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-   -   Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me? (http://www.flashflashrevolution.com/vbz/showthread.php?t=134839)

drizzleRomanceGirl 01-23-2014 03:50 PM

Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
I sometimes become extremely irritated with other adults when they expect me or anyone else to be mature. I understand why it's helpful to be mature, and I usually try to act responsibly and try not to cause unnecessary trouble for anyone. However, I detest when adults think the act of maturity is something that should be enforced. I feel like some people are trying to act like police officers and uphold maturity like it's their job. I even feel like I'm being judged and attacked if I don't act the way some adults expect me to act.

For example, I am really annoyed when teachers don't go over the material that was previously assigned for reading because they expect you to already know everything about it. It's even more irritating when a student asks his or her teacher something he or she doesn't understand about the assigned material after reading it at home, and the response is something similar to, "I'm not here to babysit you. You should have read the assigned material at home. Don't waste my time by asking stupid questions." I value communication among teachers, and I can't stand when teachers expect their students to understand everything they assign when these teachers haven't even discussed any of the material in class.

Thank you in advance for responding! :)

hi19hi19 01-23-2014 04:11 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
9/10 times, if a teacher says, "I'm not here to babysit you. You should have read the assigned material at home."

It's because they fucking told you to read the assigned material at home.

and you didn't

hi19hi19 01-23-2014 04:13 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
It's like, if you say, "I read the assigned material and I have some questions about understanding it"

that's cool

if you're one of those assholes who is like "lol I didnt read it what did it say" then yeah the teacher isn't going to give you a second thought and you probably deserve it

Reincarnate 01-23-2014 04:13 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Most of the time, if a teacher says something like that, it's because your question is answered explicitly in the text/homework/whatever, implying that you didn't actually go through the motions.

Teachers (generally) have a lot on their plates. Lots of students to handle, lots of parents to deal with, etc. They aren't going to want to go out of their way to answer your questions if you aren't willing to do the work yourself.

Of course, some teachers are assholes and will shoot down good questions regardless, so it depends.

Reincarnate 01-23-2014 04:18 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrPopadopalis25 (Post 4064970)
^^
If we're talking about post secondary, teachers only have a certain amount of time to get through what they need to in that given block of time. If they don't reiterate the readings in class but you have questions, that's what office hours and the like are for.

And funnily enough, office hours are some of the most useful hours you can take advantage of -- and so few do.

I think some (most?) people think of it as like "Fuck, that's like having MORE class?! I already spend so much time in lectures, doing homework, studying, etc" and don't bother. Joke's on them, though: usually the insight you gain from the office hours can help you get everything done much more quickly/accurately because you are able to get some one-on-one time that simply isn't possible in a lecture setting.

Pseudo Enigma 01-23-2014 04:25 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
a 16yo bitched at me for being not handling a situation properly because I'm an adult. I'm 18, I'm not used to this yet. Just because you've reached your 6571st day on this planet doesn't mean you magically turn into a majestic creature that knows right from wrong, can do anything right, and will say the right things. (Even though I'm not denying I still need to grow up lots)

Anyway, point is, it's not just adults expecting you to act like an adult, it's everyone. Once you become an adult the gloves come off and people start expecting you to do things right since you're not a child anymore.

drizzleRomanceGirl 01-23-2014 04:29 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
I'm sorry, my example of a teacher's expectations for students was probably a bad example. Students are supposed to read the assigned material to learn what the teacher is talking about in class.

What I'm irritated about is when adults expect other people to act in the way they believe to be mature, and they openly attack someone's self-esteem if he or she doesn't follow those unspoken rules. I believe everyone has their own right to act however they would like to act, provided the country's laws are not broken. I don't appreciate when people judge others who don't act how those people want them to act.

popsicle_3000 01-23-2014 04:30 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pseudo Enigma (Post 4064977)
6571st day on this planet

either 6566 or 6567 depending on the year you were born.

drizzleRomanceGirl 01-23-2014 04:36 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pseudo Enigma (Post 4064977)
a 16yo bitched at me for being not handling a situation properly because I'm an adult. I'm 18, I'm not used to this yet. Just because you've reached your 6571st day on this planet doesn't mean you magically turn into a majestic creature that knows right from wrong, can do anything right, and will say the right things. (Even though I'm not denying I still need to grow up lots)

Anyway, point is, it's not just adults expecting you to act like an adult, it's everyone. Once you become an adult the gloves come off and people start expecting you to do things right since you're not a child anymore.

