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Specforces 04-2-2004 07:26 AM

Theory of American Idealism
 
There has been and probably will be for quite a while much discussion about Ayn Rand and her contribution to philosophy(not on the FFR forums) :wink: , her philosophy of "objectivism" and "selfishness". It seems to me that although she was born in Russia, she was born with an American soul. The American soul has become quite a horrible thing. Selfish, self absorbed, money hungry, volatile, you don't have to think too much to realize why David Bowie wrote a song a few years back called I am Afraid of Americans. It has really gotten to the point where I really cannot deal with anyone that lives in New York City (I am from Long Island). I can only describe New Yorkers as blood thristy vampires, and no one realizes that Sex and the City the hit HBO show is really a barrel of malarky. Real life is definitely more like the Metro channels Single in the City where you see darlings manipulating five men to see who will tweak out first out of jealousy or a Lara Croft lookalike working for a Private Investigator to nab a cheating yuppie so his wife will divorce him and she will get all the cash.

I really cannot believe what has happened to this world, although I know that New York is a rather brutal and tribal place which is the real reason old Blue eyes (Frank Sinatra) sang "if you can make it here, you can make it anywhere". I think the real problem with the USA is greed. We are so eager and ready to hunt out Communists, so we can open another superstore filled with a trillion more items then we can possibly ever need to buy ever, especially since the store next door carries the same things. I am not for Communism because I don't think it accords with man's nature but perhaps something in between Communism and Capitalism would be good because this is getting disgusting.

I understand the term "filth pigs" and perhaps most people are pigs but I believe that is a sad reflection of mankind. I refuse to look at other people as pigs, we are or should be beyond that. Our animal nature is the absolute worst and most distasteful part about us and this is not coming from some intellectual snob, but a regular Joe who is just about fed up with all the bullshit that I see. Capitalism wants pigs, television wants pigs. People are scared to do anything but consume, because someone told them that life wasn't for them. I believe however that life was once about the Common Joe but he gave it away. I am currently reading On the Road by Jack Kerouac and I am utterly surprised at how he always found a nice person to give him a lift so he could get on to his destination. I don't know, maybe New York has made me too hard, but I would bet that in these days Americans from anywhere are probably too scared to pick up a stranger in need of some free miles. Perhaps I am too cynical but I think all of these Law, Court, Police, Crime, Murder television dramas are brainwashing the populace into being afraid of everyone and into not trusting a soul. I mean how often do these crimes that you see on CSI actually occur in real life? I could be dead wrong here but it seems strange I never read about any of it in the paper. Maybe I read about 1 crazy murder a month like the case of the California man who killed his wife and unborn baby. That wasn't even a New York crime. Why do I hardly ever hear about minority gang war fatalities? Do they exist? All I know is that every few days some American or Europeans are dying senseless deaths guarding Iraqi art museums. That gets reported, thats news.

But I promised philosophy and not just politics. Is the death of good-will and good feelings in the community a step towards totalitarianism. Was the "specter" of Socialism hidden in the ships that discovered America? Could that be what that new movie The Pirates of the Carribean is really symbolically about, or is it just another fantasy tale talking about people that have never and will never matter in the history of civilization. For me, things are not always what they seem. And what of the lack of trust? It seems to be that the lack of trust is the most conspicuous problem in America. Most of the people that I have known in my life either have covertly or overtly hold dearly to the motto "trust no one". Now on one level this is good common sense but on another and perhaps deeper level, is it even worth living in a world where you can't trust anyone? Now maybe I am taking things a bit to literaly but its really just to make a point. In my eyes, if you can't trust people, you will never be an important person. Throughout my life, people have always been able to tell me anything with the confidence that I would protect their message and that I wouldn't share it with bad people. That is perhaps the best feeling in the world, simply when someone trusts you because they know who you are. Honestly, I don't know how people live without that feeling but they do. These people are barely breathing and they are a scourge to the earth.

