Old 02-20-2013, 07:49 AM   #221
buizel8888
FFR Player
 
buizel8888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Groton, CT USA
Age: 33
Posts: 1,536
Send a message via AIM to buizel8888 Send a message via MSN to buizel8888
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

nor was Roar
__________________
<%SSH|Korysar> does anyone else watch pornos for the soundtrack
<Mehified> No offense to you tho xd
<@Alive> i misunderstood the meaning of shiney instruments and he tole me to calm down
<+lurker> if i want porno music
<+lurker> i'll listen to the sonic 3 ost
<%SSH|Korysar> LMFAO
<sjoecool1991> ahaha
buizel8888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 07:55 AM   #222
moches
FFR Player
 
moches's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Age: 28
Posts: 3,996
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

Quote:
Originally Posted by buizel8888 View Post
Request that the name of this pack be turned into FFR Drama Pack 1

Holy fuck I wasn't even involved in the drama this time
this is hardly drama, though. the discussion has been very civil throughout this thread, even when people didn't like the pack or specific aspects of it

as long as it's productive and respectful, I think it's a good thing
moches is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 10:09 AM   #223
Wayward Vagabond
Confirmed Heartbreaker
Retired StaffFFR Simfile AuthorFFR Veteran
 
Wayward Vagabond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Age: 35
Posts: 5,856
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

Incoming posts


Quote:
Originally Posted by who_cares973 View Post
ok im back from subway. the question should be what does fun factor consist of for you? why? because everything else listed is what makes up fun factor. im so ****ing tired of people saying that files have more technicality than fun factor or that flow was taken more into account than fun factor. ever since that QED thread people have been comparing things to fun factor when they have no god damn idea what their talking about. its like mainstream political hot words that are used all the ****ing time. global warming would be a great example.

so please for the love of god stop comparing things that make up fun factor to fun factor itself. not only is it annoying but it makes you look like a no nothing jackass.


OK what i find enjoyable in files is how well the file follows the music. if theres an intense section in a song i expect the difficulty to spike in that section. if theres a soft mellow section in the song i dont expect to be hitting 32nd bursts even if there is a small blip bloop that those 32nds go to. I also enjoy balanced files that dont have a hand biased. sure if the music is mainly panned to the left or right then yes i expect the chart to reflect that but when the music is even and im hitting nonstop left hand running men or hidden 8th jacks on the right hand constantly during 16th js then i will probably not care about playing the rest of the file and i probably wont ever play that file ever again.

for me a fun file has no one concept dominant over another. for example i dont like purely technical charts nor do i enjoy purely expressive charts. a chart that maintains its technically through out while still expressing the song to the best of the step artists ability. as long as i get what the step artist is trying to do that is good enough for me.

i could type out much more but i'll refrain from doing so xd
Quote:
Originally Posted by who_cares973 View Post
the only reason devour is in game is because of how many times xander send that god damned file to the batch and how tired all the judges were of playing it. also sweet



there is more to stepping a file than just technicality. ALSO FUN-NESS OF A FILE IS THE SUM OF ALL ASPECTS OF STEPPING AND NOT SOMETHING THAT SHOULD BE CONSIDERED BY ITSELF.

technicality
fluidity
music relevance

these are the three things that make up FUN and depending on the song at hand and the stepartist there are varying degrees of each that go into the final file. until people realize this no one will get anywhere and it'll just be idiots running in circles chasing their own asses
Quote:
Originally Posted by who_cares973 View Post
proper sync and layering contribute to the correctness of a file. a file doesnt need to be 100% technical 100% fluid or 100% relevant to the music to be fun but there is always a percentage no matter how small that is contributed from each
Quote:
Originally Posted by who_cares973 View Post
i already replied to aj's point so i wont go there. with the current judging system any reject from a single judge would completely ruin the chances of a file getting in. this is going to change soon though. the problem with having one judge from every skill level(which ive suggested before but i hadnt really thought it through then) is that there arent many people qualified to judge that would meet the skill level requirements. even now there are judges on the panel who tend to put their feeling about the file before most everything else. most of the judges on the panel though are able to cover all angles so i think we're good there



i dont see how knowing what makes a file fun has to do with difficulties. but for the second thing i already mentioned what makes a file fun: technicality, fluidity and music relevance. this is the basis of every file and what people use to rate the fun-ness of a file though people that dont have any knowledge of stepping wouldnt refer to those terms when talking about why they like a file.