You say, "...knows right from wrong, can do anything right, and will say the right things." I believe that there is no right and wrong other than the law of the country you live in. What's morally right and wrong is up to each person's own opinions.

Pseudo Enigma 01-23-2014 04:38 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by drizzleRomanceGirl (Post 4064980)
I don't appreciate when people judge others who don't act how those people want them to act.

I think it's more of a trial by fire sort of thing. The more you hear these things you can either buckle under the weight of the accusations, or you can adapt and become stronger. Usually the more responsible people will become stronger (which in turn comes bigger accusations when you fail to be strong) and go on to be more successful.

IMO it's just a part of life you have to accept. People are always going to tell you that you fucked up. You're just going to have to learn to be the person who tells yourself that you did something good when you do it.
Whatever doesn't kill you...

Quote:

Originally Posted by drizzleRomanceGirl (Post 4064992)
You say, "...knows right from wrong, can do anything right, and will say the right things." I believe that there is no right and wrong other than the law of the country you live in. What's morally right and wrong is up to each person's own opinions.

This is largely true, however that doesn't mean that you aren't living in a society. Unless you can figure out how to live completely alone, you will never escape the moral decisions that are placed upon you.

I'm having a hard time trying to say this.

If your friend told you to jump off a bridge, would you? If the law told you to, would you? There is no absolute rule of what is right and wrong. Sometimes you have to choose which is best. Sometimes it's hard, sometimes it's easy. Mistakes are going to be made, but what matters in the end is how you fix them.

Also opinions can be wrong. That's probably mostly why I'm having a hard time writing this properly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by popsicle_3000 (Post 4064981)
either 6566 or 6567 depending on the year you were born.

leap years lel

Dynam0 01-23-2014 04:41 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
It's legal to wear one's pants below the normal belt line thereby exposing one's undergarments (boxers/briefs/thongs etc.), however this behaviour is classified as immature and frowned upon by adults. I'm immature as hell for a lot of things, but it's hard not to pass judgement on some behaviours when you see them. If this whole maturity debate is driven by opinion, then there isn't a right or wrong answer for what you're looking for. Adults expecting others to be mature is irritating to you because in your opinion, immature behaviours should not be scrutinized. These adults aren't wrong in their judgements and neither are you in being irritated by it :p

3lijah 01-23-2014 04:47 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Man, I aint growin up for anybody fuck that


But in all seriousness, there are times in life where you have no choice BUT to be a grown up otherwise you'll look like an idiot. At the same time, you can be the most important person in the world and relate more to a 12 year old rather than someone your own age.

My point is, know to be a grown up about certain situations and know when being so serious isn't necessary. As for me, fuck being a grown up sometimes, it sucks.

Hakulyte 01-23-2014 04:58 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by drizzleRomanceGirl (Post 4064959)
However, I detest when adults think the act of maturity is something that should be enforced.

It's something that should be enforced until the person targeted become independant. After that point, it doesn't matter nearly as much.

Pseudo Enigma 01-23-2014 06:35 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrPopadopalis25 (Post 4065026)
If morality is subjective then people are free to say what they think is right and what they think is wrong and argue with others on their beliefs. If you're going to act different than the dominant ideology (maturity is a part of that) then you'll get flak from those who disagree. One of the big reasons why their criticism of maturity carries more weight is because it aligns with the dominant ideology and has merit with the populace and those in power. However, at the same time, you have to think about why the trait of maturity is favorable; how did it come about, what function does it serve, why do people continue to support it, what happens if it the ideology changed, etc etc. If it has survived in our culture for this long then there must be reasons why. Once you know these reasons, then you can go from there if you want to combat it.

^
thanks, this is what I meant.

devonin 01-23-2014 06:38 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Grow up.

omega_grunt666 01-23-2014 06:58 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Still not understanding whats being said here, doing what you want within the law sets some pretty wide boundaries. Some examples of what is being considered immature here would help clear things up some.

As far as I'm concerned, people can dress/talk/act the way they want as long as it isn't intentionally making others feel uncomfortable. Between friends/familiar faces I do/say all kinds of immature things because I know they are O.K. with it and act in a similar way. In public around strangers I keep it to myself, act as polite as possible, and in general just put out the most well-mannered, positive image I can. Not because of any unspoken rules or expectations, its just the best way to get that back from people. Treat others the way you wish to be treated has always been my one and only guideline and its treated me pretty well so far.

