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Specforces 12-12-2005 04:29 PM

Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
And it's application to society today.

Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes into you.

-Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche

talisman 12-12-2005 04:33 PM

RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
I feel as though this quote is suggesting we not confront the perceived evils in the world, and thus instead ignore them. I think it's a crummy way of dealing with your problems, turning your back on them.

Specforces 12-12-2005 04:38 PM

RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Good interpretation, mine is different though.

FoJaR 12-12-2005 08:13 PM

RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
i think it's some bad emo poetry.

Specforces 12-12-2005 08:15 PM

RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Fojar, I was starting to like you too.

Lightknight924 12-12-2005 08:18 PM

RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
I think it means be your self because if you try to fight fire with fire well, you get only fire. Do you get what i'm trying to point out? Interesting poem by the way.

FoJaR 12-12-2005 08:20 PM

Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Specforces
Fojar, I was starting to like you too.

haha man, just a joke.

i'm not huge on the whole existential thing.

Specforces 12-12-2005 08:22 PM

RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
;) I know it was a joke, and so was mine, my sense of humor is weird.

Afrobean 12-12-2005 08:22 PM

RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Nietzsche is kewl~

On a more serious note, I think I'll reply for real.

"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes into you."

Hmm... I agree with Lightknight here, at least partly. The first part of it, "Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster" is definitely about the "fight fire with fire" mentality. It gets no one anywhere and causes more damage than if one would simply solve the problem.

The second part seems to be saying not to dwell on the unknown, and those who do dwell are lost.

Lightknight924 12-12-2005 08:22 PM

RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Ok. Getting back on topic, read my previous post and tell me what you think.




*Afrobean didn't post yet at the time I was writing this which referred to FoJar and Specforces.

FoJaR 12-12-2005 08:24 PM

Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Afrobean
The second part seems to be saying not to dwell on the unknown, and those who do dwell are lost.

which is where i disagree with nietzsche, the godless heathen.

Specforces 12-12-2005 08:25 PM

RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Lightknight had the general idea and Afro nailed it. Good job. This is just the first in quotes I will post. They will become increasingly harder and harder.

Lightknight924 12-12-2005 08:34 PM

Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Afrobean
Nietzsche is kewl~

On a more serious note, I think I'll reply for real.

"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes into you."

Hmm... I agree with Lightknight here, at least partly. The first part of it, "Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster" is definitely about the "fight fire with fire" mentality. It gets no one anywhere and causes more damage than if one would simply solve the problem.

The second part seems to be saying not to dwell on the unknown, and those who do dwell are lost.

Yeah, took me a few times to fully understand his post but he nailed it.

talisman 12-12-2005 08:38 PM

RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Meh, I would disagree with afro's interpretation because it supposes things that aren't in the quote. For example, the quote didn't say "Don't fight the monsters as the monsters fight/antagonize you" and when afro suggests that "one [should] simply solve the problem" that doesn't answer HOW to solve the problem. And I don't think Nietzche was trying to say "Don't fight the monsters, negotiate with them!"

Fire with fire IS NOT comparable because that suggests the methods by which fighting occurs, whereas in the actual quote nothing is said about HOW fighting between you and the monsters should happen, just that it shouldn't happen at all.

Specforces 12-12-2005 08:45 PM

RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
It means this ok:

Beware fighting evil, for down the path of its destruction you will also inherit some of this evil, for the only true way to beat evil is use evil yourself.

talisman 12-12-2005 08:47 PM

RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
...which isn't what afro said at all.

Afrobean 12-12-2005 08:47 PM

RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Well, I assumed that the fighting between self and monsters would be comperable since it says the fighting would make "ye" become a monster.

I guess it's not always safe to assume things, but in cases of interpretations, assumptions are pretty much needed.

Specforces 12-12-2005 08:48 PM

RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
well, the fight fire with fire part was part of it.

Afrobean 12-12-2005 08:50 PM

Re: RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Specforces
Beware fighting evil, for down the path of its destruction you will also inherit some of this evil, for the only true way to beat evil is use evil yourself.

That is the hidden message of Star Wars.

Seriously, go watch Star wars and point out one light saber fight where the good guys didn't win because of use of the dark side (anakin v. obi-wan doesn't count simply because obi-wan is too cool).

PS Talisman, that is pretty much what I meant. I must not have verbalized it well enough.

talisman 12-12-2005 08:52 PM

RE: Re: RE: Discuss the meaning of this quote
 
not really, nowhere does he make it explicit or implicit that you must battle the monsters as the monsters may or may not battle you, should you choose to do battle with them.

The argument he's making isn't about how to fight the monsters but whether or not to do it in the first place. He says that you shouldn't, but doesn't say that it's because if you do you'll have to use the same evil methods that the monsters would use.


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