Queue/Batch Discussion Thread v2

[iironiic]

Suggestions: For everyone on the judge team, do not publicly disclose the deadline for notes. You know that the community is extremely impatient when it boils down to batch notes.

Community: Cooperate with us and expect delays since you all should realize that we all have lives.

Judges, know your schedule and do not commit if you cannot get the notes in time.

JX/bmah: If judges fail to meet the deadline, lower their submission cap by one for the next batch only (or something similar to this). Also, try and communicate more with the judges to see where they stand.

[Hateandhatred]

Originally Posted by iironiic

Suggestions: For everyone on the judge team, do not publicly disclose the deadline for notes. You know that the community is extremely impatient when it boils down to batch notes.

Community: Cooperate with us and expect delays since you all should realize that we all have lives.

Judges, know your schedule and do not commit if you cannot get the notes in time.

JX/bmah: If judges fail to meet the deadline, lower their submission cap by one for the next batch only (or something similar to this). Also, try and communicate more with the judges to see where they stand.

<3

[SKG_Scintill]

Originally Posted by iironiic

Suggestions: For everyone on the judge team, do not publicly disclose the deadline for notes. You know that the community is extremely impatient when it boils down to batch notes.

Community: Cooperate with us and expect delays since you all should realize that we all have lives.

Judges, know your schedule and do not commit if you cannot get the notes in time.

JX/bmah: If judges fail to meet the deadline, lower their submission cap by one for the next batch only (or something similar to this). Also, try and communicate more with the judges to see where they stand.

What kind of a solution is this? This is only adding consequences to misbehavior...
You have to tackle the problem before it happens...

Edit:
If you want a kid to learn for his exams, you get him to learn before he does the exams instead of saying "you'll be grounded if you fail your exams". The fact that they didn't succeed is consequence enough, you just have to make them aware of it beforehand.

[AlexDest]

[iironiic]

Originally Posted by SKG_Scintill

What kind of a solution is this? This is a summary...
You have to tackle the problem before it happens...

It's a suggestion to remedy the problem... not a solution...

[SKG_Scintill]

Made some edits to my last post you quoted

[Charu]

Hmm, guess I shouldn't have asked for the deadline way earlier, eh? =P

I don't know, I mean it's a double edge sword. I like to know because I have a general grasp at where some nice juicy notes will be released. I really did not expect to see notes the same day or even two days in advance.

But, if you must have the deadline a secret like everything else as a judge, then so be it I suppose. However, I would actually see that as a way to put any more incidents like this under a rug and not be exposed.

That's just me though, haha. Though... now that I think about it, I do have a suggestion about the deadline being given thing.

Perhaps when every single judge has more than 50% of their batch done at a reasonable time, a deadline could be given, much like how when a developer is very close to completion on their game they give a release date.

[SKG_Scintill]

No, at the start of development a deadline is already set
You just make sure you give some room, the rest is just "how much have you done so far?" and "did any unexpected difficulties occur"

[yo man im awesome]

Originally Posted by SKG_Scintill

No, at the start of development a deadline is already set
You just make sure you give some room, the rest is just "how much have you done so far?" and "did any unexpected difficulties occur"

I think he means to release the premade date to the public once the judges have reached 50%

[iironiic]

Originally Posted by SKG_Scintill

Edit:
If you want a kid to learn for his exams, you get him to learn before he does the exams instead of saying "you'll be grounded if you fail your exams". The fact that they didn't succeed is consequence enough, you just have to make them aware of it beforehand.

Okay, I see your point. But if you don't enforce consequences, the kid will respond to something along the lines of "it's just one exam." Judges have expressed this kind of attitude as noticed earlier. How do you fix that?

[SKG_Scintill]

That's just procrastinating procrastination
(talking to yoman)

Edit @ iironiic:
Sure, but I hope the judges are aware of the consequences by now. It's been nearly every batch in the last few years.
It's not just one exam, this is every exam.

Edit v2 copy from prochat:
[9:39 PM] SKG_Scintill: can't just expect everyone to do their job when there's no surveillance

[iironiic]

Originally Posted by SKG_Scintill

Sure, but I hope the judges are aware of the consequences by now. It's been nearly every batch in the last few years.
It's not just one exam, this is every exam.

I realize it's "every exam" but the fact that it is "one exam" makes it insignificantly important. Using exams isn't the best metaphor since we are comparing something important to something meaningless, but the points come across.

Unfortunately, this will occur in every batch since there is too much leniency in the process. It's human nature to be extremely lazy and discouraged to get the most meaningless tasks done.

EDIT:

Originally Posted by SKG_Scintill

[9:39 PM] SKG_Scintill: can't just expect everyone to do their job when there's no surveillance

I agree. Hence why I suggested bmah and JX to keep tabs on the judges.

[SKG_Scintill]

There's been plenty of use of spreadsheets for tournaments, why not implement that for batches?
Might work?

[Wayward Vagabond]

Originally Posted by psychoangel691

Oh I'm sorry let me rephrase it because you guys want to pick at wording. It's being used as a tool/excuse to say that it's okay for things to be late because over 3 years ago it took longer.

i said do it that way so people know what really waiting for notes is not as an excuse to be late

[iironiic]

Originally Posted by SKG_Scintill

There's been plenty of use of spreadsheets for tournaments, why not implement that for batches?
Might work?

Not a bad idea. This will also give the chance for other judges to see each other scores, giving them a chance to discuss about their ratings and lessening the likelihood of inconsistent scores like + - - +.

[psychoangel691]

We're not supposed to be swayed by other people's judgements. That's the point of not knowing one another's scores. Otherwise someone can just go oh well this judge gave it x so I must be wrong about something. Defeats the purpose of multiple judges.

[SKG_Scintill]

Good that you mention, judges weren't supposed to be able to see the other's scores because of possible bias right?
Oh psycho said it

Anyhoo, you can censor the result until all judges have given a rating
Just show that they sent a result, not what it is

[yo man im awesome]

Originally Posted by SKG_Scintill

Good that you mention, judges weren't supposed to be able to see the other's scores because of possible bias right?
Oh psycho said it

Anyhoo, you can censor the result until all judges have given a rating
Just show that they sent a result, not what it is

this sounds very reasonable, and I like it alot

[SKG_Scintill]

Btw, I could make this a project for this year of my programming study. Second year, so this seems like a program of reasonable size. Also, to learn ActionScript.

[iironiic]

Originally Posted by psychoangel691

We're not supposed to be swayed by other people's judgements. That's the point of not knowing one another's scores. Otherwise someone can just go oh well this judge gave it x so I must be wrong about something. Defeats the purpose of multiple judges.

Well it's not the matter of convincing the other judge to give a certain rating. It's to discuss with each other about their ratings and consider the other judge's reasoning. You are not obliged to change after discussion since it is essentially your rating of the file.

I dislike the lack of communication between the judges because then there would be many controversial opinions about some files. I strongly believe that the process should reflect more teamwork than individualized judging.

Only my two cents.