FFR Suggestions

[Fission]

could have sworn that wasn't the case but w/e. either way, one of the game managers should elaborate on the "why not" since it seems to be something that a lot of players want.

Originally Posted by ryuyasha

give people more opportunity to rush through songs for a quick FC, which could then lead to even more mashing for even more FCs.

conversely, there is more chances to mess up FCs because of hidden jacks or the like. also, nobody should care about FCs. FCs don't mean anything in FFR, it just means you mashed well enough to not CB or better. you need to actually check their levelranks.

[mi40]

Originally Posted by ryuyasha

I dunno, not trying to come up with an arbitrary example to justify not allowing higher rate scores, just my two cents. AAA on higher rates may be harder to achieve, and therefore show more skill, but ultimately that is not the same as AAA on normal rate.

it is not an AAA on a normal rate, it's an AAA on a higher rate which shows your skill

basically the levelranks are saying: "i can AAA this file on 1.0"
and if you can AAA on something higher than 1.0 then it's like saying "i can do even better, but i can AAA on 1.0 as well"

it's like what if somebody mashed a FC on rato 1.1, what difference does that make versus a mashed FC on rato 1.0? if anything it's harder to mash FC rato on 1.1 so if somebody gets a better scores on rato 1.1 mashed than rato 1.0 mashed, then the 1.1 score should replace the 1.0 score

and if the person could mash fc rato 1.1, they could probably get a better score on 1.0 (which would then replace the mash fc 1.1 score)




also it provides an incentive for people to start playing most of the genres (esp. for medium to higher level players, which i consider to be a good portion of the site, like d3+)
most players do not go back to difficulty range 1-50 once they're past that.. they keep moving up with their skill level and if they've never played certain songs from difficulty 1-50, they will probably never touch those (unless they have a shitton of time & dedication)

basically a lot of files get boring once you're way past the skill level (d3 players won't play level 10 songs for fun), and rewarding players for achieving scores on better rates than 1.0 provides a new refreshing experience (with rewards!) for the majority of players

who wouldnt want to play secret zombie room on 1.5 lol

[TheSaxRunner05]

If rates recorded, it would make Vrofl easier to get (anyone could take any song to the density of whoring vrofl, something I am not against). If higher rates make easy songs more interesting and fun for some, I don't see the reason not to allow it. Credit whoring would be easier too, for those who want to earn back gambling hall losses.

I'm for it (+2cents)

[Fission]

Originally Posted by mi40

the 1.1 score should replace the 1.0 score

ehhhhhhh

you can muck with the frames by messing around with rates. now that i think of it, i feel like that would be the main problem with counting AAAs on different rates

[ryuyasha]

Of course FCs do not matter. But the score-keeping thinks otherwise. Plus there are at least 2 different achievement tokens based on percent of public song FCs.

Edit: Way to go Sax. That is totally a legit reason. And Fission, too.

[mi40]

Originally Posted by Fission

ehhhhhhh

you can muck with the frames by messing around with rates. now that i think of it, i feel like that would be the main problem with counting AAAs on different rates

higher rates would cause worse frame placements in every single case so idk



also people need to realize, higher rates require that much more stamina & skill - and you're being rewarded for that

think of something lower than 1.0 as practice mode (nothing counts)
but anything higher than 1.0 is a challenge


ex)
if you're gonna play vertex beta 1.5 it's gonna be hard as fuck, and you're only going to be saving like 30 seconds per song
so even if you were to 'whore' for vrofl, you're gonna have that much of a harder time FCing a song
rato has a really good NPS but people dont use it to whore vrofl because it's stupidly hard and hard to FC
same case with higher rates, try whoring EHHS 1.5 for grandtotal, you won't even FC half the time lol

[One Winged Angel]

My only qualm with allowing rates higher than 1.0 to record on the same scoreboard is for instances where a higher rate actually makes the song easier to PA, and these instances do exist given FFR's timing and the way the converter adjusts frames for the file on specific rates. If the song is legitimately more difficult on the higher rate (which it will be 99.5% of the time), obviously the player is more than capable of doing just as well or better on a lower rate, so why not record it?

The argument Fission posted that was supposedly mine is incredibly dumb and I'm upset that my name is being tagged to it lol

[Fission]

not really that legit of a reason imho. you can just modify vrofl requirements and credit counts for higher rates. problem solved.