What can be done? I think that the people on the bottom of society in America as well in Europe are there because they are selfish and self-absorbed. Once you climb out of your needs and wants for even a short time you realize that there is a bigger world out there that needs improvement and it is your responsibilty to do it, which may in fact come at the price of some sacrifice. Ayn Rand is the first to preach about foregoing sacrifice and just saying me, me, me, and the last to realize that she made some serious sacrifices to get wealthy (she was never happily married or never had kids). Perhaps "objectivism" is really just about turning the world into an object to be consumed. For the fact that 9 out of 10 educated and non-educated females hate to be objectified by men, it really disgusts me that Ms. Rand would push this load of sloth upon us.

I don't feel there needs to be radical solutions in order for change and progress of a different kind to occur in America and around the globe. Radical solutions rarely ever change anything as evidenced by Hannah Arendt's cruelly telling remark that "the most radical revolutionary is a conservative a day after the revolution." This means that the angry black oppressed man can become the fat greedy "white devil" caucasian with the drop of a hat. Of course no one wants to see this so they can keep their pockets full with excuses, ready to defend their mind with a "ruthless stubborness" (yes, a play on the Nazi's famous line "ruthless toughness") against anybody with a new point of view.

Change comes gradually and always superiorly through peacefull and intelligent moves. Change also comes slowly in small measured increments. Trying to change too fast leads to many people feeling resentment. So to reiterate the question: what can be done to make an unbearable world more bearable. Perhaps we should all slow down a bit and do somemore thinking and figure out a way to get out of our heads and into the real world, where real things are going on. American Idealism has polluted the world long enough, it is high time we focus on the practical, on what we can do for others. I believe it was Winston Churchill who said, "Ask not what your country can do with you, ask what you can do for your country." I know for most people struggling to survive and that means the poor and middle class, the common Joes, this quote has become a source of enfuriation. What I am saying is that perhaps it shouldn't. Perhaps we should temper our anger and rage and anxiety and see if we can get beyond the "me, me, me" syndrome and find out what people and our country really need from us.

Specforces

Varia 04-2-2004 12:09 PM

I think, to put it simply, the attitudes of Americans are that they are better than everyone else, and they can do what they want, simply because they can. I also see Americans exercising their 'right of free speech' in places where it doesn't apply, assuming they are right, and they can say whatever they want (mostly talking about internet). Free speech does not really apply on the internet unless whatever moderators allow it. Also, the thing about "I don't care, it's not mine" disturbs me. This is blatant disregard for others and their property. But if someone broke their stuff, ooooh girl i noe u di'nt ::snaps fingers; waves them around head sassy-like::. Yes, I often see that. I also hate to see the rest of the world envy us, and try to emulate Americans.

Anyways, America is pretty bad right now, especially the vision of White America.

Terrible.

alainbryden 04-2-2004 01:26 PM

I actually read that whole thing spec, and I agree with everything you said. That powerful society is spawning humans that are swelling with everything terrifying and loathsome about humans, including a reluctance to change.

DracIV 04-17-2004 10:39 PM

Spec, is your view biased? The fact that you experience the New Yorkers so much and the unpleasant culture they have may be jading your view on the entire country of America. Have you visited the South recently? I heard an Ohioan (an area not even a fifth as bad as NY) comment on how annoyingly disturbing it was that people were so amazingly friendly. Now, if you lived in a place where you could hear a comment like that, you'd realize that most of the comments you make do not apply to America, but to NY. "Me, me, me" does not exist in as widespread an area as you think. It exists in the media and in some big cities, but it most definately is not seen in a majority of America. Unequivocal friendliness is what I see. Acceptance of others, no matter race nor religion is what I see. True happiness in open freedom is what I see. Spec, you need a vacation.

alainbryden 04-18-2004 12:48 AM

It's got nothing to do with new york at all. Capatilism is North America.

Anonymous 04-18-2004 03:33 AM

When you say "Communism" goes against human nature, I think you're wrong. Living in a communal society builds trust and caring between all people (that's the goal anyways). Look at a close family. Do you see them hating each other when something good happens to one of them? They're usually genunely happy for them.

