06-21-2016, 12:53 AM | #61 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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measuring anger is hilarious to propose, something like half of this website maxes out psych instruments for anger measurement past violence would prevent people in poverty from getting guns to protect themselves since so many of them are violent in childhood out of necessity |
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06-21-2016, 01:00 AM | #62 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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and I mentioned that looking deeply into the past probably wouldn't be fruitful, but a recent survey of violence would still be useful if people are still in a scenario where they are violent and in poverty then giving them guns still isn't a good idea |
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06-21-2016, 01:04 AM | #63 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
even in security clearances, if you get concerning results for some of the evaluations, a lot of times they'll require training and work with you
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06-21-2016, 01:04 AM | #64 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
security clearances do that because security clearances check everything under the sun just because, not because it's effective at actually preventing security violations
like, when you're the government, you can afford being somewhat picky about who you give this clearance to with 300m guns in circulation, denying people for some anger metric just isn't gonna work Quote:
not having guns in a shit neighborhood is like painting a gigantic "rob me" sign above your house |
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06-21-2016, 01:14 AM | #65 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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2) at the very least what about restrictions, or even training, I don't know clearly the system is fucked and needs amendments 3) then we should let everyone get guns? I'm not abjectly disagreeing with you that they need guns for safety but the end result is pretty much that "violence and crime is inevitable so give everybody guns" I doubt that game theory / mutual deterrence works in a lot of these kinds of fast-paced, micro-scaled scenarios, because irrationality kicks in (especially in lower-income areas) |
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06-21-2016, 01:15 AM | #66 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
you don't need to adopt the full security clearance routine (querying friends/family) in order to apply some of their interview methods at least
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06-21-2016, 02:13 AM | #67 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
I watched the video
1) He compared feminism to Islam, and lol 2) I must have missed the part where he talked about concealed carry, was it a small snippet? Just saw him say it was a proactive measure I ask because it seems that most criminologists seem to believe that concealed carry has minimal effects in either direction on gun violence, and most of the support of concealed carry has been debunked in more recent years
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Last edited by DaBackpack; 06-21-2016 at 02:24 AM.. |
06-21-2016, 02:40 AM | #68 | ||
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
security clearance requires your drug test to be spotless.
this is obviously not pertinent to gun ownership. Quote:
plus, it itself fails as sniff test: police themselves are open carry citizens with beefed up resources Quote:
switzerland that shit |
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06-21-2016, 02:49 AM | #69 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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both in frequency and in citations, publications with the "little correlation" conclusion are more than those with the "concealed carry and gun violence are correlated" hypothesis And most research with the "correlative" conclusion had been refuted in more recent works my survey was less than systematic which is why I asked if there were any breaking studies or w/e I'm not going to compile a literature review on the topic but I actually wanted to see if rigorous investigation supported these claims, at least through a cursory look through the literature EDIT: After such a statement I should probably substantiate those claims at least a little, but I'm tired and am not gonna do it unless people will actually read it I do encourage people interested to conduct similar searches through academic journals instead of public news outlets
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Last edited by DaBackpack; 06-21-2016 at 03:04 AM.. |
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06-21-2016, 03:02 AM | #70 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
a lot of affirmative studies have limited scope, e.g. "we have established a negative correlation between concealed carry and gun violence in the city of Chicago" but that's not a strong enough statement to affect policy
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Last edited by DaBackpack; 06-21-2016 at 03:03 AM.. |
06-21-2016, 07:14 AM | #71 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
frankly, there are far too many variables where a lit review of concealed carry correlations will allow you to make any conclusions.
one enormous factor is the culture itself surrounding concealed carry. if, for example, guns are normal and everyday people believe it is honorable and valorous to defend others in an incident of concealed carry, then concealed carry will be effective. on the other hand, if concealed carry is viewed as some weird gun-nut shit, then far less people will be tempted to reveal their weapons in a time of need. it would destroy most benefit to concealed carry. I'm not making this up btw: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultur...United_States) this alone is sufficient to make correlations not that immediately useful for determining what is effective or what isn't. in summation: Last edited by Arch0wl; 06-21-2016 at 07:14 AM.. |
06-21-2016, 07:42 AM | #72 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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(I have no idea if these links work for ppl outside my school but so I'll cite them) 1) No correlation found between ppl voting for concealed carry and them actually carrying themselves (Concealed Carry in the Show-Me State: Do Voters in Favor of Right-to-Carry Legislation End Up Packing Heat? - Linda S. Ghent1 and Alan P. Grant, 2014) 2) A few researchers have formally posited that concealed carry working is reliant on public trust in guns (surprise), and went on to perform national surveys to gather information on such trust: results indicate that in general, that trust does not exist (I am too tired to find this one sorry) anyway that's all I have to say on the matter |
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06-21-2016, 09:34 AM | #73 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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06-21-2016, 11:30 AM | #74 | ||
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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Seriously, Arch. If you're trying to debate this issue like an educated adult you need to be a little less savage and let your facts do your talking. -- Quote:
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06-21-2016, 11:38 AM | #75 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
Well he had a good point there
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06-21-2016, 11:55 AM | #76 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
Quote:
http://crimeresearch.org/wp-content/...nter-Final.pdf
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Last edited by adlp; 06-21-2016 at 11:56 AM.. |
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06-21-2016, 12:27 PM | #77 | |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
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They have a strong pro-gun bias and their founder is one of the main researchers who advocated for concealed carry in the 90's his research has since been disproved repeatedly I trust the findings I found before because they came from several different journals so, I'm skeptical |
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06-21-2016, 12:28 PM | #78 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
I might take a look later and find out how they are getting the results they claim though
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06-21-2016, 12:42 PM | #79 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
I have not made an ad hominem attack, much less multiple
your post is a civility norm proposal, not a true/false criticism. if you mean ad hominem like how I think you mean, refer to: http://laurencetennant.com/bonds/adhominem.html Last edited by Arch0wl; 06-21-2016 at 12:43 PM.. |
06-21-2016, 01:54 PM | #80 |
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Re: Milo's post-Orlando speech, 100% worth watching
Is this why he was banned? Can u really call that flaming? Feels a bit off if ya ask me
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