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Old 03-4-2004, 04:08 AM   #4
Anonymous
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Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,088
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Its a nice start.

Unlike alot of similar discussions you seemed to steer it towards a more religeous line of thinking. The belief of a supreme being is always a vague subject at best and when combined with a philosophical view of "free will", it appears to become a sort of set of psuedo random thoughts. But, that's exactly what you did though right? =)

This question has been asked many times before and people usually end up along the lines of "If there is such a thing as fate, and everything is predetermined, then choice is an illusion and consciesce thought is just the catalyst for the formula." But when basing your logic on the thoery predetermined events, you must also realise that in order for this to be possible, time would also have to be an illusion. Reason being: if no choices exist and only one possible future is available, then it has already occurred because the properties of the past that ensure it are already in place and irrefutable. Thus, the ability of "free will" cannot exist and neither does time; they are merely tools for which to measure differences of events and explain a perfectly straight line of logic in a sequence of events. So you see, because you suggest the possibility that free will doesn't exist, you are also suggesting that everything is predetermined and unchangeable and also that time doesn't exist.

Does that make sense? If not, let me try to draw out the paradox clearer.

Quote:
Now does free means that there is an absence of conditioning, constraints and control over what we think, say and do? (And to be aware of and be able to set ourselves "free" from such in the first place.)
If conditioning eliminates the possibility of free will, then everything must be predetermined or else nothing could exist at all. If everything is predetermined, then time itself is an illusion, along with thought. I already explained this, no need to go into further detail.

Now, if we have full choice, or even partial choice (even the tiniest amount negates this), this doesn't apply in the least bit. Instead the world
is always changing on an unpredictable path along a jagged line with a continuity of proportional existence equal to one (I'm referencing the "one universe theory" if you weren't sure) with an unlimited set of possibilities and probabilities calculated at infinitessimal intervals on the infinite tablet of matter.

NOW, I've explained the paradox in your question, here comes the REAL question. If I DO have free will, and thoughts that are unique to my persona that DON'T come from environmental influences nor genetic predetermination, then where DOES this "IDENTITY" of me come from?

Answer that question, or heck, come up with a good non religeous theory and you can color me impressed.
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