Old 05-11-2019, 01:09 AM   #1401
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

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Originally Posted by Hakulyte View Post
My problem with MML not checking me is that I cannot see if he intentionally not target me so I cannot know if he's lying or not to me based on alignment.
Another point is that I could know if godfather or red which honestly is pretty valuable at this point.
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Old 05-11-2019, 01:52 AM   #1402
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

Of course, no one is here anymore.
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Old 05-11-2019, 02:18 AM   #1403
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

can i just sanity confirm that antori's role was wolf 1-shot role cop

like we all saw that, right?

there's no chance of a serial killer anymore btw because roundbox was real (he'd have to have been fake after the last lynch)
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Old 05-11-2019, 02:21 AM   #1404
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

i am leaning lynching mml, make me quote the posts in the morning

roundbox block choice is actually kind of hard because the fake cop can just carry kp, but you also don't wanna block the real cop
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Old 05-11-2019, 02:24 AM   #1405
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

i almost suggested the cops check each other, but the flip made that irrelevant, so that would be why to peek among the unchecked

i get to be incredibly annoyed by mml's peek being the least helpful one for my solve
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Old 05-11-2019, 05:49 AM   #1406
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

Believe haku over mml, wolf roleblock would roleblock one of the cop claims there.
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Old 05-11-2019, 05:50 AM   #1407
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

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Believe haku over mml, wolf roleblock would roleblock one of the cop claims there.
Thought this is what shado was going for with the waiting for checks but I guess not
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Old 05-11-2019, 06:05 AM   #1408
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

Shado keep doing that thing where he answers for others when he should be sitting back and waiting for said person to answer.

Also didn't like how he kind of indirectly pushed me to claim.

It's like trying to control events to unfold a certain way when there's no reason to evaluate said event until it happens.

Ideally, I should have claimed one phase later.

Something's fishy here imo.
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Old 05-11-2019, 08:14 AM   #1409
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

in the case that one of the cops flips godfather, we have enough living green checks to win. if one of the cops flips roleblocker, none of the green checks in the game matter. cop power is kind of a formality as of last night.

hakus checks make more sense than mmls, and was a claim that came out very naturally without any pressure iirc. however, things that both of them are saying suck rn LOL

but i do want to reiterate that we still make it to final 3 at worst

there were like 3 derp plays in the skimming i did this phase alone and i refuse to clear anyone for that kind of thing lol
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Old 05-11-2019, 12:11 PM   #1410
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

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Originally Posted by MixMasterLar View Post
I don't know if Im blocked or if it was because my target died

It's actually really weird that he was the target anyway

Also if I was saved and the SK picked a target he thought the wolves would never (which lets face it, do-nothing-and-then-push-a-mislynch-Xel fits the bill) then there's still a world where two killing forces double stack on Star night 1

I basically dont think this is a safe assumption
Quote:
Originally Posted by MixMasterLar View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by inDheart View Post
mml, can you run me through why you chose to peek xel again?
Because he would be the hardest to read for me, probably would have ghosted this entire phase if alive, and I was pretty confident he wouldn't be NK'd. Oops.

Everyone else would have been much easier to solve.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MixMasterLar View Post
me being alive is some weird ass gamble because wolves are in a tight jam and feel that they can worm themselves out of it if it's a point of contention...which actually makes almost no sense but I believe it before I believe all 3 of us are town
Quote:
Originally Posted by MixMasterLar View Post
For Gradiant it, I think it was half random on my part. Sort of felt like a good check to me at the time, especially since I do feel good reading him half the time.
there are several hallmarks of "not the most legit claim" here, including the one where the attempted xel peek + claim of blocking forestalls potential setup locking, and not going and finding the answer to the "i don't know" and letting the ambiguity hang out there