Communism as we know it however, should not even be considered. It's simply a dictatorship where the wealth is held in the hands of the ruling elites. THat's basically what we have in capitalism, except a little more progressive in some matters, like control of the means of production in the workers hand's and equal distribution of wealth, 2 things that never occurred in Soviet Russia the way they were suppossed to, or Cuba for that matter.

I was talking to a guy at work about Communism this morning and he said "Isn't that where they give you all your clothes and shit?" This is typical of the ideas most people have on different political systems.

I see Capitalism as a pyramid scheme. The few at the top control most of the wealth, and do the least work, while the people at the bottom put their health at risk for pittance making the ones at the top richer.

This is a worldwide phenomena and it has to be stopped for the sake of the masses. How can free thought exist among the working and middle class when all mass media is owned by the rich? We are bombarded with advertisements daily, and millions of people have the idea in the their head that if you don't pay ridiculous amounts for brand name items, you've wasted your money.

What most people don't realize, is that there is another way. We are in a society driven by wealth and personal satisfaction. If you have ridiculous amounts of money, you're suppossed to spend it on ridiculous things. Contribute to your economy by buying shit you don't need, while others around the world are starving to death.

We are told we live in democracies, but do we ever really get our say? Does casting a ballot every 4 years make you feel like you're doing something significant? When you were in school, didn't it piss you off having a torn up, vandalized textbook that you were expected to read?

In a more socially oriented government, less money would be spent on things like bio-weapons, and more deadly bombs, and more would be spent on educaiton, health care and other socially beneficial things than learning how to kill people.

Direct democracy means that everybody has their say, but it involves a lot of work, and self-education, which most are unwilling to do. As we become fatter and lazier, we're going to implode. Distrust and fear are growing, and our civil liberties are in question.

The thing that really gets me is this idea of "making america stronger." This is a very "communist" statement. The USA is a country where you're suppossed to gain your own wealth, and not direclty support others. If you look at who owns america, that motto basically implies making the people who run the country stronger, and richer. That's a lot like Stalin's rhetoric.


In case you didn't want to read all that, here's my point.

Our countries are toxic and dangerous. We breathe dangerous air, our water is filled with progesterone and chlorine, and we are simply cattle for the use of those that rule our countries. We need to have a direct system of democracy or we might as well just live in a dictatorship. Given the right circumstances, your life would be exactly the same as it is now in a dictatorship. Look at Saudi Arabia and China, they live very similar lifestyles there.

What do you think you're defending when you say you love your country? Your way of life? The way your government kills civilians in other countries to protect you? The way you can get food anywhere, while children in other countries dig though garbage dumps 10 hours a day looking for scrap metal to get their families a bowl of rice?

Anticrombie0909 04-18-2004 09:07 AM

You all had very good points, I'll address them in turn. First of all, Spec, I understand completely what you're saying about how the world, and particularily the US, has gone a bit insane, especially since we're supposed to be the responsible world leaders. However, we did have a few disadvantages. You know how they say that mutts arn't as good hunting dogs? Or thouroughbreds are better horses than mustangs? Think of our country as a mutt or a mustang. We've been around for about 200 years, we're one of the youngest countries alive, and we're probably the only country created recently that has any political status in the world at all (and don't cite me, I'm shooting out of the dark because I'm too lazy to research, and this is just to make a point). Every other country in the world had time to grow out of their violent stage, mature, and grow culture. But the US never had that.time period and was instantly shunted into a world where survival and war were of the greatest importance. The US probably has the highest wartime:peacetime ratio in the world.

Beyond that, I return to my mustang comment. The US has no culture of it's own, not really. We came from Britain, the Mexicans immigrated, and the French trickled down from Canada. We're a giant culture pot of cultures and lifestyles, and we lack a nationwide definition of anything. Because of this, it divides our country, worries us with issues of immigration, racism, and affirmative action, which other countries don't take so seriously and worry about it so heavily.

Next, onto Communism.

Quote:

When you say "Communism" goes against human nature, I think you're wrong. Living in a communal society builds trust and caring between all people (that's the goal anyways).
I disagree. You see, Communism really is the perfect system. However, it could only work in a utopian society where everyone was happy, and nobody wanted anything, so essentially, greed was abolished. I've studied the way the barter system evolves, and thought about it quite a bit. Bear with me if you already know what this is, I'll explain it to those who don't.

