TWG CLXIII: Allies and Adversaries 2 - GAME THREAD

[Vendetta21]

did you casually ignore a lot of sunfan posts like me and also focus in on the same two posts?

[Vendetta21]

this is your read, it shouldn't just be piggybacking off me you should be able to articulate it or you could also just say "i am easily influenced by V and when he says something i weigh it more highly" or something

[Vendetta21]

and like you're sticking to this read i made and we mindmelded on after i backed off so like you must have something more to say about hjis preparation you saw

[meno_rocks123]

Originally Posted by Vendetta21

shadowwolfe has slowed down compared to last game and so has mike but i consider a lot of momentum from last game dependent on litodude blowing up so early and giving day 1 a lot of clear shit to talk about, but the slowdown is worth noting -- a measured conservative pace is the obvious wolf strategy this game, so scumlean

Accurate. I don't do so well without at least some amount of info, and we're currently doing the equivalent of the english lit circlejerk of what the colour of the curtains says about the owner of the house until we somehow pull a lynch out of our collective ass. D1 with literally no information other than a successful guard is useless for VT or anyone claiming to be so.

[Vendetta21]

Originally Posted by meno_rocks123

Accurate. I don't do so well without at least some amount of info, and we're currently doing the equivalent of the english lit circlejerk of what the colour of the curtains says about the owner of the house until we somehow pull a lynch out of our collective ass. D1 with literally no information other than a successful guard is useless for VT or anyone claiming to be so.

making something happen is what you do on day 1, don't be afraid skim until you find a lead, anything. it's not actually a slow measured battle but a game of "gotcha!" where you are trying to find one needle in a very large haystack

[ShadoWolfe]

Back. Figured I should probably get the presentation done first, considering it has grevious IRL consequences.

It's done now, so I'ma do what I said and read Xiz and V (and meno and inD), who both seem to have caused some mayhem in my absence.

If I went to sleep now, I'd have 5 hours of rest before needing to wake up.. Shit, well now my curiosity is piqued so I probably wouldn't be able to sleep anyways, might as well figure some shit out.
What are the chances both V and Xiz are wolves? in FE, V organized an inactive scumteam. Now, both Xiz and V show up at the same time after both being absent? #tiredthoughts
I doubt it. To believe that, I'd have to believe that Xiz is lying about being busy, which is something I generally refuse to do in TWG (I believe IRL excuses because shit happens, and lying about em is a good way to have people never believe you again).
aanyways, gonna catch up and share some thoughts in a moment, brb reading

[meno_rocks123]

Seriously, this whole phase can be summed up with this dramatic re-enactment:

"Sir, you said the word human in your post you must not be that which you have claimed to be"

"Nuh uh, I'm a real boy"

"Well I still don't trust you"

"Well they're not acting anywhere out of the ordinary"

"Look at me, I am a fellow human"

"Wow, looks like we're all humans! Well, except for that guy"

"I don't like that you think that that guy isn't a human, so you must not be a human"

"You defended that guy who might or might not be a human, so I'm going to tie your fate to theirs in my mind"

"Holy shit, that guy hasn't really posted much yet. That must mean they're a weirdo non-human scumlord"

"Hey guys, what's up?"

"You shit, I'll lynch you right now"

"I don't think that you're a good person to be talking like that"

"Maybe we shouldn't lynch that dude"

"What do you think, person who hasn't formed a full categorized list of opinions yet?"

"Oh, I think that this is exactly how the game is because I have a lot of information in the subject"

"Wow, that person has clearly invested at least 15 minutes into this game. Townlean on them"

"Thanks for believing in me, friend"

"Well, I don't believe in them"

"Well, you have a right to your own opinion"

"It's weird that you would say that they have a right to their own opinion. That seems off to me. I think you might be a wolf"

"Oh shit, whaddup. Check out how this person is totally a wolf and not a human!"

"Well, you're wrong"

"Prove me wrong"

"Here's reasonable doubt"

"Well now I don't know what to think"

"Let's just all stick to our original assumptions and agree that we've made no progress whatsoever and nothing of value will come unless someone makes a grand fuckup"

"Finally something we can agree on"

"No, I don't agree with that"

"Me too"

"Wait, do you agree or disagree? You didn't make that clear"

"I'm not going to respond to you for the next 24 hours"

"I'm going to go play video games. See you guys tomorrow maybe"

"I like giving opinions"

"Check out this super analysis I made and how it clearly shows that my beliefs are correct and yours are wrong"

"Wow, that's insightful"

"Both of you are clearly wolves working together"

[meno_rocks123]

I could spew this shit all night. Feel free to fill in character names at random and still have it make sense.

