
#4: manti's strength is absent in this game

And edu, man, don't think I didn't notice that you, when trying to get me off your back didn't immediately say you'd vote manti. You mentioned a few other things you'd do, but not one of them was joining me with a vote on manti. You didn't until after I said that's what I'd like to see from you. Very much of a connection in mind. Seems to me that you were afraid to sacrifice your partner, but you eventually decided it was worth it to get me in your pocket.

But the thing I don't see is why you'd bother trying to get me in your pocket when you're going to wolf me tonight if I manage to survive the day.

Originally Posted by devonin

Afro is clearly grasping at straws to try and not die because he knows he's in trouble.

lmao you are so bad at this game

Voting to try to avoid being lynched isn't explicitly red behavior. It's something that ALL players do.

Explain to me how he can be sure Manti and I are working together, -and- be sure that A2P and YOU are wolves, when there's only three wolves in the game?

I've basically dropped my case on a2p completely now. After talking with you, then talking with fiction, I'm thinking you+fiction+manti.

Which fits into my theory of Syhto cherry-picking the roles.

Originally Posted by devonin

What I did was say "I woudln't just conclude 'durr wolves are dumm' when we have no real information as to -why- they picked him" that's all.

I didn't conclude that either.

I said it was a dumb kill.

Which it is.

Had they left freaky alive, I would have been hammering him all day. He probably would have been lynched.

What you're referring to is the insults I peppered in to see if I'd get a rise out of anyone, or get anyone defending the kill. You defended it and were personally offended by it (while manti was just offended by it if I recall). In the chat log, you even said I called you a moron. Never happened. I called the wolves "idiots" if I recall, but I never personally insulted you. I've told you that you're really bad at this game, but if you would equate that to a personal insult, then I really don't know what to think about you personally anymore. I don't see how anyone truly intelligent could take such great offense when I tell you you're bad at a game that you readily admit to not excelling at.

Originally Posted by FictionJunction

I never said my vote was solid. I'll change it. I'm just giving arfo some peace of mind so he can lay off my back.

Why try to get me to lay off your back if you're just going to ensure my death at the last minute anyway?

Originally Posted by iggymatrixcounter

Which if this was the case, his vote change should have gone to viccia which would have given her three votes and afro only two, thus saving himself from being in the lead.

I haven't any faith in viccica being a wolf. I've got a lot of faith in manti being a wolf.

I still find it curious that if afro is playing the, "I'm better alive than dead" card, that he wouldn't think that that rule would also apply to manti as well.

Manti's strength lies in abusing alliances to process-of-elimination catch wolves.

He has no greater worth to the team in this game than any other reasonably intelligent and active player.

He isn't some great god in my eyes. I'm not going to abstain from voting for him when I have confidence in his being a wolf because I don't feel as though he is worth more alive than dead. A bit of a double standard, I suppose, but just look at the simple situation: manti is out of his element, and he's not even being especially active or helpful.

So he must 1) REALLY think manti is a wolf 2) found some reason to think devon is not a wolf or 3) vic is a wolf and his vote on manti causes a three way tie between himself, vic, and manti (hoping that manti gets more votes).

I'd sacrifice a wolf partner in a second to save myself. Actually, I think I have done this in the past. Please don't look at me avoiding viccica in favor of manti and think that we might be wolves together because of this. If you want to look for red motives in my vote on manti, try telling it as though I'm just looking to get revenge for a few games back where manti was a red and I couldn't get him lynched. It would be really sweet as a red to get manti lynched, and during day 1, no less.

@afro: care to explain why the vote change to manti was significant enough to leave devo, someone who you talked about as suspicious the whole day. Also somewhere in your posts you mention fiction and a2p as "definitely wolves" and yet offer no vote to really support it. Your suspects imo are usually all over the place, but your final vote is usually sound and I'm having problems accepting it (and don't say it's day1 and it doesn't matter, that's not my point, it's more of why your vote on manti doesn't really reflect your best suspicion based on your posts).

I was going almost totally on gut with a2p.

With manti, we have him randomly attacking me, then going inactive. Plus gut.

With fiction we have him voting (read: bandwagoning) on me with minimal hesitation. This is quite out of character for him. Look at last game where he hesitated to vote for u84 even when it was quite clear that u84 had faked a log. He didn't bother voting for him until after the guy was already instalynched. Regardless of the fact that the lynch ended up being a bad one, it was built on good reason, and the guy went to lengths to abstain. In this case, there is minimal-- or, really-- no reason and yet he didn't seem to have a problem pushing me along toward the gallows. And on day 1. I'd think he of all people would recognize the fact that I shouldn't be lynched so early in the game with so little reason. Notice also that he is the sort of person that would intentionally kill freaky, knowing it was a bad choice, and do it for a laff.

With devonin, there's the inconsistencies in his both demanding solid evidence when I say "the wolf kill was bad" but then turning around and saying he is COMPLETELY confident that I'm a wolf with no evidence. The reason he is voting for me is that he's afraid of me, not that he is COMPLETELY confident that I'm a wolf. I can understand why a green would be afraid of me getting them lynched, but I think a red has even more reason to be scared of me, since that's who I'm aiming for. But even apart from that, there's that ENTIRE log fiction posted for me. I'll begin a massive dissection of it in just a moment.

AFRO (4) manti, a2p, devo, fiction
VIC (2) iggy, tupa
MANTI (2) vic, afro
DEVON (0) (afro)
FICTION (1) lito

Fiction moved his vote off of me and onto manti. That would have been KiB with me and manti, but makilaz popped up out of nowhere to twist the knife in my back.