Pronunciation of CH

[SKG_Scintill]

Yes I know, I don't ever come in this subgenre and already 2 threads? Whatever :P

I've been trying to figure out why it is that in some cases the diglyph "ch" is pronounced as a "tsh", in other cases as "k" and in even other cases as "sh": "chimpansee", "chiropractor" and "chic", respectively.

At first I thought it could be the vowel after "ch", but as just was shown, that certainly isn't true. Nor the consonant after "ch[aeiou]".
On the other hand, when "ch" is followed by a consonant, so far it's always been pronounced as a "k" (chrome, chlorine, chronic, etc).

I have yet to research the etymology of the words, if the land of origin is of any cause. That is research for another time.

Does anyone happen to know or have ideas as to what causes the difference in pronunciation?

[Pseudo Enigma]

it might be another messed up thing that happened in the course of evolution for English. It might also depend on accent. I for one pronounce it kind of "tch" like.

what I mean is like how Library is no longer Li br ary, but Lie Berry or something in common tongue. Or February is Fe ber ary instead of Fe brue ary.

Certainly something interesting indeed. Let us know if you find the answer-- that is if no one posts it first.

[Izzy]

I'm going to guess the origin of words coming from a lot of different places that ended up being conflicting.

[ilikexd]

Language of origin means everything in this case.

I don't know what you mean by 'ch' vs. 'tsh' in the words 'chimpanzee' and 'chirping'. Both 'ch' clusters are pronounced identically.

'Chic' gets an 'sh' pronunciation because the language of origin is French. It is theorized to be related to the German word 'Schick' "tact", "skill", with the original meaning of 'chic' being " "subtlety". Other words like this are 'charlatan' and 'champagne'.

Words with 'ch' when it has a normal "ch" pronunciation generally come from Romance languages other than French. However, some words attested to very early French can have a 'ch' pronunciation rather than 'sh': 'challenger' from 'chalengeour'. These words still do come from other sources: 'chin' from Germanic 'cin'.

[SKG_Scintill]

Sorry, I guess my mind went a bit double on that, changed "chirping" to "chiropractor" :P

Edit: rethinking the "ch" being a "k" sound, it does seem like they're all greek words

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by SKG_Scintill

Sorry, I guess my mind went a bit double on that, changed "chirping" to "chiropractor" :P

Edit: rethinking the "ch" being a "k" sound, it does seem like they're all greek words

yes

you can just look here for any specific word: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php

[SKG_Scintill]

As discussed in prochat, "ache" is an exception to that rule. Well... not really... just haven't found another word with Proto-Germanic origin to confirm it

[UserNameGoesHere]

Originally Posted by Pseudo Enigma

it might be another messed up thing that happened in the course of evolution for English. It might also depend on accent. I for one pronounce it kind of "tch" like.

what I mean is like how Library is no longer Li br ary, but Lie Berry or something in common tongue. Or February is Fe ber ary instead of Fe brue ary.

Certainly something interesting indeed. Let us know if you find the answer-- that is if no one posts it first.

Where are you located that words are pronounced this way? If you pronounce "library" like "lie berry" you're just going to sound like Homer Simpson. (Seriously, he did exactly this on one episode of The Simpsons - it was the crayon in the brain episode)

And I and everyone I've ever heard pronounce February "Febuary" and never "Feberary". The first R is merely silent.

[justin_ator]

Winsday

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by UserNameGoesHere

Where are you located that words are pronounced this way? If you pronounce "library" like "lie berry" you're just going to sound like Homer Simpson. (Seriously, he did exactly this on one episode of The Simpsons - it was the crayon in the brain episode)

And I and everyone I've ever heard pronounce February "Febuary" and never "Feberary". The first R is merely silent.

I take the effort to pronounce it as it's spelled. The first 'r' isn't at all silent, and pronouncing it as such is an alternate pronunciation that is sometimes called incorrect but by now has become somewhat acceptable.

I do agree that dropping the first 'r' of 'library' sounds terrible. I hear children do it sometimes, but that's it.

[justin_ator]

I used to say peppermoni as a kid

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by justin_ator

I used to say peppermoni as a kid

epenthesis

[justin_ator]

pasghetti

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by justin_ator

pasghetti

metathesis

:P that one is very funny

[justin_ator]

axe you a question?

or how about write a shedewul

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by justin_ator

axe you a question?

or how about write a shedewul

that's assimilation

what's a shedweul?

[reuben_tate]

I think the pronunciation of library as lie berry is common enough that it just seems like a douche move to correct somebody on it. :/ I'm guessing why some people don't use the correct pronunciation is because some people find it difficult to pronounce the "brar" part. Going from the br sound to the r is slightly awkward and I actually feel like my mouth went through an obstacle course just to pronounce it correctly.

Also, just saying, it seems like homogeneous is said two ways, mostly depending on what subject it's used in, lol.

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by reuben_tate

I think the pronunciation of library as lie berry is common enough that it just seems like a douche move to correct somebody on it. :/ I'm guessing why some people don't use the correct pronunciation is because some people find it difficult to pronounce the "brar" part. Going from the br sound to the r is slightly awkward and I actually feel like my mouth went through an obstacle course just to pronounce it correctly.

Also, just saying, it seems like homogeneous is said two ways, mostly depending on what subject it's used in, lol.

I feel like the mispronunciation of 'February' as "Febuary" is much more admissible, especially since it's analogous with 'January'.

I just tend hear 'library' only mispronounced by small children, and the irony of mispronouncing that world also bugs me.

[runescapedude1126]

bananer

[ilikexd]

Originally Posted by runescapedude1126

bananer

intrusive 'r'

thread is derailed