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Old 07-15-2009, 08:57 AM   #48
Reach
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Default Re: 1 + 1 = Invalid: cannot add distinct objects

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What you are saying is that we perceive uncertainty. Heisenbergs uncertainty principle does not prove that there is uncertainty in the universe, just that we cannot measure two things at the same time. Also, quantum mechanics is still relatively new. All forms of science are relatively new if you think about it. Considering how much we have learned in the last couple of centuries, consider what we will know in a few more. Obviously we can never understand everything, that would be a paradox, but I think it would be really interesting to see how people view the universe in a few more centuries.
More specifically, that we perceive uncertainty *by necessity of the laws of the universe*, and we'll never be able to change this.

It doesn't show that the universe itself is not causally linked, no, however, Heisenberg uncertainty does prove there is uncertainty in the universe relative to any observer...look at what you just said. If you cannot measure two quantum properties with precision at the same time that means there is an unknown, or uncertain variable.

Really, my point is that you need to differentiate between uncertainty, which involves knowing, and the behavior of the universe as a whole.

It's key to understand why we observe Heisenberg uncertainty - the reason the effect occurs is because by measuring one variable, you change the other. That is, the effect of observing changes the outcome of the event, or in other words, *the effect of knowing* changes the outcome of the event.

And thus there will *always* be uncertainty, because in order to know and be certain, you have to change the outcome and be uncertain.


Anyway, I'm still not really disagreeing with you, rather, I'm expanding on your point that I felt was a bit simplistic. You could argue much more strongly that everything in the universe is causally connected rather than nothing is uncertain, because they're two different issues.
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