[Vendetta21]

there's a difference between poker banter that is just obvious poker banter and poker banter where someone makes a mistake and reveals something they shouldnt have -- this is the draw of poker

[Vendetta21]

you've invested a lot of energy into it already, why not invest that energy into winning instead of defending nothing...

[ShadoWolfe]

Originally Posted by Xiz

I dont really anymore, it's more that I miss it
he's not on my radar. I think I initially had a read on him but forgot it.
No, I dont see raeko activity = wolf
reads of her activity? I don't understand. Her reads are weak, but they are passable?

Also sunfan moved from null not wanting to lynch to wolf status.

I would never be that obvious about if I was a vigi sunfan, town sunfan would know that. I'm now fine with him dying.

Hey Xiz.. as unsure as I am about sunfan, he never said he thought you were vigi.
He asked you what you're shooting tomorrow, not who..
You know, referring to this:

Originally Posted by Xiz

I have to wake up for a shoot over in hollywood tomorrow at like 6am so I really don't wanna be up long.

Why did that shoot slip your mind so easily?

[ShadoWolfe]

Originally Posted by meno_rocks123

dramatic re-enactment

Literally the funniest shit ever and you made my tired night a whole lot better.

"You shit, I'll lynch you right now!" hahahaha

[Vendetta21]

honestly i'm zeroing in on xiz right now because i think he made a mistake, and in my head i have a plausible narrative for that. xiz said he mindmelded with me, if you've played TWG with me when i'm human you know that i am extremely convincing and i will continue applying pressure.

here i was skimming the thread and just throwing initial impressions out, i didn't read the thread thoroughly. i voted sunfan based off a couple posts because they triggrered my day 1 "wolves like to do this" radar for neutrality, i thought sunfan was being excessively neutral but i also have sigs and avatars disabled and 500 posts is a lot to sift through. xiz, having been wolfing me last game and having a successful day 1 off of it when we killed mike, might have seen that and gone, "yeah, v is focusing a human, let me empower him"

except i was actually completely wrong in my evaluation because i remembered a few post during my skim and not all of the sunfans posts, but he told me he mindmelded with me on something that is wrong, and i see the ostensible reason as empowering me to keep going. i re-read the posts and realized my read of sunfan was completely unjustified.

so i asked the question, "why did xiz come to the same conclusions i did when he was reading and posting more than me? my conclusions were bullshit" i assumed it was because he remembered last game where i very easily killed mike just by isolating him and grilling him on day 1, but am still not sure.

he doubled down on the reads and is posturing as though they are his own, so i want to know what he saw that caused him to mindmeld with me about a post that i think wasn't accurate to reality. i want him to post specific examples to justify his thinking because it currently seems like its parroting mine from when i was being rushed and lazy, which i am willing to accept, but my spidey senses are tingling here because it's weird for someone else to focus on the same two posts that ignored a bunch of others...

[ShadoWolfe]

Originally Posted by Vendetta21

thesunfan

way too much trepidation and too much of "i think X but i could be wrong" -- tone like this signals he is trying to control as much damage as possible on day 1, worried about being wrong this early is weird because he supposedly doesn't know anything so why does he have to preface everything he does with that uncertainty? clearly is thinking more about how things will shake out later

Originally Posted by Vendetta21

i'm just getting invested by posting opinions right now, i've been away all day i will focus on specifics in a minute but i'm glad you have justifications in yuor head for everything you've said so far

Originally Posted by Vendetta21

ive misread xelnya multiple times before and my gut says wolf but my head says neutral, wait it out. jsut got back from the store im going to post the specific things bothering me about sunfan now

Originally Posted by Vendetta21

k here's first two posts ill expound after i finish going through and finding the ones that concerned me and then i'll talk about his other posts, afaict i can only do this once per page (80 posts) so it will be a few posts

Originally Posted by Vendetta21

oh wow nevermind that was it in terms of trepidation about wolves.. i must have read too much into those few posts during the read through, the first post there was the big one that caught me and i thought i saw more. his read on xel seems consistent so nevermind

i think i was triggered by how easily he was handing out townreads earlier and how skeptical he seemed about wolves but actually i can see his line of thought aftering isolating him

This progression seems natural. I'm townleaning him for it, but will note that he could be seeming genuine even as a wolf who thought he saw something worth lynching sunfan over, realized it wasn't gonna work, and retracted.