There will always be people out there who are idiots regardless, or will never be happy with what you say/do because they are looking for a target to take out frustrations on in one way or another. All you can really do is distance your self from those people or make them aware of what they are doing if you think its unintentional.

The teacher example isn't the best but I can relate, my grade school teachers for french and music back in the day were prime examples of it. If they had a single bad student that day it would effect their classes for the rest of it. And because of it I learned very little about either subject because most of the classes were spent disciplining bad students instead of teaching (immature students but also bad teaching). Where as my English/reading teacher in grade one was super awesome, I had trouble reading as a young child and he actually had after-class time to tutor 1-on-1 with students who were behind.


Anyways, I can't really think of anything else to say without any more examples of whats being considered immature here.

devonin 01-23-2014 07:31 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
If you refer to "adults" as something other than the group to which you, yourself belong, I'd argue that you pretty much -aren't- mature.

Svaz 01-23-2014 08:14 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Most definitions of mature, (not maturity, which appears to have a fairly economical lilt) concisely, seem to refer to what is expected (socially/societally, I suppose, in this context) of someone of a certain age group. You didn't give any specific personal examples (I feel not doing reading has been rebuffed enough), but I can say from my own experience that it could be that change is difficult and losing parts of your personality can be sort of painful, pain is irritating, and thereby criticism (even if somewhat constructive) is received poorly.

To expound from that specific situation posed, however, I think the key thing to do, if a) there's not a lot of help from the teacher and b) you still have questions is to reach out to other students, maybe arrange a group or study session and meet on your own time. With education and the cost thereof, it doesn't really make sense to not own it and take every opportunity you can to delve into it further!! A lot of the pricey stuff comes with online resources too, but consulting others that are in the class with you generally lends different perspectives you might not have thought to explore before.

Growing up is definitely not always pleasant, but a lot of advantages can be gained professionally and socially from doing so; showing up in accord to timelines laid out by others as opposed to what works for you, for example, shows consideration of their time. I feel like change is essential to living a pretty awesome life; if you're constantly evolving and adapting to the world around you, nothing can be thrown at you that can break you forever! Something like that. Anyway, I don't think it should be regarded as something like a crisis of losing your identity, but gaining a new facet to it and making it into something not totally similar, but slightly improved upon (naturally this can also work in reverse, but in this specific context, I think we should look at this as an advantageous change)!

Aside: I guess the definition listed by google as "careful and thorough" is also worth some examination in application to the quandry posed, but I don't quite have the time now to do so.

Svaz 01-23-2014 08:15 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Alternatively

Vendetta21 01-23-2014 08:40 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
In a classroom environment not following the expectations just results in a bad score and then you may never see the teacher again. In a workplace not following tge expectations impacts everyone you work with. In a relationship not meeting agreed upon expectations (implicitly or explicitly) causes conflict and relationship decay.

You may not always meet expectations because you are human and the expectations are beyond your capacity. Maturity is, in some sense, learning how to identify all the things expected of you, doing that which you can, and communicating clearly with others those expectations you feel can't meet. A lot of times the things you think are expected of you are malleable and sometimes your preconceived notions of your own capability are mistaken. This is where the communication element becomes critical.

Most of the time if you aren't clearly grasping the things expected of you then you will stumble, get frustrated, blame others, and make yourself a victim of circumstance. Getting better at this identification comes better with experience, and geniunely attempting to meet expectations helps to generate a realistic sense of your capacity.

In a classroom environment you may mot get the sense that you are entirely responsible for figuring out what the expectations are of you, your capacity, resolving the issues that exist, and communicating that which you feel unable to do clearly because teachers make an effort to simplify these things as much as possible and we feel it is their responsibility to make things manageable. In every other situation you encounter through your life, you will have to do this yourself for tge mist part.

My writing style here is clinical so it may make the idea sound daunting but it isn't as long as your intentions are to do your best.

Pseudo Enigma 01-23-2014 09:19 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by devonin (Post 4065077)
If you refer to "adults" as something other than the group to which you, yourself belong, I'd argue that you pretty much -aren't- mature.

but not doing so doesn't guarantee you are mature either.

ilikexd 01-23-2014 09:54 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by drizzleRomanceGirl (Post 4064980)
What I'm irritated about is when adults expect other people to act in the way they believe to be mature, and they openly attack someone's self-esteem if he or she doesn't follow those unspoken rules.

Quote:

Originally Posted by drizzleRomanceGirl (Post 4064980)
I believe everyone has their own right to act however they would like to act, provided the country's laws are not broken. I don't appreciate when people judge others who don't act how those people want them to act.

