Queue/Batch Discussion Thread v2

[FFR Pro 21]

Files I'll be submitting:

• Power, Wisdom, Courage - Powerglove (modified from the last batch)
• Touhou Judgement in the Sixtieth Year - Fate of Sixty Years - S.S.H. (still a WIP, but I should be able to get it done for the batch)
• CIA Rave v3 - DJ Acsent (really strongly feel that the site could use a v3 as I looked at the other 2 versions of the song)

[Xx{Midnight}xX]

Originally Posted by AlexDest

337.5 bpm 16th jumpstream at ending

well, good fucking luck ffr

You forgot the sort of stupid shit that gets in all the time, that sounds like it'd get through because "ffr needs more dump stream."

Also I have no idea what I want to send this batch.

[Razor]

Originally Posted by Coolboyrulez0

SigSig - Yuuyu
Breakthrough Atmosphere - Xi

you know how I do

[TC_Halogen]

I'm trying to constrain myself to files that are no higher than VC in difficulty for the next batch.

As of now:

- Aventyr [Heavy] / Grand Thaw - I intend on making an [Oni] as well.
- Alias / Rameses B - will be cut down a bit, probably ~2:20; have been testing a few cuts
- Sentence / me - might cut this down by a phrase, depending on how it plays; I made the first part of this progress a little too slowly...

Not sure what I want to do for the fourth song -- anyone have suggestions?

[Razor]

include the BGA for Aventyr :]

[iironiic]

Submitting probably one file this time. Grad Erjila by Grand Thaw. I will probably make edits to it when I have the time.

[Plan_Bsk81127]

Posting here since its related to the batch, but imo I think the way we go about the batch process needs to be updated because the current way is pretty bad.

My suggestion is to make the batches more frequent. Instead of having these 5 month gaps in between batches, make the batches monthly or every two months. Now of course going about it this way means other things need to change, but they will change for the better. By making the batches more frequent, this means you have to cut the amount of files accepted which will be simple to do and be more beneficial.

So in order to cut the amount of files accepted just make the acceptance rate more strict. This isn't a bad thing, it is actually what is needed because it is a joke that charts that get through with a 6/10 rating, never get fixed, then get thrown in game. Don't see why charts with a failing grade deserve to be put in game. Poor quality charts shouldn't be accepted, that's pretty clear. Make the acceptance rate more strict like 8/10 in order to be accepted. This indeed will cut down the amount of charts accepted each batch, they will be good quality charts, and leading into my next point, people will not have to wait 5 months to resubmit it. The stricter acceptance rating will push people to learn more about stepping and push them to try harder on their charts knowing they need a minimum of 8/10 in order to get by.

Doing the batches every month or every two months would for sure be better for users. They no longer have to hold on to files extended periods of time just to wait for the next batch to open, which is very nice if you are resubmitting a chart that barely missed the cut the first time. This new process would also keep people stepping actively. I'm sure it would be nice to have the pressure off knowing that if you don't make it this batch, the next one is not too far down the road.

Now, onto how this is affecting judging. I'm sure some will think by making the batches in such a crunch period of time, judging is going to be rushed or some other nonsense like that. Based off of past actions with judging, it is easy to see they don't need all that much time to judge through charts and it doesnt take as much time as they think it needs to judge through their part of the batch. A good chunk of them either do them the first or last day anyway. Don't often see someone drag it out the whole week+ like we are doing now. If you cant do notes that quick then dont be a judge, you clearly arent suited for it. Half the time the notes dont even seem to be useful from some of the judges anyway, so I dont see a week+ worth of effort being put in. Either way, aside from that, we have plenty of people who can judge. I think there are plenty of people in the community who are at least as good as the current judges. We will have plenty of backups if the primary judges aren't available to judge certain batches. There will be plenty of batches, so it will help give them a breather from time to time.

Overall, this has been on my mind for awhile now, and just wanted to others views on it, because I honestly think this process needs a change. Its a mess and we need to find a way to change it to make it a better process as well as get better quality charts in game.

So: batches monthly or every two months(week 1: submissions, week 2: judging, week 3: notes released; can be ajusted, but just a basic layout), stricter acceptance rate(8/10), get more judges, etc. The process doesnt take more than a month tbh, this two~ month process with a 5-6 month gap between batches needs to go.

Side note: Another topic that would be nice to discuss is forcing fixes on charts. We have notes for a reason and if they arent going to be applied whats the point of wasting the time, give a number grade and move on. Force people to fix their charts before putting them in game, especially if the same issues are coming from multiple judges.

[kommisar]

batches are usually every month or two months lol


unless there's a major tourney going on

[Charu]

Oh yeah.

Resubmitting:

Jeh Jeh Slammin' by DJ EAR

Sending in:

Super Scooter Mappy by Yamajet

Raccoon Flicka by Kommisar

[DarkZtar]

Originally Posted by TC_Halogen

Not sure what I want to do for the fourth song -- anyone have suggestions?

wanna collab? I only have 1 file ready atm ~=[

[AlexDest]

Originally Posted by Plan_Bsk81127

My suggestion is to make the batches more frequent. Instead of having these 5 month gaps in between batches, make the batches monthly or every two months. Now of course going about it this way means other things need to change, but they will change for the better. By making the batches more frequent, this means you have to cut the amount of files accepted which will be simple to do and be more beneficial.