The barter system is essentailly a description of how trade began. In the beginning, people traded items for other items directly. You would trade 5 pelts for 2 hunks of meat, because the other man needed the pelts and you were hungry. It was simple and good, it worked well, and everybody was happy. But eventually, disputes broke out over the trades. One man would argue that 2 hunks of meat were only worth 4 pelts, then the meat seller would claim it was 6. So a unified standard of currency had to be developed, to represent the items we would normally trade. After this different cultures used this system a bit differently, but that is a quick and dirty version of how economy formed.

The problem with Communism is that people arn't happy with what they have. It's not in human nature to accept that they will only get this much and no more. Capitalism is a pyramid- that's an excellent way to describe it, like Guest said, only I wish to elaborate. The ones at the top rule the ones at the bottom, but the ones at the bottom are necessary to support the entire system. They must outnumber the top ones, but still bow to their supremecy. Communism can be thought of like a column of stacked rings. What will happen is that eventually, people are going to start moving up the column. One man will steal something and sell it, and get extra money. This makes his ring a bit bigger, but instead of moving to the bottom, he moves to the top. As more and more people get more than they deserve, their rings grow bigger, but they move up the social ladder, not down. Eventually you have an upside down pyramid, with the poorest people supporting the wealthiest, and the pyramid collapses.

Finally, here's the reason why we defend our country. America is a country with faults. We are a police nation, we have 11,367 gun murders every year (the next country behind us, Germany, has 300 some), and we're probably the most hated country in the world. So why is that? You could say it's because we came up with democracy first. And why shouldn't we? After all, it was created in an effort to get rid of the British parliament's control over our lives. We wanted pure freedom, so we went to war with Britain, and a fledgling country without a proper military or funds defeated a world leader. We rebelled against the british, we rebelled against laws, we even rebelled against ourselves. You could say that Americans simply don't like following rules.

However, is any of that bad? Yes, we have made some mistakes. But who's to say that Rome didnt' make a mistake by going on the Crusades and murdering millions of people? Who's to say Germany didn't make a mistake with Hitler? Who's to say Russia didn't make a mistake by inventing Communism? The only difference is that we moved up the ranks a lot faster, and we had less time. And if you think about it, we didn't make any mistakes to the magnitude that the world looks down on it (besides electing Bush, kekeke).

The reason other countries hate us is not a simple hate because of our politics, our army, or anything else. They hate us because we are free, we are powerful, and we are rich. We are the world leader, and nobody likes who's at the top. America is really a wonderful country. We have one of the lowest unemployment rates in the world, the highest per capita income, the best economy, the strongest army, and most influence in the world order. That's why other countries hate us. It isnt' our president, it isn't our tourists. They are jealous of our wealth and prosperity. If you step back and pretend you live somewhere else, what would you think?

*cracks knuckles*

Anonymous 05-10-2004 04:03 PM

All i have to say is:

Spec after saying all that, you're STILL joining the US army?! ROFL..... you're in for one hell of a suprise dude. You have NO idea what they're gonna do to your head. You won't even realize i bet, i just wish you luck.

You seem like a different american, one who understands how stupid his country is becoming, yet you're making a huge mistake by joining their military, good luck, and i hope you NEVER lose that outlook you just described, It could lead you to better things and places someday.

I know you're gonna say something like "You don't know anything about the US Military" but the thing is, I've had two friends in the US Army, and three in the Canadian military. I KNOW what they do to your head. So don't tell me i don't.

xObserveRx 05-10-2004 04:04 PM

btw, that last post was me. *Sigh*, i always do that....

Specforces 05-10-2004 09:28 PM

I'm joining the Air Force for the benefits and the training. After which I want to be in the CIA. I have had many family members in the military and I've known many individuals who are active. I know what they do, and I'm mentally prepared for it. Jesus, I brainwashed little kids and late teens myself through military programs in which I served as a drill sergeant. I've been there. Regarding my post, it's not all 100% opinion, I like to stir up debate, make the reader think.

Specforces


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