They have the right to judge you because the country's laws are not broken, right?

Pseudo Enigma 01-23-2014 10:05 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KgZ (Post 4065137)
Guy. People who are older than you (commonly referred to adults) simply have more experience in life than you do. They've literally lived more days than you. That doesn't always mean they're right because they're older. But they have more experiences and stories to back up their moral claims. In the example of your response to Dev, you don't have to agree with him. It's probably worth listening to what he and other people older than you have to say though.

replying =/= not listening
I have read every response in this thread. My response to dev was mostly sarcasm. I don't disagree with what he said, but it sounded a bit conceited. His responses haven't been exactly helpful at looking at OP's problem either.

edit: actually, that's another thing. Just because you're older, doesn't mean I'm automatically going to respect you. Sure there's preformed respect that comes with being older than me, but the other side has to also build up from there too. Being an adult doesn't mean you can say whatever you want and get away with it because of respect. In fact, it doesn't exactly install respect. If anything it takes away from it.

Call me a rebel.

Tharringbone 01-23-2014 10:45 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
It is probably irritating to you because you are an immature little child.

awein999 01-23-2014 11:20 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
There are misconceptions when it comes to immaturity and maturity. Maturity doesn't mean have no fun and never be silly, and likewise immature doesn't mean always be silly and never be serious. You can be maturely silly and immaturely serious. There could be aspects of yourself that are mature and others that aren't. It's not a blanket statement as to whether you are mature or immature. Many people use mature vs immature weapon of words to try to insult someone who deviates from the norm and get them to conform by making them feel insecure. Instances happen all the time by less mature people attacking more mature ones ironically calling said person immature. (age is irrelevant)

You have at least one immature trait if you have a warped view of reality, shallow beliefs, shallow wisdom, acting without thinking, more self-centered or self-humble than your reality calls for, or are emotionally unstable.
Usually it comes down to whether you are a realist or not with certain things probably.

I still think the way immaturity and maturity are used as blanket statements in society as a way to "act" is bogus though.

Pseudo Enigma 01-23-2014 11:42 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KgZ (Post 4065182)
how about respecting everyone instead of proving their worth to you?

I just said I respect everyone. Once they do something that lessens themselves in front of me they lose that respect. It's not rocket science.

>FFR talking about maturity
it's funny in of itself.

also I think calling people immature isn't a very mature thing to do, either. Explicitly nor implicitly.

edit: KgZ I see where you're coming from, don't get me wrong. I just don't agree with it 100%.

GuidoHunter 01-24-2014 12:07 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by drizzleRomanceGirl (Post 4064959)
I sometimes become extremely irritated with other adults when they expect me or anyone else to be mature.

Adults looking out for the best interests of children who don't know any better? The outrage.

Quote:

However, I detest when adults think the act of maturity is something that should be enforced.
Yeah, I mean who wants a productive society or anything?

Immaturity well into adulthood is a serious problem, so excuse us for trying to curb it.

The sanctimonious "Don't judge me!" attitude isn't helping your case, either.

--Guido

dAnceguy117 01-24-2014 12:46 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendetta21 (Post 4065101)
You may not always meet expectations because you are human and the expectations are beyond your capacity. Maturity is, in some sense, learning how to identify all the things expected of you, doing that which you can, and communicating clearly with others those expectations you feel can't meet. A lot of times the things you think are expected of you are malleable and sometimes your preconceived notions of your own capability are mistaken. This is where the communication element becomes critical.

perfectly describes what I've learned through some of my own failures in the last year.

Crazyjayde 01-24-2014 01:12 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
I am more unnerved of the misconceptions that go along the idea of "becoming adult" upon age, where in fact it's more of a transition into maturity. Aging individuals often go along the concept of "tagging" someone by their acquired capabilities (read skills) or their age, when in fact, somebody's maturity is more often that not cultivated in wisdom. That, I think, had been more of an issue for people crossing the gap.

I could see myself more prone to understanding that. Your initial statement might need some rephrasing.

Izzy 01-24-2014 01:17 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pseudo Enigma (Post 4065139)
Just because you're older, doesn't mean I'm automatically going to respect you.

In general I agree with this. Being older is only an opportunity to become more mature, not a guarantee.

Edit: Oh, this is a drizzle thread. I'm still pretty sure this guy is trolling nonstop. I find it difficult to believe someone could write the things he does.