some reasons why you would like waiwai

the file flows amazingly well and has no abrupt changes in the way the file is stepped. the difficulty remains almost consistent the entire time and its easy to distinguish what the file is stepped. the sync is fine so you are questioning if you're hitting the notes on time. having it flow as well as it does also means that you can actually pay attention to the song without having to really concentrate on the file to score well on it. the jack usage is also well done because it doesnt affect the flow of the file much and it keeps you from getting too bored with the file by increasing the difficulty of the file a bit. the usage of bpm changes also makes for great eye candy. it makes it easy to distinguish the parts that require more attention from the parts that require next to none.

also my theory on files is pretty well organized and hasnt failed me yet. i dont receive many complaints on my newer files so i must be doing something right

Last edited by Wayward Vagabond; 02-20-2013 at 10:17 AM..
Wayward Vagabond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 11:14 AM   #224
TC_Halogen
Rhythm game specialist.
Retired StaffFFR Simfile AuthorFFR Music ProducerD8 Godly KeysmasherFFR Veteran
 
TC_Halogen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Bel Air, Maryland
Age: 32
Posts: 19,376
Send a message via AIM to TC_Halogen Send a message via Skype™ to TC_Halogen
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

Quote:
Originally Posted by kommisar View Post

then you make sure to step eveyr audible sound in dddream studio cuz thats what all the people who make unfun files use
if you make fun of DDream users one more time I'm gonna chop off your dick.
TC_Halogen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 11:30 AM   #225
t-rogdor
tane orb
FFR Simfile AuthorFFR Veteran
 
t-rogdor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,685
Send a message via Skype™ to t-rogdor
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

this thread is dumb i quit stepmania
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by cetaka View Post
I saw a flyer on a bulletin board at school asking for high-functioning aspergers/autism people to participate in some kind of experiment, and all I could think was, that sounds like a great place to meet girls.
t-rogdor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 11:34 AM   #226
stargroup100
behanjc & me are <3'ers
FFR Simfile AuthorFFR Music Producer
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,051
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

yeah wc pretty much got this

I don't know why kommi is so buttmad but technicality is not an extreme. a file is not black and white, technical or not technical. it's how to effectively use things that we have established will HELP make a chart more fun, such as pitch relevance

ps pitch relevance is not let's squeeze an entire song into a 4 key piano it's placing notes such that the melodic contour is acknowledged and the notes are not placed randomly


expanding on this if anyone cares to read:
this is the same thing for all mediums of art. there is no piece of art that is purely technical or purely expressive, because there will always be some degree of subjectivity in the interpretation and there must be some sort of technical ability that went into the making of the art. someone with an acute ear might hear a subtle dissonance in a piece of music that was not meant to be there, pointing it out for the artist. this is not a nitpick that will make the music "technical to the point where it's not enjoyable to listen to," it's an improvement made to an already enjoyable piece. if someone points out that a piece of art has a disproportionate body somewhere, it doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad piece of art or it's unappealing, and fixing it certainly won't make it any worse. most importantly, it makes the artist aware of where he needs to improve technically if he wants to better his craft.

example: jimerax is known for his very "technical" style of charting, but he has made a lot of good stuff and he does stick to what he believes is fun to play, and no matter how you look at it he has drastically improved a lot of my charts thanks to a lot of edits that he was capable of that I wasn't

also this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by kommisar View Post
The best simfile artists have narrowed it down to "does it feel like i'm playing the songs" and "is it fun to play". That's literally everything any casual player will care about or even most experienced players. People play shit that's fun.
overrated quote that states the obvious
Quote:
The best chefs have narrowed it down to "does it taste good" and "is it appealing to look at". That's literally everything any casual customer will care about or even most critics. People eat shit that's good.
Quote:
The best musicians have narrowed it down to "does it sound nice" and "is it enjoyable to listen to". That's literally everything any casual listener will care about or even most experienced people. People listen to shit that's good.
you could just "place notes where you feel like it as long as it's fun" but that doesn't necessarily make you a great or even good artist. great artists understand that there is a degree of technical ability that goes into the art of the craft and using that ability well and that technical ability it not the only thing that matters. you can't do calculus without first understanding basic math. you can't efficiently cook a complex dish without knowing the basics of cooking. you can't write a novel until you learn to read. anyone that doesn't acknowledge these things can turn out to be QED, thinking he's good but actually having 0 technical ability. the only thing that separates him from someone like us is previous experience and examples, and in that case we are still influenced by the technical ability of others through emulation, so i don't see what you're trying to get at

the days where people over-analyze or "abuse technicality" are long gone (haha longgone), at least in the sm community that I'm observing now kpce i made my point
__________________
Rhythm Simulation Guide
Comments, criticism, suggestions, contributions, etc. are all welcome.

