Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

So then what's wrong with them?

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

Mental illness (shooter being crazy) being used as a "reason" here is pretty silly in my opinion.

Poor/clouded judgement is more appropriate I believe. They have reasons, but as I said in my only post in this thread, it's usually something extremely petty, grudge-like even, or tied to religion and beliefs.

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

You and Sanji are just repeating mindless conservative rhetoric whether you realize it or not. See how your pedantry has shifted the entire conversation towards mental illness and crazy people?

This quote is quite literally a strawman. No one is saying that "nothing is wrong with the shooters." The actual questions are:

1) Is actual, clinical mental illness a measurable cause for mass shootings (answer: no), and
2) Are we okay with conversatives making this about mental illness without ALSO EXPLORING OTHER FACTORS

I mean for FUCK'S SAKE, WE HAVE THIS SAME CONVERSATION AFTER EVERY SHOOTING FOR 20 YEARS.

And nothing fucking changes! Nothing happens! Because the fucking NRA says "it was just a crazed lone wolf!" and politicians can't speak out because the NRA is throat-fucking them to death.

How hard is this to actually accept??????

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

These people are at the very least morally deviant and while to some extent that is usually fine it's escalated to like
Not valuing human life
And that's beyond just not fitting in with society. That's legitimately primevally wrong somehow, it can't be normal for anyone

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

Nobody has said there's nothing 'wrong' with them. They have anger issues, they have entitlement issues, they have privilege issues, they have issues with expressing their feelings in harmful ways. These things are not mental illnesses.

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

you're running into the same problem; with each one, its not a matter of "what's wrong with them" because you're looking for some umbrella way of viewing them all as the same

the Pulse Nightclub shooter had internalized homphobia iirc (less informed about this one; someone could correct me)

the Port Arthur shooter hated the world and everyone in it

the Columbine shooters were on the bottom of the social order and wanted to lash out against those that put them there

some shootings are racially/religiously motivated

the unifying point, for me, is not that they are "insane" but that they have a problem with something so extreme that they are willing to go to such lengths, for whatever reason, in response to the problem

some people are definitely insane I remember a story about someone who thought he was in the game World of Warcraft, for example

I might not be doing this point justice though

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

Like holy shit, the El Paso shooter LITERALLY TOLD US that he wanted to kill Mexicans and was inspired by people using xenophobic rhetoric.

The answer is literally staring you in the face. You don't even have to guess what he was thinking. He literally told you in his own words.

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

The pulse nightclub shooter was gay lol

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

But how can anyone bring themselves to that point
Murder isn't just some form of like "hey I feel like being bad what's something bad I can do" it's the ultimate act of restriction of freedom

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

You are ill-equipped to contribute anything meaningful to this discussion

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

All I'm saying is if America was 300 million of me, gun violence wouldn't be an issue

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

looks like my info is outdated and that wasn't the case

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

lol
well, its not, so what are you doing here then?

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

So it's really freakin easy to structure an argument where guns aren't a problem because for the vast majority of people they aren't

I think at this point gun control is largely symbolic and as an antifederalist it's not something I believe should happen in any large form because of that

Normal people also shouldn't have access to instruments literally for the purpose of killing people but I'm not even sure how one would get something like that without having to step through hoops anyway

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

I recall reading that the fact that it was a gay club had nothing to do with the selection at all, and that there was evidence on his computer that he was basically looking around for any place that would be really crowded that day.

"However, according to federal law enforcement officials, the FBI suspects the witnesses claiming Mateen's homosexuality could be mistaken, and has doubts that Mateen was gay. Law enforcement sources said the FBI found no photographs, text messages, smartphone apps, pornography, or cell tower location data to suggest Mateen lived a gay life, closeted or otherwise"

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

It goes both ways

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

to make a false equivalency, for the vast majority of people, cancer isn't a problem

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

And it still kills more people than guns right

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

I'm honestly glad that everyone is being very mature and civilized about this topic. I was kind of worried that something was gonna go off the rails at this point.

This is why I love this community. Not only that, some of you guys have brought up a lot of good points.

Re: El Paso and Dayton Shootings (SERIOUS TOPIC)
 

Sometimes, people get so angry they do the dumbest things because they believe they're actions, however terrible, justifies whatever "reason" they had.

I'm sure you've done something stupid when you're angry.

And if it's not directly anger, then it's indirect anger with a desire to send a message because you're fed up something that's causing you anguish.

...

Actually makes me wonder if any of the shooters that haven't committed suicide after the fact ever regret their decision to shoot once they've spent some time in prison.