(incidentally, that could be thought to give the claim legitimacy, because claiming No Result is otherwise unnecessary and forces you to give a peek the following night, but it could also just be a mistake)

also, thoughts beyond that

given that antori's claim was 1-shot roleblocker, it seems fairly likely wolves knew about the full roleblocker, though whether this is by peeking him or being blocked is tbd. so this tells them one letter and they know 2 more are out there. but even if A is one of those letters, an angel can't protect the same night

it is not a guarantee that wolves learned this info n1, and i suppose it's not wrong for them to sit on using the role cop shot, but were i on that team i'd be tempted to fire it off immediately. but in the world where wolves rc roundbox n1, why does he live through n2? there's potential for angel dodging (i wouldn't say the townreads on him d0 were wide, but i was one of those people) but then why do you not take the kill that's never an angel target. remember at this point the cop claim battle wasn't set up, so they didn't really have to count claims yet and plan kills accordingly

i'm starting to think xel died because mml peeks red and they thought he could be a cop from d1. go check his eod, even stuff before that. even if you know a roleblocker exists, what role is higher prio to find and take out if you've got a lead? a cop

notably this world doesn't require either dai or gradi to be the godfather based on rb's targets, though i'm keeping the gradi gf thing in the back of my mind because of a few reasons
1. being mml's first peek
2. being wrong about why mml would get no result, which makes me think he could push for this line of play in wolfchat based on his own misconception
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Old 05-11-2019, 12:13 PM   #1411
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

"inD it's not morning anymore"

look, i have a bunch of west coaster friends and i'm skidding
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Old 05-11-2019, 12:26 PM   #1412
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

i also did some thinking on the question of, why did antori claim. if he and shado, as partners, both stay in the unpeeked vt pool, they're in trouble, but antori's role ever flipping gives us the setup and outs where a partner is generally, whereas shado flipping godfather wouldn't

the thing is, i believe godfather shado making the fake claim locks the game when he flips, so that'd be a distinct incentive for him not to try a claim and makes me still unable to clear him

this is, admittedly, colored by the assumption that the fake cop is the roleblocker

i iterated on this for people in the green check pool too but it seemed less definitive there
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Old 05-11-2019, 12:57 PM   #1413
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

cf.

Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
Booooo
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
Hey roundbox

let me ask you something

would you be down to lynch lar today
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
btw Antori this is how you wall post :]

1) Daikyi


Solid postu.


2) roundbox


I'm getting flashbacks on d1.


4) MixMasterLar


I like this post... about as much as I like waking up at 230 in the morning... But I can see how town lar would post this

but it really feels like you're seeing an oppertunity to suck up and taking it. BUT IN CONTEXT TO THE REST OF YOUR GAME It leaves me a tad torn on which interpretation appeals to me more



Hindsight here: I think star was having the same vibes I'm having on this reread. And I'm gonna sheep it a bit, that in context with the above quoted post, you are looking less townie to me right now, especially with her flip.





I smell the oppertunity from here and greatly wish I had addressed this on d0.



I feel like what happened was is that you either: A: Went along with your d0 lynchanomics of lynching a low post count. Or B: Used your lynchanomics to purpose two easy lynches that are easily awful because OH NO THEY NOT POSTING THEY NOT MEETING MY STANDARDS but it's typical d0 lar and it's really ytou trying to score an easy mislynch for wolfteam.

And I don't think I've read a game where this is the impression your lynchanomics has given me.

Now I really wanna take a moment to touch on something super important. In any other game, when you call someone out, and they outright defy you, you never let them slide. And other than a half assed "hey guys xel's a choice as well" you didn't even TOUCH me for outright shitting on you.

These posts:






Are disgustingly antagonistic. I'm literally laughing in your face, and you fucking hate that. Remember the part of this section where I mentioned a post that reads one of two ways? This section is why I lean to the second one. You *might* have gotten intimidated that I'd actually pick myself up to fight you and that'd throw off what you're doing openly.

There's no reason for you to have not dunked on me for these posts.

Especially when this post is in the game:



Where I actually spell it out so rudely, I'd even argue this post is fucking toxic, and I don't give two fucks about how rude you are in a game of twg. I only tame my shit because I genuinely can't be bothered for the aftermath of not doing so.



I was being so goddamned toxic there's NO EXCUSE to have not made mince meat of me, the hell you doing this game man, the narrative isn't that important!

ps as d1 starts you again don't even touch this shit.