Poison- 01-24-2014 01:21 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Izzy (Post 4065221)
Edit: Oh, this is a drizzle thread. I'm still pretty sure this guy is trolling nonstop. I find it difficult to believe someone could write the things he does.

Gender: Female ?

Crazyjayde 01-24-2014 01:30 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
^ Confirmed

Izzy 01-24-2014 01:32 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
That doesn't change much even if it is true. I don't think I'd easily believe someone that seems to lie about everything else.

Crazyjayde 01-24-2014 01:41 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
The fact that you said this:

Quote:

I'm still pretty sure this guy is trolling nonstop
makes me think that you don't fully understand what an account worth a thousand of posts entails.
This thread is getting harsh.

Izzy 01-24-2014 01:54 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
What are you implying it is worth? That doesn't seem like a big deal to me. Someone could easily be bored enough to spend the time messing with people.

Crazyjayde 01-24-2014 01:58 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
I am implying it's enough dedication in this short time span to be clear about her genuine interest in this community.
Jesus, go ask her yourself.

drizzleRomanceGirl 01-24-2014 04:54 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dynam0 (Post 4064995)
It's legal to wear one's pants below the normal belt line thereby exposing one's undergarments (boxers/briefs/thongs etc.), however this behaviour is classified as immature and frowned upon by adults. I'm immature as hell for a lot of things, but it's hard not to pass judgement on some behaviours when you see them. If this whole maturity debate is driven by opinion, then there isn't a right or wrong answer for what you're looking for. Adults expecting others to be mature is irritating to you because in your opinion, immature behaviours should not be scrutinized. These adults aren't wrong in their judgements and neither are you in being irritated by it :p

Thank you Dynam0, you helped me understand that I need to accept that some people are going to judge and/or insult me. I need to be able to take what others tell me with a grain of salt and follow my own beliefs. :)

Izzy, I couldn't care less what you think about me, but please don't derail this thread.

I understand that learning to act in the interest of society is helpful, but I think the way some people attack others' self-esteem and behavior is revolting. In my opinion, people who think it's their duty to judge and incriminate the immature actions of others are losing a huge sense of community. The very definition of maturity seems to be to act the way society expects others to while discouraging opinions and critical thought. If this kind of thinking continues, we might eventually turn into a society similar to the one depicted in the novel titled The Giver by Lois Lowry.

In this novel, no one has deep feelings for anyone else, and everyone is forced to conform to society. These people are discouraged from thinking for themselves and are told false information from their birth so that they can live in an ignorant Utopian society. They are told what to do, which job to adopt by the time they are 12-years-old, and even whether they are eligible to have children. Furthermore, if anyone tries to escape from the city they're imprisoned inside, they are killed without the escapee even knowing what death means, and mistakenly believe they will be transported to another place.

Is this really the life we are heading towards?

Poison- 01-24-2014 05:05 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by drizzleRomanceGirl (Post 4065263)
Thank you Dynam0, you helped me understand that I need to accept that some people are going to judge and/or insult me. I need to be able to take what others tell me with a grain of salt and follow my own beliefs. :)

Izzy, I couldn't care less what you think about me, but please don't derail this thread.

I understand that learning to act in the interest of society is helpful, but I think the way some people attack others' self-esteem and behavior is revolting. In my opinion, people who think it's their duty to judge and incriminate the immature actions of others are losing a huge sense of community. The very definition of maturity seems to be to act the way society expects others to while discouraging opinions and critical thought. If this kind of thinking continues, we might eventually turn into a society similar to the one depicted in the novel titled The Giver by Lois Lowry.

In this novel, no one has deep feelings for anyone else, and everyone is forced to conform to society. These people are discouraged from thinking for themselves and are told false information from their birth so that they can live in an ignorant Utopian society. They are told what to do, which job to adopt by the time they are 12-years-old, and even whether they are eligible to have children. Furthermore, if anyone tries to escape from the city they're imprisoned inside, they are killed without the escapee even knowing what death means, and mistakenly believe they will be transported to another place.

Is this really the life we are heading towards?

No it is not

reuben_tate 01-24-2014 10:04 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
You have to realize though that you do in fact live in a society. Sure, everyone could be like "lol, screw everyone else, I'm gonna do whatever I want" but that doesn't make for a productive society. A lot of the social norms however just make sense. For example, if you agreed to meet your friend in 5 minutes, acting like "oh, the law doesn't say I have to meet my friend on time" is a poor excuse for being 3 hours late. Many of the social constructs are put in place because their reasoning is based on the consideration of others (sometimes even including yourself). Other social norms may seem ridiculous or obscure but give them a chance to think about why they exist in the first place.