Piano Etude Demon Fire sheet music

Last edited by stargroup100; 02-20-2013 at 11:40 AM..
stargroup100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 11:39 AM   #227
stargroup100
behanjc & me are <3'ers
FFR Simfile AuthorFFR Music Producer
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,051
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

also I did say I didn't want this to degenerate into drama and this is borderline touching it so let's plz not reach a point where my pee-pee goes back inside of me thx
__________________
Rhythm Simulation Guide
Comments, criticism, suggestions, contributions, etc. are all welcome.

Piano Etude Demon Fire sheet music
stargroup100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 11:41 AM   #228
swordmasterz
FFR Player
 
swordmasterz's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Don't stalk me!
Posts: 272
Send a message via AIM to swordmasterz
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

it's okay guys

it's comforting to know that at the end of the day people are still gonna be playing Reach's Gigadelic and your file will be collecting dust in a folder somewhere

~funfactormanias~
__________________
o
swordmasterz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 11:42 AM   #229
AlexDest
good hot
Retired StaffFFR Simfile AuthorD7 Elite KeysmasherFFR Veteran
 
AlexDest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: North Carolina
Age: 29
Posts: 5,309
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

StepMania
__________________
AlexDest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 11:49 AM   #230
stargroup100
behanjc & me are <3'ers
FFR Simfile AuthorFFR Music Producer
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,051
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

ROFL

also id like to say that wc is like one of my most favorite people in this community despite this old running joke where i hate on him LOL
__________________
Rhythm Simulation Guide
Comments, criticism, suggestions, contributions, etc. are all welcome.

Piano Etude Demon Fire sheet music
stargroup100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 11:56 AM   #231
kommisar
Dark Chancellor
Retired StaffFFR Simfile AuthorFFR Music Producer
 
kommisar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Moncton, NB
Age: 33
Posts: 7,300
Send a message via AIM to kommisar Send a message via MSN to kommisar
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

Bufang do you actually think I give a shit about anything that's been said in here lmao







































I seriously don't. I do what's fun for me which is the purpose of a game. I could
Give less of a fuck about theories and technicality. Nobody will ever agree with anything anyways
__________________
kommisar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 12:10 PM   #232
TC_Halogen
Rhythm game specialist.
Retired StaffFFR Simfile AuthorFFR Music ProducerD8 Godly KeysmasherFFR Veteran
 
TC_Halogen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Bel Air, Maryland
Age: 32
Posts: 19,376
Send a message via AIM to TC_Halogen Send a message via Skype™ to TC_Halogen
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

Another point of discussion: is it necessarily a bad thing if a simfile artist possesses the capability of creating something that would be considered "masterful" in its purest form, but doesn't? I'm actually asking this as a person who knows they have an understanding of the construction, structure, and technical elements that make up a good file. When it comes to simfiling, I have trouble understanding what is "fun" because I like to see myself as a really high-level player that pushes boundaries, and my files tend to do the same thing. As a current example, I'm stepping Tendon by Igorrr:



In technicality, everything here is accounted for, and technically isn't overstepped, but it's quite obvious that the patterns are really rigid (and intended to be as such). When do we draw the line of being correct to the point of being "unfun", when "fun factor" is truly a subjective term? Some files considered "artful" feel right, but aren't always enjoyable to me -- for example (not a personal shot at you stargroup), I was never a huge fan of Castaway, which is a great file on a structural level. At the same time, something like dondon151's Break the Sword of Justice v2 Beginner file is something intended to have poor structure and be hard is a lot more enjoyable to me.

It's so hard to find a great balance. Where's moches? He always seems to find the medium for me (Micro Media Broth, holyfok <3).
TC_Halogen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 12:23 PM   #233
stargroup100
behanjc & me are <3'ers
FFR Simfile AuthorFFR Music Producer
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,051
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

Quote:
Originally Posted by kommisar View Post
idc
shrug suit yourself bro

Quote:
Originally Posted by TC_Halogen View Post
stuff
there's no concrete answer to that question, because what you're asking is partially a matter of taste, and therefore style becomes a huge factor

for example, people like mi40 and torrent love their dnb and stuff, and while they do make some really great stuff, they're not my cup of tea simply because I find dnb songs very tiring and grating to listen to, and the charting style associated with it is a bit rigid for my tastes

in my opinion, what makes a chart "masterful" is its awareness to everything. it needs to not only demonstrate a good ear that is capable of picking up on both the details in the song as well as the "essence" of the song as a whole, but also the ability to somehow demonstrate this through the notes. this is why I think kil is the undisputed master of charting; he has one of the best ears in terms of interpretation of the music, and his execution in the chart itself is pretty much flawless. it is extremely difficult for someone to take one of his charts and say "I can do that better" and live up to their word