As Kommi said, we already do have a month to 2 month gap for batches, as long as there isn't an official tournament going on. But, a smaller submission cap can help keep the monthly gap going, even during an official tournament.

Originally Posted by Plan_Bsk81127

So in order to cut the amount of files accepted just make the acceptance rate more strict. This isn't a bad thing, it is actually what is needed because it is a joke that charts that get through with a 6/10 rating, never get fixed, then get thrown in game.

I agree with only the fact that there are notes provided for the stepartist to fix certain things, but he/she doesn't go out of their way to make use of those notes to fix any mistakes. What I would recommend, is to send the stepartist a personal message and inform him of the notes and give them the option to apply these fixes or not.

Originally Posted by Plan_Bsk81127

Don't see why charts with a failing grade deserve to be put in game. Poor quality charts shouldn't be accepted, that's pretty clear. Make the acceptance rate more strict like 8/10 in order to be accepted. This indeed will cut down the amount of charts accepted each batch, they will be good quality charts, and leading into my next point, people will not have to wait 5 months to resubmit it. The stricter acceptance rating will push people to learn more about stepping and push them to try harder on their charts knowing they need a minimum of 8/10 in order to get by.

You truly don't understand how rare an 8/10 average is for a simfile out of about 100 other simfiles, the acceptance rate will drastically descend. Not even that, all the "elite" stepartists have pretty much depleted from the entire stepmanian universe, so "objectively good quality" charts are pretty scarce.

You're even forgetting that since Tass has been gone, the quality/acceptance of charts have increased ten-fold, and that batches don't have an 8 month gap.

[TC_Halogen]

@ Plan: The acceptance ratings are strict as it is, though.

You are correct: the current judgment system lists a 6/10 as [+.], or lightly accepted. However, the acceptance average, after applications of deviation/strictness, is typically ~6.7. This changes based off of the number of accepted files occasionally, with higher acceptance levels leading to higher averages. In the long run, this could deter simfile artists from submitting if they continually fall just short. In one of the batches, six out of ten of the simfiles forced to conditionally queued missed the mark by 0.02 or less. As far as forcing changes, this is unfair to the simfile artist and it reduces the power they have by creating a simfile. A force should only be applied if the file violates a parameter of submission (like having a step in the first second in such a way that causes it to drop steps), or if the song can't be cut because of permissions, or... something that legitimately breaks a rule upon submission.

Alex responded to pretty much everything else I wanted to talk about, haha.

[Razor]

having the acceptance rate at 8.0+ would just make people cry even more than they do now

[psychoangel691]

I had made a suggestion some time ago, I can't remember if it was in judges chat or in the forum now. Anyway, I suggested that the email be open at all times for people to submit so that they don't feel the need to rush and throw their max cap in every time a batch comes around. But have a monthly cap so people don't go so overboard with it. Then basically grab however many at a time and see who's available for judging and send them out. This could help when there are less available judges as well by doing a smaller group of files at a time.

I think overall this would help improve quality because people wouldn't be rushing to make it into the batches that are unpredictable and might just make people more relaxed with submissions in general.

They had sounded interested and spoke about giving it a try but then it just never happened. Idk just a thought.

[TC_Halogen]

Originally Posted by Razor

having the acceptance rate at 8.0+ would just make people cry even more than they do now

Having the acceptance rate at 8.0 means like... only 10% of the batch would have been accepted, hahaha.

Actually, I'm really curious to see how many got 8.0 or higher now.

EDIT: ahahaha, only ten files out 134, lmfao. 7.46% acceptance rating, let's do it

[Xx{Midnight}xX]

What's the point in having a batch anymore?

We keep putting things in game without it, so why bother?

Free acceptance for everyone

[t-rogdor]

Originally Posted by Xx{Midnight}xX

What's the point in having a batch anymore?

We keep putting things in game without it, so why bother?

Free acceptance for everyone

mmmyeah baby i can just smell all the offsync vertex beta resteps

smell that bullshit

[psychoangel691]

Originally Posted by Xx{Midnight}xX

What's the point in having a batch anymore?

We keep putting things in game without it, so why bother?

Free acceptance for everyone

Internal batch isn't the same as things not going through any process at all. You really need to just get off this already.

[Xx{Midnight}xX]

Originally Posted by t-rogdor

mmmyeah baby i can just smell all the offsync vertex beta resteps

smell that bullshit

Fractured Sunshine is all that awaits in the future anyways...

Or as Rudi once told me, it's no big deal, no big deal.

Originally Posted by psychoangel691

Internal batch isn't the same as things not going through any process at all. You really need to just get off this already.

You can't even get the basic point, so stop replying with "get off it" and start trying to figure out an actual reasonable response to what I said instead of deleting it.

[Choofers]

sounds like midnight is upset

i'd even say that

he's mad