Also, just putting it out their, if adjusting to social norms and being mature is an exhausting activity in itself, then spend more time with friends; when you're good friends with someone, over time you build up a mutual understanding of what actions are tolerable :P

devonin 01-24-2014 10:41 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
I just don't understand how 'maturity' is supposed to somehow be mutually exclusive from doing fun things, or having 'childish' hobbies.

I'm mature. I run a business, I have meetings, I wear suits and ties now and then and have grown up talk with the other grownups, and then I read sci-fi/fantasy, play Magic and D&D and World of Warcraft and go to gaming conventions.

Maturity is not about "someone not having to babysit you" it is about you meeting your end of the deal for living in a society. At a certain point, the adults who labour and provide things for everybody say "Okay, we've given you enough, now you have to start earning it." And you need to start earning it.

Does that mean they are trying to "force" you to be mature? No, they're calling in a debt you put yourself into when you let your parents feed and clothe you for your childhood and adolescence.

Does that mean you must be universally "A grown up" and forever completely stoic and independent? Of course not. You just have certain obligations you need to meet first.

stargroup100 01-24-2014 10:47 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
I will admit I haven't had much time to think about this but from just cursory scrutination, I think the point of social norms that are not "obvious" is two-fold. They create a standard that can potentially reduce conflict and misunderstanding when two sides of an issue are both valid, and they tell people what is acceptable or unacceptable because someone doesn't believe the majority is capable of coming to that conclusion on their own. But they're still social norms, and not rules or laws. While society does pressure us to conform to these norms, (at least in our US government) no one is forcing us to.

I think you guys covered this already, but I'll summarize from a different point of view. When most people use the word "mature" in this context, they're probably referring to traits that pertain to a person being independent, responsible, and respectful. These are all positive traits. There's nothing wrong with wanting a person to be better. People that fight this are usually more concerned about personality. They don't want to sit there and be boring, inactive, calm, whatever personality traits people associate with maturity. Personality is something you can't and shouldn't change, and this is not what maturity is about. It's a matter of speaking the same language here.

Pseudo Enigma 01-24-2014 11:27 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
>The Giver
>Dystopia

I don't think it's ever going to get that extreme

Cavernio 01-24-2014 11:52 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
So what do we do with disabled when they utterly fail to meet society's expectations? Ignore them and let them die?

devonin 01-24-2014 11:56 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Mature people work hard enough, have enough resources and have the generosity to be willing to provide for people who -want- to be able to contribute and can't.

Good thing we have mature people to set up and fund health care systems, and afford nurses and homecare workers.

If everybody just hung out and did what they wanted and didn't let "adults" "make" them be "mature" then the disabled WOULD just get ignored and die.

Cavernio 01-24-2014 12:42 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
So if I just -want- to contribute that's enough? Surely you see the problem with this; wanting to do something and not having the ability to do it results in mental anguish. You are constantly a failure and you know it and it will just feed a depression along with whatever disability the person has. This is neither helpful from an individual perspective or a societal one.

Ah, but unless you're obviously keenly wanting to be productive, you're labelled by others as selfish and lazy etc if whatever disability you have isn't obvious. Leave the catch 22. Maybe you're not just trying hard enough. Try again. Keeping failing. That helps, right? That's what one's supposed to do?

Dynam0 01-24-2014 01:05 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by devonin (Post 4065355)
Mature people work hard enough, have enough resources and have the generosity to be willing to provide for people who -want- to be able to contribute and can't.

Good thing we have mature people to set up and fund health care systems, and afford nurses and homecare workers.

If everybody just hung out and did what they wanted and didn't let "adults" "make" them be "mature" then the disabled WOULD just get ignored and die.

I think we need to change our definition of what it really means to be immature then. It's as you said in your previous post; your hobbies outside of your professional life might be considered immature by society in general when they really aren't immature at all in context. If someone works hard to be self-sufficient and has made strides to contribute to society, while making wise decisions and willing to learn from bad ones, that's maturity. It's reached when people have enough lived experiences to make beneficial moral choices for themselves and others on their own terms; there is no set age for reaching this point. What they do in their personal life is another story and is at worst an eccentricity at that point and not immaturity imo

Cavernio 01-24-2014 01:10 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
I was more mature at 12 than I am now.

