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-   -   Good And Evil. (http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/vbz/showthread.php?t=52613)

dsadsadsa 10-30-2006 04:08 PM

Good And Evil.
 
Well, I was confusing myself today with a simple question. If there were no bad in the world, would good still exist? Some might jump right away and say yes, citing examples such as, you can still be rich and happy, yet, you would be happy and poor since there is no more bad. If you terminate the bad, you terminate the opposite of good, therefore making there be nothing other than good. So really good would exist, it just wouldn't be AS good as it was before, when there was bad... Right?

Laharl 10-30-2006 04:18 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
So you're saying that good would still exist but it wouldn't mean as much as it does now while there is still evil?

My take on this is pretty simple. Good and evil are subjective. In order for something to be good, there has to be an opposite evil. Good and evil are only definable by a unit. There is the world unit, then there is the continent unit, then there is the country unit, then the state unit, then the city unit, then the individual unit. I could concivably make many more parts of the whole, but basically, when you get down to it, good and evil still comes down to what an individual person thinks is good or evil.

Now, with that out of the way, power might be considered a good. To some, killing to obtain power is a good while being timid and shy is an evil. To another, seeking a non-conflict situation in order to obtain power is a good while killing is evil. (I believe the latter is considered a more universal good, as most people don't believe killing is ever right unless the situation demands it.)

...Ah crap, don't you hate when you run off on a tangent and forget how you were planning on tying it in to the topic at hand? That just happened to me.

But basically, no, I don't think good exist in the absense of evil.

Fluffington 10-30-2006 04:37 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
The question itself makes no sense, there will always be evil, if you take away evil, then neutral becomes the relative evil, take away neutral and then good becomes neutral.

Laharl 10-30-2006 06:25 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
...?

That made less sense than the original topic, I must say.

spyke252 10-30-2006 06:40 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
If there was only good,then what would be the point of learning?
Competition? Games?

With no loser, competition is impossible. Thus, people are limited in their reactions with one another.

Thus, it would revert back to good vs evil anyways. (Wow big logic jump.)

Its like a stable equilibrium point in the physics hw Im avoiding.

*Of course, Laharl is also right*

dsadsadsa 10-31-2006 10:40 AM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by spyke252 (Post 970004)
If there was only good,then what would be the point of learning?
Competition? Games?

With no loser, competition is impossible. Thus, people are limited in their reactions with one another.

Thus, it would revert back to good vs evil anyways. (Wow big logic jump.)

Its like a stable equilibrium point in the physics hw Im avoiding.

*Of course, Laharl is also right*

So, to be put in simple forms and answer the question, you are saying no, good wouldn't exist?

spyke252 10-31-2006 10:45 AM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dsadsadsa (Post 970877)
So, to be put in simple forms and answer the question, you are saying no, good wouldn't exist?

No, I'm saying that if good didn't exist, the universe would shift back into its equilibrium point and good would exist again.

AeonShadow 10-31-2006 11:09 AM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
wat the hell are you guys talking bout evil and good lol!!

dsadsadsa 10-31-2006 02:47 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AeonShadow (Post 970934)
wat the hell are you guys talking bout evil and good lol!!

Hi.. Uhm.. Read some stickies, and then re-read my first post (If you haven't already). It's not that hard to understand.

Fox tails 10-31-2006 02:53 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AeonShadow (Post 970934)
wat the hell are you guys talking bout evil and good lol!!

This post really makes an intelligent one huh...:sad:

I don't think good can exist without evil because if we got rid of evil what would be left? If we had only good left, then the lesser form of the good would be seen as evil compared to the greater form of good. The other problem is the idea that good and evil can only be decided by a person's morals. If you do something you think is good, someone else could think that what you did is actually evil because you have different morals, making it impossible to actually get rid of evil.

B0NK 10-31-2006 03:13 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
simply put:
evil will always triumph because good is dumb.

Kilgamayan 10-31-2006 03:32 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Remove hot, and what is cold? Remove light, and what is dark? Remove up, and what is down?

Perhaps the answers to those questions will help you better your answer to the initially proposed one.

Laharl 10-31-2006 03:54 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
I think the question we need to be asking if there is really a need for good and evil.

Does enjoyment and contentment exist without "good" and therefore, if the general consesus seems to agree that good cannot exist without it, "evil"?