Originally Posted by One Winged Angel

The argument Fission posted that was supposedly mine is incredibly dumb and I'm upset that my name is being tagged to it lol

i already said that if you didn't make that argument, feel free to correct me. i was just really convinced you did, but i'll take your word for it.

Originally Posted by mi40

higher rates would cause worse frame placements in every single case so idk

it makes rolls easier in the sense that it makes the frames closer together so they are more forgiving if you aren't as consistent. same with hitting trills as jumps on higher rates.

[mi40]

i hope this gets discussed between the site admins cause it would add a LOT more replay value to the game

(with incentives of course, like being rewarded for AAAing beethoven virus on 1.5, which would be an AAA in levelranks + same GT/creds you would've gotten as 1.0)

[YoshL]

i'd like to say, AJ (TC_Halogen) tried to test this theory with something like, Skeletor. At around maybe 1.2/1.3, the rolls would basically be jumptrillable, leading to easy AAA right?

yeah, even at his level, he says the initial first half is dumb, and even the speed of the roll gets super dumb

basically, cool, frame gaps get fixed, but you're still playing the song faster than before, and the "cheating patterns" may be easier, but you're still playing a faster, more draining song.

[Fission]

+1 to adding rate incentives

[ryuyasha]

Originally Posted by Fission

not really that legit of a reason imho. you can just modify vrofl requirements and credit counts for higher rates. problem solved..

But would you want to have to balance all that out? That is not something you could just slap a coefficient on and have it work, or even a standard function curve.

[mi40]

credit counts & GT are the same for higher rate songs & 1.0 songs

the only thing is the time spent

but for the most part the time saved playing a song on a higher rate goes into an increased difficulty (harder to FC, thus harder to score on, thus leading to a lower GT and credit count)

[TheSaxRunner05]

Originally Posted by One Winged Angel

My only qualm with allowing rates higher than 1.0 to record on the same scoreboard is for instances where a higher rate actually makes the song easier to PA, and these instances do exist given FFR's timing and the way the converter adjusts frames for the file on specific rates.

Maybe these songs just need framer fixes.

[YoshL]

posting a new post so it doesn't get lost in debate lol

look at SM. People don't go wow you put an ez quad file on rates and still quad it that's definitely going against what was originally intended, you don't have the skill to sit through a longer song. bluh

It's not a skill or even like, hard to sit through long songs. It's just tedious, and makes playing FFR not fun. Make FFR more fun. let higher rates record.


Although someone made a point a while back to maybe only let rates at an increment of .1 to record so you don't have people going like 1.0461x to manipulate frames or some dumb crap

also i dare someone to try SSSG on like 4x, seriously that's the most funny crap ever, all the vibrating needed.

[Fission]

Originally Posted by YoshL

look at SM. People don't go wow you put an ez quad file on rates and still quad it that's definitely going against what was originally intended, you don't have the skill to sit through a longer song. bluh

It's not a skill or even like, hard to sit through long songs. It's just tedious, and makes playing FFR not fun. Make FFR more fun. let higher rates record.

^^

[mi40]

made by the people for tha people....

[ryuyasha]

Originally Posted by YoshL

also i dare someone to try SSSG on like 4x, seriously that's the most funny crap ever, all the vibrating needed.

That was so ick. Even after I found a reasonable speedmod (3x).

[axith]

Originally Posted by One Winged Angel

My only qualm with allowing rates higher than 1.0 to record on the same scoreboard is for instances where a higher rate actually makes the song easier to PA, and these instances do exist given FFR's timing and the way the converter adjusts frames for the file on specific rates.

I imagine it would make Story of Snowman and Sunshine Girl easier to AAA. Or make files with barely non-jumptrillable rolls easier too. As for the 'easier to grind for GTS and creds' arguement. I say that anyone who cares to mash for vrofl, or Dendrite v2 can do it. It sucks to mash for them. Getting scores recorded on higher rates won't really make mashing for them suck any less.

I don't know if the site architecture is such that a score with rates can be put toward credit count and gts, but not to the levelranks. But if this is an option, I think I'd prefer it. Otherwise. I like the idea of scores on rates 1.1 and higher recording.

[mi40]

why would GT/credit count be prioritized and not levelranks lol