Dynam0 01-24-2014 01:14 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cavernio (Post 4065381)
Ah, but unless you're obviously keenly wanting to be productive, you're labelled by others as selfish and lazy etc if whatever disability you have isn't obvious. Leave the catch 22. Maybe you're not just trying hard enough. Try again. Keeping failing. That helps, right? That's what one's supposed to do?

Keep trying and don't tell yourself that you can't do something. It's really cliche but it's better to keep trying to run up the slide than sit at the bottom.

Pseudo Enigma 01-24-2014 01:15 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dynam0 (Post 4065397)
Keep trying and don't tell yourself that you can't do something. It's really cliche but it's better to keep trying to run up the slide then sit at the bottom.

^

as I said earlier, it's like hurting yourself to get stronger. You're going to be weak as always if you never hurt yourself.
...I really wish I could put that in a better way.

if you're disabled you're just going to have to find some way. I know it's harsh, but that was how natural selection worked.

Dynam0 01-24-2014 01:27 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pseudo Enigma (Post 4065399)
if you're disabled you're just going to have to find some way. I know it's harsh, but that was how natural selection worked.

Don't be a fool. Some people do require assistance at some point if they cannot provide on their own. It sounds like I'm contradicting my post, but Cavernio is obviously intelligent and has the ability to do great things (though she may say otherwise); it was applying to her. Some people really cannot feasibly provide for themselves, so the line needs to be drawn somewhere.

Pseudo Enigma 01-24-2014 01:36 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dynam0 (Post 4065405)
Don't be a fool. Some people do require assistance at some point if they cannot provide on their own. It sounds like I'm contradicting my post, but Cavernio is obviously intelligent and has the ability to do great things (though she may say otherwise); it was applying to her. Some people really cannot feasibly provide for themselves, so the line needs to be drawn somewhere.

I didn't say leaning on others wasn't a possibility. Sorry if it sounded like that. Humans naturally lean on each other. It's all we're good for.

TheSaxRunner05 01-24-2014 01:46 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
I'd change someone's personality if I were able, and if they were a complete douche. Sure you can't make people change, but you can certainly let them know when they're actions aren't appreciated. There's often an attitude of "just let them be" when it comes to these sort of people. I've found if you don't address them, they just continue to piss in the drinking water (figuratively). Those kind of people negatively affect everyone they meet.

devonin 01-24-2014 01:49 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
We tell ourselves that the thing that makes us better than the animals is that we don't discard the sick, elderly and disabled. We've "evolved past" the point of needing natural selection to keep us going. We can modify our environment around ourselves sufficiently that natural evolution has functionally stopped, and we have the excess resources needed to support people that are unable to contribute.

But of course 'contribute' is a word that needs defining too. Cavernio seems to want to define it like "Have a job in the commercial market" or something, which of course has nothing whatsoever to do with contributing. It's -a- way to contribute, but it's very far from being the only way.

Cavernio 01-24-2014 01:51 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
And here's where people think I have low self-esteem. I don't think I do, because I have experienced low self-esteem before. I know I'm good at a great many things. I'm frustrated by my mental health. It negatively affects every aspect of my life.

I'm sorry drizzleromancegirl, this is a CT thread and I should treat it as such. It really depends on what you're doing that someone else thinks is immature in how it's either a good thing or a bad thing. If someone is judging you negatively because you are being immature and there's no real downside to your immaturity on the given subject, then fuck them. If on the other hand you're being immature and it negatively affected someone else, the mature thing to do is consider how it negatively affects the other person and what you'd need to do to change it and then think about whether or not it's worth it to change your actions so that it won't happen again, or even if it's feasible to change your actions.

Some people call certain actions immature when maturity has little to do with it. Rather, it may simply be a social expectation that ultimately has little bearing on anything and you're not doing what someone else expects and they're so off-put by you not fulfilling that expectation that they call you immature. I've been called immature for things outside my control, like getting a flat tire. (No idea where it came from, I drive like an old person most of the time, slowly)

As everyone else has said though, mature actions in general make the world go round. They usually have a purpose where if at least x% of people aren't mature, society would crumble.

reuben_tate 01-24-2014 01:52 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
If anything, acting all arrogant and thinking that you can do each and every single thing by yourself with no assistance is just as immature as someone who is "babysitter" and gets assistance even for the things they could easily do themselves. Being responsible means you do what you need to do to get things done and sometimes that requires you to kindly ask for or accept the assistance of others. If your house is on fire, you don't say "I don't know how to extinguish a fire this large, oh well" and let it burn, you call 911 and ask for the assistance of firefighters.

drizzleRomanceGirl 01-24-2014 03:36 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
I would like to point out that I'm not against acting mature; what I'm irritated about is the societal pressure and sometimes even insulting attitude that some people seem to possess when anyone is acting against social expectations.