YOU DON'T EVEN TOUCH IT.

NOT EVENNNNNNNN

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH



Hey FFA: ThISSss iS ThE NARaTivE at play he established.

NICE.


5) Gradiant
You make a good call out I mention later in the post, noting here as a positive for you.



I do like this because it's not "how much he cares" it's an actual trait we can talk about

how much I care or not is completely imparative to what I'd tell you, the only person who can fight that point is me, and that's just self-meta.


7) inDheart


I leik dis p0st

Also there's a back and forth between star and InD on page 5 I really like more on a reread with Star's flip.



oh, stop mindmelding with my actual read

jerk



Yikes.



See like

at least unlike a certain someone, you did you, boo.



Yesssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss


8) XelNya - AH
Ass hole.


9) flashflash account


this post sucks dicks



At the point of the game this post is located, it's gross. Even with your general d0 shitposting tone it's bad.



WHY THOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO



Rude. I disagree on Lar tho~ his tone is completely out there and if you say he's being nonsensical I'd argue that should be a red flag for lar.


10) Antori


I don't like this post.



Noting this spicy point out here and not in the gradiant pile



There is a way better point for you to be at in this point of the game. THIS feels like a pad vote.

Admittedly your posting in d1 has been better especially on page 32.


11) Hakulyte


Usually I skip Haku's posts because they're really wordy and he ends up getting lynched for something else.

I commented on day 1 with InD how I thought Haku was not playing a "I don't know how to wolf here" game and was playing a "I missed my chance to enter in my usual fassion" kind of game. This post is part of the why, and it's not so much because Haku said this I leaned that way, but it's how his play reflects this post that convinced me.



Unique Haku post here folks.

Also on Page 5 Haku has a bunch of shit posts that feel outta Haku place for me. Is that even a term?



This is probably your least likable post I've seen you make.


12) mellonxcollie


The cluster of posts at this point of this game are.. Not great.

Especially when later roundbox posts as shado put it a "rubric" of how she plays and if part of that is she's posting more frequently, it falls moot when there's posts like this at the juncture of the game it's at. (Earlier in the game would have been totally fine though. It's about the placement not the content here.)

Her posts do get kinda better as the day's going on, they're just not worth quoting.



This feels like a good post, but the second part of the post is... Questionable is the word I'd use. It tone wise leaves a bad mention in the back of the brain. But that's not indicitive.


13) ShadoWolfe


to be honest, I leik dis post because it was a mindmeld



on a reread I should like roundbox significantly less than I said I did. Roundboxes posts to me read better on d0 than they do d1. And Yoshl is that despite the curbing of toxicity he's posting in a way that takes him off the table but doesn't confirm to the town pile.

This got misplaced: Wolf and yoshl back and forth is pretty clean



Random thoughts at the end I wanna throw out there

1. It's very different to see roundbox play a passive role in a game. It'd look horrible if he was trying to assert something similar to yoshl / gradiant in trying to change something about their play.
2. I think this is the first game I have outright wanted to see lar get shot by a vigi, like right now.
3. I think Raeko should be on the table tomorrow, but there's CERTAINLY better choices for today.
4. Nightkilling Star was such a great kill. Her game was so on point and leaving her alone would have caused wolf team problems, but none of her reads really point me to one person I'd wanna see go for it.
5. Let's go on the votecount exploration.



I wanna theoryshit my thoughts on this:

1 Wolf is on WV
1 Wolf is on FFA
The last wolf is either on FFA or in the solo vote department

why? It feels from a wolf perspective this is the way the votes ought to be placed. Wolves have day chat..


I guess a where I be list.

1) Daikyi
2) roundbox
4) MixMasterLar
5) Gradiant
7) inDheart
9) flashflash account
10) Antori
11) Hakulyte
12) mellonxcollie
13) ShadoWolfe

Out of the greys I'd say mellon but I don't think she's posted enough to day to land in either pile, and the discussion is still going pretty good on it. I really like InD based on posts, and even with the progression but I'd want to see a hard push to sell myself.