but just as this is the case, not everyone has a taste for his style, and with good reason. some people don't appreciate his skills because they either don't understand and/or they don't care, and there's nothing wrong with that. I resonate strongly with the charting medium as an art form, so that's where I lean and it determines how all of this affects me. however, other players might see it as a competitive game, for example, and in this case importance is placed on difficulty, not artistry

so there's really no easy way to answer this question. it's basically "you can't please everyone." it just depends on what your target audience is, and as long as you can please your target audience, you can consider yourself successful

also, there's a difference between liking something and acknowledging quality. there are a lot of "subpar" charts out there that I love playing, just as there's a lot of "crappy" food out there that I love eating. I know it's not good, but it doesn't mean I don't enjoy it. similarly, there's a lot of quality music/charts/food out there that I don't enjoy, even though I understand why they are good. quality is something that is supposed to be more universal, based on that set of rules we have defined for art, but personal taste is just whatever you like
__________________
Rhythm Simulation Guide
Comments, criticism, suggestions, contributions, etc. are all welcome.

Piano Etude Demon Fire sheet music

Last edited by stargroup100; 02-20-2013 at 12:30 PM..
stargroup100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 12:40 PM   #234
hi19hi19
lol happy
Retired StaffFFR Simfile AuthorFFR Veteran
 
hi19hi19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: DESTINY
Age: 33
Posts: 12,193
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

What the fuck is this thread


You guys
__________________


hi19hi19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 12:46 PM   #235
Roar176
FFR Player
 
Roar176's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: France
Posts: 235
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

Quote:
Originally Posted by t-rogdor View Post
this thread is dumb i quit stepmania
lesgo make osu maps rogman
__________________
(heidy)(heidy)(heidy)(heidy)(heidy)



(heidy)(heidy)(heidy)(heidy)(heidy)

get mad h8ers
Roar176 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 12:57 PM   #236
Coolboyrulez0
VICES
FFR Simfile AuthorFFR Music ProducerFFR Veteran
 
Coolboyrulez0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Germany
Age: 30
Posts: 10,031
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

Quote:
Originally Posted by hi19hi19 View Post
What the fuck is this thread


You guys
gonna have to go with the good old autism on this one

ps: no one cares, fun is subjective, technicality is subjective in the long run, just step how you wish and that's it. is everyone gonna like it? fuck no.
mass appeal sucks anyways. lol at everyone who thinks that this is, and the discussion at hand is serious.

Last edited by Coolboyrulez0; 02-20-2013 at 01:04 PM..
Coolboyrulez0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 01:07 PM   #237
cedolad
moonchild~
FFR Simfile AuthorFFR Veteran
 
cedolad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: .
Age: 30
Posts: 6,879
Send a message via Skype™ to cedolad
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

so since when does a long discussion of technicality = drama? I'm just curious who made that a rule.
__________________
cedolad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 01:14 PM   #238
Coolboyrulez0
VICES
FFR Simfile AuthorFFR Music ProducerFFR Veteran
 
Coolboyrulez0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Germany
Age: 30
Posts: 10,031
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

It isn't -- it's just fun to see people all riled up about the subject of technicality vs. fun
which arises ever-so-often and always ends up inconclusive due to peoples pre-convinced notions about simfiling.

Last edited by Coolboyrulez0; 02-20-2013 at 01:20 PM..
Coolboyrulez0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 01:14 PM   #239
intensez
FFR Player
 
intensez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Age: 31
Posts: 944
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

pr technicality and etc came around when stepping used to be a group of elitists (which also had packs that really no one could submit to unless you're one of them) and if you made a file and made a single file thread about it it was generally all about how bad it was or that you suck at file making. plus the ONLY information you could get about how they made their ~good files~ was if you went into the editor and figured it out yourself on their files from other packs (odi, odi2, ppp, ppp2, etc)

there wasn't actual criticism or any information telling you why it was bad. i know all of this because i was getting into stepping a few months before odi2 came out and i remember i hated releasing any files b/c i never got real criticism about them
intensez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 01:34 PM   #240
cedolad
moonchild~
FFR Simfile AuthorFFR Veteran
 
cedolad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: .
Age: 30
Posts: 6,879
Send a message via Skype™ to cedolad
Default Re: FFR Community Pack 4 Released!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coolboyrulez0 View Post
It isn't -- it's just fun to see people all riled up about the subject of technicality vs. fun
which arises ever-so-often and always ends up inconclusive due to peoples pre-convinced notions about simfiling.
cute.
__________________
cedolad is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:40 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright FlashFlashRevolution