People in general do not agree to any of the social expectations placed on everyone from when they are born until the day they die. I agree that being mature in many situations leads to a productive society. However, when people lower others' self-esteem by insulting someone's character instead of the sole immature action, this usually leads to a lower morale. As a result, this personal attack will most likely hinder the latter group's productivity in the long run. Furthermore, I don't understand the reasoning of how attacking someone's self-esteem when behaving immaturely, when most of these people have never agreed to these expectations in their entire lives, is justified.

Tps222 01-24-2014 03:49 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Tough skin: A Highly Useful Skill In Life.

popsicle_3000 01-24-2014 04:13 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
you'll get over it

Mollocephalus 01-24-2014 04:20 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
This entire thread seems like it comes from an untold personal drama. drizzlegirl, remember that some people will make ad personam attacks because, well, they don't know any better. You have to be able to tell what was wrong on your part and what wasn't. Don't pick up these kind of attacks, learn to discard them as they do not help you understand how to improve, nor they facilitate the process. As said before, get a better idea of your capacities and limitations, get stronger and more confident while constantly finding ways to improve yourself. Make your charachter bolder and learn to counterattack when it's right to do so, as well as learning from your mistakes and separating the insult from the actual, legitimate critiques.

dAnceguy117 01-24-2014 04:23 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
thick skin wouldn't be needed if everyone were always patient and understanding.

being patient and understanding wouldn't be needed if everyone always had thick skin.

strive for both? I guess that's what I'm getting at haha.

Groupon Abortion 01-24-2014 04:28 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pseudo Enigma (Post 4064977)
Just because you've reached your 6571st day on this planet...

Quote:

Originally Posted by popsicle_3000 (Post 4064981)
either 6566 or 6567 depending on the year you were born.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pseudo Enigma (Post 4064994)
leap years lel

ur both wrong 18*365.25=6574.5

Cavernio 01-24-2014 04:44 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Since when does someone need justification to do something?
If you fight all of the expectations society puts on you that you never agreed to, you will forever be struggling.
Pretty much the only thing you can do is explain your view of things, of that expectation, and why it's bogus or wrong etc, and hope that you can change how some people perceive you and the world. Doing that can even be cathartic, win win.
If someone doesn't listen to you, that's their problem. Not everyone is worthy of your attention.

RB_Spirit 01-24-2014 04:45 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
-Puts shades on-

-Reads posts-

popsicle_3000 01-24-2014 05:10 PM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Groupon Abortion (Post 4065506)
ur both wrong 18*365.25=6574.5

lol what

there are 365 days in a year.

18*365=6570.
depending on the year you were born, you've either lived through 4 or 5 leap years by the time you turn 18.
6570-4/5 = 6565 or 6566.
your 18th birthday is 1st day of 19th year of your life.
= 6566 or 6567th day on earth.

drizzleRomanceGirl 01-26-2014 04:29 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cavernio (Post 4065510)
Since when does someone need justification to do something?
If you fight all of the expectations society puts on you that you never agreed to, you will forever be struggling.
Pretty much the only thing you can do is explain your view of things, of that expectation, and why it's bogus or wrong etc, and hope that you can change how some people perceive you and the world. Doing that can even be cathartic, win win.
If someone doesn't listen to you, that's their problem. Not everyone is worthy of your attention.

Thank you, I agree with everything you said except for your last sentence. :) I appreciate your point of view, and I'll follow your advice about explaining my viewpoint to the people who irritate me. ^.^

Pseudo Enigma 01-26-2014 06:14 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by popsicle_3000 (Post 4065519)
lol what

there are 365 days in a year.

18*365=6570.
depending on the year you were born, you've either lived through 4 or 5 leap years by the time you turn 18.
6570-4/5 = 6565 or 6566.
your 18th birthday is 1st day of 19th year of your life.
= 6566 or 6567th day on earth.

leap years are 366 days not 364

for every 4 years you add one day...
anyway this is seriously off topic. Stop.

popsicle_3000 01-26-2014 08:12 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
*face palm*

now that's embarrassing

Cavernio 01-27-2014 10:24 AM

Re: Why is the Idea of Adults Expecting Others to be Mature so Irritating to Me?
 
You literally cannot pay attention to everyone in your life. There isn't enough time to. You must pick and choose.


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