K8107 [10 or 11]

[FontSize72LOL]

Given the other thread was closed, I figure I'll re-open this topic for discussion.

First of all, this song was an 11, and after playing it a few times i don't see why it was ever bumped down. The beginning is fairly simple, then it goes into a series of long trills (including several one handed trills). They aren't exactly super hard to Combo/PA but if trills are your weakness, you'll end up dumping a lot of goods here, although its not necessarily hard to combo. The middle of the file isn't too hard you have some alternating left-right anchors and then a small stream section, then you get to the part that makes it an FMO, it starts trilling again and on top of that, you have an 8th staircase (LOL). Not only is this hard to PA, its hard to combo.



Also lets compare some stats with a few other long standing FMO's from around that time period.

K8107
Number of AAAs: 156
Number of FCs: 759

Novo Mundo
Number of AAAs: 115
Number of FCs: 1,365

Epidermis
Number of AAAs: 121
Number of FCs: 826

Exciting Hyper Highspeed Star
Number of AAAs: 144
Number of FCs: 1,166

and here are some 10's for comparison

L9
Number of AAAs: 217
Number of FCs: 1,818

Szamar Madar
Number of AAAs: 237
Number of FCs: 2,082

Air
Number of AAAs: 141
Number of FCs: 2,339

Overall the file is just really awkward, and most of it is much harder (To me, and i know this is pretty subjective) than Novo Mundo and a handful of other newer Low FMO's.

[bmah]

Clearly the subjectivity comes down to the player's ability to trill as you've implied. So if we want to make a difficulty that best represents the song for the majority of players, I don't mind leaning towards an 11. It seems that if there are two patterns people hate the most, they are 1) jacks and 2) trills (some have problems with one-hand trills while others have trouble with trills in general). This song has layering on the 8th at the end, with trills of both the one-hand and two-hand types.

If trilling wasn't a problem for most people, there'd be much less people wanting this file as an FMO. But since it is, and since the point of changing a difficulty is to have it best represented as possible, you've got my support.

[rayword45]

The first half is very simple, not much harder then OTFD IMO.

However, after that, the streams get quite sloppy, with awkward patterns, lots of jumps, and some one-handed anchors (although I have no problem with that). The jumpstream can be somewhat draining for some.

I'd say this is harder then Rottel.

[Mau5]

Originally Posted by rayword45

I'd say this is harder then Rottel.

I'd say they're pretty close, yesss..

[Evnoir]

That hard section - it looks somewhat similar to Sambista...

To me, K8107 is a lot easier than Sambista (which is a 10); although, regardless of that, I still believe K8107 is a FMO song simply because of those trills.

[popsicle_3000]

FMO: 1st set of thrills aren't enough, but the ending set w/ jumps thrown in there push this to an 11 i think

[reuben_tate]

The beginning half of the song would warrant a 10, but the pattern selection in the second half with really awkward patterns such as those weird trills are definitely enough to warrant it as an FMO.

[rushyrulz]

It used to be an 11 and the avmiss fix didn't change any aspect of this file's difficulty. It should have remained an 11.

[MikeShinoda12345]

it's an incredibly low 11, but an 11. not only is the trill + jump section fast, but the transitions are quite awkward.

[Xx{Midnight}xX]

K8107 being an 11 is pretty much like this:

All it is is trills and jump trills.
There's a lot of one handed trills (Which are ****ing hard to a great deal of people.)
One handed trills + jumps = harder than blooddrunk.

But like Bmah said, this chart's only an 11 because a general majority of the site sucks at one handed trills in specific, and there's a LOT of them in the chart.

Please make it an 11 again.

[MikeShinoda12345]

One handed trills + jumps = harder than blooddrunk

uh
the problematic patterns in blooddrunk are the one handed trills + jumps

==

[igotrhythm]

Originally Posted by Evnoir

That hard section - it looks somewhat similar to Sambista...

To me, K8107 is a lot easier than Sambista (which is a 10); although, regardless of that, I still believe K8107 is a FMO song simply because of those trills.

K8107 is 232[34]232[34] (every fourth note in the trill)
Sambista is 23[24]32[34]23[24]32[34] (every third note)

Pattern is similar, but in terms of technicality it's radically different.

I don't know why I mind the anchor jacks in this file less than the ones in Tricky Techno, but I do. There's one minijack in the whole file (out of the purple up/down trill into the first stream), the 1h trills in the first part are fairly short and easy to maintain PA on, 12 hits per second doesn't convert too terribly and isn't unfairly demanding for a lot of experienced players, the patterns themselves aren't terribly complicated outside of the anchors and jumpstream in the climax.

I'm going to say this is a 10. It was bumped down for a reason.

[JJTrixX]

this should be changed back to an 11, it's easily a low fmo due to one handed trill transitions near the end. I find this chart more difficult then several fmo charts in terms of executing accurate trills as a spread player.

[Zakvvv666]

It should stay a 10, individual player skill does not have anything to do with difficulty, if you're good at trills, "The only hard part is the ending" if you're not, "**** this song is too hard because I'm not that great at trills".

It's a high 10, and should stay that way.

[rayword45]

Yeah, but that ending is INCREDIBLY demanding with those staircases, and comparing this to files like Rottel (only one hard part) and LWI (straightforward throughout), the massive difficulty spike constitutes an 11.

If the ending was a file alone, I'm pretty sure it'd be an 11.

[Zakvvv666]

Rottel isn't every FMO, and sure the file is hard there, but otherwise everything is easy, if you're just a little good at trills, you can auto-AAA everything but the ending like me, then you just need to be a little better(and maybe get a lucky run) to AAA

[justin_ator]

Originally Posted by FontSize72LOL

then you get to the part that makes it an FMO, it starts trilling again and on top of that, you have an 8th staircase (LOL).

While I agree the part is a tad bit difficult, I don't feel like it really warrants being an 11 again. This is really the only difficult part of the file, considering the speed (which really isn't much at all) of the trills themselves. Most of the transitions are rather simple aside from the ending.

In terms of the ending itself, it's just a matter of keeping a steady trilling rhythm while adding in jumps on the right notes. I don't really get why people analyze or hit it as staircases, it's just jumps added in with the trills...focus on the trills and make the jumps a secondary thing and it's a lot easier.

Subjectivity inc, but take it how you will

[MaxGhost]

Just played SAMBISTA and then K8107, I thought K8107 was much harder than SAMBISTA. That ending is insane. The trilly part in SAMBISTA is actually one of the easiest parts of the song I thought, because it's quite short and consistent unlike a lot of other parts in the song. I still think both should be 11s.

[qqwref]

Originally Posted by rushyrulz

It used to be an 11 and the avmiss fix didn't change any aspect of this file's difficulty. It should have remained an 11.

This, it was an 11 for a long time after avmiss fix.

Originally Posted by Evnoir

K8107 is a lot easier than Sambista (which is a 10)

I think Sambista should be an 11 too. The AAA count is really low for a 10 that's been out for several months.

[emulord]

I feel like its a 10. The patterns are simple, and its easy to PA if you use a pseudo index setup. Easier than most 10s actually. I feel its easier than every 11 with the possible exception of Novo Mundo.

Basically this song is a slightly faster and longer Teh Tricky Techno.Nowhere near 11 material