Lar is a wolf in my eyes because his play doesn't feel authentic, it feels like it plays to a narrative, and he's dodged things and provocations in a way I don't think he usually does, especially when someone outright says come at me and he doesn't, particularly because of the context of where it happens in the game.

At the very least for now I am not entertaining a shado lynch.


Spoilering this because it ruins the rest of the post if it's in the open

lar


my head hurts
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
reminds me

lar

and yes I had to redo this
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
hey fuck face

their entire metaread of me is based on how interested I come off to be in the game

As in my entire read is based on if I appear to have "checked out"

swapping me for you would not be anywhere equivocal
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
As in lar literally was trying to peg me this game for it
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
Lar is a better lynch
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
Lynch lar with me

Thats what i need from you
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
Lar is a wolf

Twg whatevernumberthisgameisfuckinghellusenumbersalready


peep that colorized reads list
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Old 05-11-2019, 01:19 PM   #1414
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

that also means antori literally asked me what i thought about the big post from the guy they might have thought was the cop to see if i was down with lynching him

yeah i like where this is going now
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Old 05-11-2019, 03:56 PM   #1415
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte View Post
Shado keep doing that thing where he answers for others when he should be sitting back and waiting for said person to answer.

Also didn't like how he kind of indirectly pushed me to claim.

It's like trying to control events to unfold a certain way when there's no reason to evaluate said event until it happens.

Ideally, I should have claimed one phase later.

Something's fishy here imo.
Excuse me?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte View Post
Shado keep doing that thing where he answers for others when he should be sitting back and waiting for said person to answer.
Where do I do this? You literally asked me, "Why would I not check MML after Antori flip wolf ?"

I don't "answer questions for others". Period. I haven't done it once this game (including the comment on Gradiant's post early on). I'd love for you to quote me directly answering a question addressed to anyone other than myself. It doesn't happen.

I'll share my thoughts on stuff that I think is relevant, even if its an ongoing conversation, but it's a plain lie and misrepresentation of my play to say I answer questions for others. If you end up being town we can talk more about why weighing in on everything, even ongoing conversations, is a *GOOD* thing later on


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte View Post
Also didn't like how he kind of indirectly pushed me to claim.

It's like trying to control events to unfold a certain way when there's no reason to evaluate said event until it happens.

Ideally, I should have claimed one phase later.
MY MAN, YOU DID THAT ALL ON YOUR OWN.

You claimed two green checks right off the bat at a point when everyone had already broken cover in our reactions to MML's claim. My reaction was like "damn, forreal?" or something along those lines.

You saying "hypocop" at that point does NOT magically restore cover to you. If you felt you should've claimed one day later then you absolutely should've. But you can't have it both ways. So instead, I made the best of the situation where we had TWO outed cops and started a massclaim hoping that mechanics would lead to a wolf.

and GUESS WHAT? THEY DID. That is NOT "Shado indirectly pushed me to claim". It's more like "I claimed and then waffled with an impossible hypocop so Shado held me accountable by telling me to either confirm or retract and now I'm upset because I realized I should've claimed one day later".
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte
I followed the "by the book" play, but I was reading the "not to do" page.
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
" I'd suck a dick in a dark, dark alley."
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoshL View Post
"i gave you 20 ducks, and spent a lot of time making one of them quack, and pointed at the particular one and asked "is that one the worst quacker"" ... "you could still give somewhat of an answer based on the quality of the quacks, and the other random quacks from the ducks surrounding that weren't the center of focus."
Quote:
Originally Posted by mellon_collie
"I love Wolfe's duck avi so much. Shado's Duck Shrine is the best!!
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Old 05-11-2019, 04:10 PM   #1416
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

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Originally Posted by ShadoWolfe View Post
Can you walk me through what info you got from the night actions? Without revealing your own role, if you are one.
How would you answer that yourself ?
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Old 05-11-2019, 04:18 PM   #1417
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daikyi View Post
because we have 7 players alive, even if we lynch the wrong cop first, we will get down to final 3.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gradiant View Post
Believe haku over mml, wolf roleblock would roleblock one of the cop claims there.