So to make this controversial, let's relate it to the story of Adam and Eve. Were they happy in the garden before they had the knowledge of good and evil? Seems from all accounts that they were. Evil didn't exist, but technically, neither did good. Life just was, and it was pleasant, and they were blissful.

So do we really need good?

Z3ratul 10-31-2006 04:09 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Laharl (Post 969440)
Good and evil are subjective.

We have a winner!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fluffington (Post 969519)
The question itself makes no sense, there will always be evil, if you take away evil, then neutral becomes the relative evil, take away neutral and then good becomes neutral.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laharl (Post 969973)
That made less sense than the original topic, I must say.

All he's saying is that there is a concept of degree. 1 is smaller than 2 and 3, but 2 is smaller than only 3. Take away 1 and 2 is now the smallest of those that are left.

Basically, I think this questions radically depends on the context of what we mean by 'good and evil'. If we mean it in a strictly logical sense, then it's essentially comparable to mathematics. Positive is the opposite of negative, and (entirely) without one, the other ceases to exist and we're left with nothing.

However, if we take it in a more human sense, the issue become infinetely more complex- subjectivity ensues.

masterhickle 10-31-2006 04:31 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
I like Z3ratul's way of putting it.

Of the numbers 1 2 3 and 4, 1 is obviously the smallest. But say you were to take away that smallest number, 2 is now the smallest of the group. You can take away the smallest, another one will just take its place.

The same concept applies to good and evil. If you take away the good, then the lesser evils would be considered good in comparison to the greater evils, even though they are still evil. The same can be applied to taking away the evil.

Good and evil will always exist, it doesn't matter if either is taken away; it's just that the lesser forms of either will be viewed as what was taken away.

Reach 10-31-2006 06:41 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Sure. Good can exist in any context. You just have to change the definition.

It's an arbitrary definition anyway.


But what I think you're asking is an unfair question. How can you get rid of bad in the first place if you can't define it? You can't, which is why the question is sort of a paradox.

If you had a perfect definition of evil, and you removed evil, there could obviously still be good.

FictionJunction 11-2-2006 03:26 AM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dsadsadsa (Post 969400)
Well, I was confusing myself today with a simple question. If there were no bad in the world, would good still exist? Some might jump right away and say yes, citing examples such as, you can still be rich and happy, yet, you would be happy and poor since there is no more bad. If you terminate the bad, you terminate the opposite of good, therefore making there be nothing other than good. So really good would exist, it just wouldn't be AS good as it was before, when there was bad... Right?

I wouldn't see 'good' and 'evil' as immediate opposites.
Fights, wars, disputes, etc, are all bound by perspectives. 'Good' is merely one of these perspectives, while 'evil' is another. If there's any possible way you could classify 'evil' as, it would have to be 'an absence of good.'
Now, this would leave a new question at hand. What is 'good'? Yet another perspective issue. Whatever is good in our society will remain as such within our society, whereas it might not if these same tendencies, actions, scnearios were to be seen in another.
Either way, the only 'evil' that would be present would be the opposite of whatever is to be considered 'good' by certain group of people.
And it's impossible to eliminate 'evil.' Sorry.

MixMasterLar 11-3-2006 09:57 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Eveybody
W/O good, there is no evil, but you cant get rid of evil in the first place.

I dont want to sound, as most people say it, 'retarded', but the Bible says all that is not correct.

if you want me to go on, then say so. otherwise, I'll let you find out what I think is the right answer.

this_n00b_rocks 11-3-2006 11:28 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AeonShadow (Post 970934)
wat the hell are you guys talking bout evil and good lol!!

Notice: What is this section called? Critical thinking. Shut up and go to the game thread where you belong, you noob (don't even bring up my name).

On topic: What happens if evil is gone? Wouldn't all of the said evil things in the world become good? Our world would become very distorted.

FictionJunction 11-3-2006 11:40 PM

Re: Good And Evil.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by this_n00b_rocks (Post 978557)
On topic: What happens if evil is gone? Wouldn't all of the said evil things in the world become good? Our world would become very distorted.

Evil being 'the absence of good' would solely depend on 'good' itself. Both concepts are perspectives.
Thing is, what people don't consider is the fact that whatever 'evil' action an 'evil' person is doing, is in the end, 'good' in their perspective, whereas it is not in the eyes of said 'evil' person's opponents.
'Good' and 'evil' vary. They're not definite.
Perspectives differ from one another; we will never live in a world where people follow one main concept of what's 'good' and what's 'evil,' fr these things are interchangeable.


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