The fact that his vote is still on sunfan is weird though. Hey V, why're you still on Greg after taking back your scumlean and saying that you're leaning Xiz scummier as an outcome?

[Vendetta21]

because i haven't been thinking about my vote since i placed it and have been more focused on articulating my thoughts and reading, but obviously xiz

[Vendetta21]

okay i have to wash the dishes and clean the kitchen before i do anything else i will be back in 30. mike i seriously encourage you to consider the philosophy of needle-in-a-haystack and re-read the thread

[ShadoWolfe]

I really don't like Xiz aorn. His progression on sunfan seemed really opportunistic. He goes from saying sunfan is null (but that he doesn't want him dead today), to wanting him lynched asap really really quickly.

Originally Posted by Xiz

In other news, sunfan is no longer town to me, hes null. Mostly from lack of mindmeld and I dislike his evolution of reads. I probably will want him dead but I rather not have him dead today.

Originally Posted by Xiz

I don't like a lot of what people have done this game.

- Sunfan could be a wolf, but I just said why. I still doubt it, and rather deal with him later then a dead sunfan d1.
[shrug]

To seeing an opportunity when Vendetta came in out of nowhere with a vote on sunfan:

Originally Posted by Xiz

shit we mindmelded

Originally Posted by Xiz

greg im only here for like another 20 if you wanna talk now is the time

Originally Posted by thesunfan

shit, thought you were gone

why do you care about mindmelding with me
why do you think you forgot about jrodd
do you think that raeko is too active to be a wolf
what do you think about the reads on her activity

also what are you shooting tomorrow

To escalating all the way to a "let's lynch him today", for something that wasn't even said. It reads to me like Xiz got a little excited when he saw Vendetta's vote, and that translated to being trigger-happy over perceptions made too quickly:

Originally Posted by Xiz

Also sunfan moved from null not wanting to lynch to wolf status.

I would never be that obvious about if I was a vigi sunfan, town sunfan would know that. I'm now fine with him dying.

Considering that "what are you shooting tomorrow" should obviously refer to the filming that Xiz mentioned was being done, and that Xiz would have no reason to escalate that quickly over something that small unless he really wanted sunfan dead and saw an opportunity in V's vote.

[ShadoWolfe]

Originally Posted by Vendetta21

honestly i'm zeroing in on xiz right now because i think he made a mistake, and in my head i have a plausible narrative for that. xiz said he mindmelded with me, if you've played TWG with me when i'm human you know that i am extremely convincing and i will continue applying pressure.

here i was skimming the thread and just throwing initial impressions out, i didn't read the thread thoroughly. i voted sunfan based off a couple posts because they triggrered my day 1 "wolves like to do this" radar for neutrality, i thought sunfan was being excessively neutral but i also have sigs and avatars disabled and 500 posts is a lot to sift through. xiz, having been wolfing me last game and having a successful day 1 off of it when we killed mike, might have seen that and gone, "yeah, v is focusing a human, let me empower him"

except i was actually completely wrong in my evaluation because i remembered a few post during my skim and not all of the sunfans posts, but he told me he mindmelded with me on something that is wrong, and i see the ostensible reason as empowering me to keep going. i re-read the posts and realized my read of sunfan was completely unjustified.

so i asked the question, "why did xiz come to the same conclusions i did when he was reading and posting more than me? my conclusions were bullshit" i assumed it was because he remembered last game where i very easily killed mike just by isolating him and grilling him on day 1, but am still not sure.

he doubled down on the reads and is posturing as though they are his own, so i want to know what he saw that caused him to mindmeld with me about a post that i think wasn't accurate to reality. i want him to post specific examples to justify his thinking because it currently seems like its parroting mine from when i was being rushed and lazy, which i am willing to accept, but my spidey senses are tingling here because it's weird for someone else to focus on the same two posts that ignored a bunch of others...

Ninja'd from before my last post :O
Yeah I'm liking V here for his natural progression on voting sunfan and for our mindmeld on Xiz

[ShadoWolfe]

Also, @Tokzic, VC please?

[ShadoWolfe]

@inD what's going on with you?
I'd expect much more analytical posts from you by this time. A quick ISO of you shows a lot of jokes and half-jokes, and some content. It seems really shallow, though, and you don't seem invested in the game at all. Is something the matter, or are you just wolfing it?