I think keeping these two lines of reasoning in mind leads to:

>Because fakeclaiming cop will get lynched guaranteed either this phase or next, wolves are required to block the real cop or reveal too much info to recover from
>If they knew this, though, then it wouldn't make sense for wolves to come out with a claimed check. They would claim No result and end up at a thunderdome with no additional mechanical info.
>Wolves would not care to block the real cop if the godfather is not the fakeclaiming cop. Either godfather has already been checked or godfather is in the unchecked (includes those checked by the fakecop) VTs.
>Wolves claiming to be blocked while letting the real cop out his check is then possible, as is claiming a check while blocking the real cop. This is pretty much WIFOM and reading too much into goes nowhere.


I think I have a better shot solving Haku than MML so that's where I'ma focus my reading. If anyone else thinks they have a good handle on either player, now's the time to ISO them and come to a conclusion. Despite the fakecop getting lynched either way, it'd help town's odds immensely if we do get it right the first time. I don't think we're ever lucky enough to have the fakeclaiming cop be the godfather given the claimed checks, unfortunately.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte
I followed the "by the book" play, but I was reading the "not to do" page.
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
" I'd suck a dick in a dark, dark alley."
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoshL View Post
"i gave you 20 ducks, and spent a lot of time making one of them quack, and pointed at the particular one and asked "is that one the worst quacker"" ... "you could still give somewhat of an answer based on the quality of the quacks, and the other random quacks from the ducks surrounding that weren't the center of focus."
Quote:
Originally Posted by mellon_collie
"I love Wolfe's duck avi so much. Shado's Duck Shrine is the best!!
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Old 05-11-2019, 04:24 PM   #1418
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte View Post
How would you answer that yourself ?
I wrote that before seeing your green checks. You can read my following post and see very obviously the difference in reaction once I actually saw your claim.

It was in response to this post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte View Post
Honestly, I wonder if we have enough info from night actions to win by PoE already.
which struck me as odd given the night actions (deaths + MMLs checks) didn't come close to solving game in my eyes, so I wanted you to elaborate on how we could win by PoE.

Also, you claimed before I wrote that, so how am I forcing you to claim after the fact?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte
I followed the "by the book" play, but I was reading the "not to do" page.
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
" I'd suck a dick in a dark, dark alley."
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoshL View Post
"i gave you 20 ducks, and spent a lot of time making one of them quack, and pointed at the particular one and asked "is that one the worst quacker"" ... "you could still give somewhat of an answer based on the quality of the quacks, and the other random quacks from the ducks surrounding that weren't the center of focus."
Quote:
Originally Posted by mellon_collie
"I love Wolfe's duck avi so much. Shado's Duck Shrine is the best!!
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Old 05-11-2019, 04:28 PM   #1419
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

This paranoia actually feels towny coming from Haku. He's just directing it at the wrong person rn.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte
I followed the "by the book" play, but I was reading the "not to do" page.
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
" I'd suck a dick in a dark, dark alley."
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoshL View Post
"i gave you 20 ducks, and spent a lot of time making one of them quack, and pointed at the particular one and asked "is that one the worst quacker"" ... "you could still give somewhat of an answer based on the quality of the quacks, and the other random quacks from the ducks surrounding that weren't the center of focus."
Quote:
Originally Posted by mellon_collie
"I love Wolfe's duck avi so much. Shado's Duck Shrine is the best!!
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Old 05-11-2019, 04:30 PM   #1420
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Default Re: TWG CLXXXV: C9+++++++++ Game Thread

Oh god I wish I could delete my own post. I realized too late it could inspire a whole ton of fake paranoia if he's wolfing
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakulyte
I followed the "by the book" play, but I was reading the "not to do" page.
Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNya View Post
" I'd suck a dick in a dark, dark alley."
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoshL View Post
"i gave you 20 ducks, and spent a lot of time making one of them quack, and pointed at the particular one and asked "is that one the worst quacker"" ... "you could still give somewhat of an answer based on the quality of the quacks, and the other random quacks from the ducks surrounding that weren't the center of focus."
Quote:
Originally Posted by mellon_collie
"I love Wolfe's duck avi so much. Shado's Duck Shrine is the best!!
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