[Concluded] 11th Official Tournament - Round 8

[Walrusizer]

just remove divisions so winning the tournament is actually skill based rather than being at the high end of your division based

[AragakiAyase]

Originally Posted by ll sephirothll

stop fighting. the game is shit and dead and i dont understand why you guys even made another official lol

that's rich coming after this

Originally Posted by ll sephirothll

i just hope in the next official tournament they can make appropriate songs for appropriate divisions. the D4 round 1 song is like D5/ end round tourny song.

[Cold Kitten]

Originally Posted by Killionz

D1: 10-25
D2: 26-35
D3: 36-45
D4: 46-55
D5: 56-65
D6: 66-75
D7: 76-85
D8: 85+

you're funny

[MikeShinoda12345]

I want to be more careful of what I say because I feel like I'm on the upper end of my division and therefore have an inherent bias in favor of this tournament's structure, but I really like the idea of beginning the tournament at higher levels of difficulty and feel like much of the complaining is simply due to this being unexpected given previous tournaments

To perform well on a difficult song drives improvement AND is more fun than whoring a song repeatedly to shave a couple goods off your SDG. AAA-or-die cutoffs are less indicative of skill, I feel, and I'm really happy to see things moving in this direction and understand that the FFR staff have needed to intentionally request a lot of high-difficulty files from stepfilers in order to make this tournament play out this way

edit: yeah this is in response specifically to the song thing and not the larger debate about divisions

[blanky!]

Oook so since my earlier post didn't garner any responses...

Originally Posted by Killionz

I'm not saying that you have to divvy up the tournament in to A & B for each division (however, it would almost have to be set up that way to be fair), but the reality is, there is a LOW D6, a mid-range D6, and a high-range D6 (those that will AAA [ and I'm sure the round will end with at LEAST 20-30 more people AAA'ing that file]). That is an issue, and I feel as though it will turn a lot of people off, after being knocked out in round 1. There is a great amount of set up & organizing that needs to be done for tournaments in general, but you should have the resources and team available to do so, and this seems like there were a minuscule amount helping out, and it was rushed. It doesn't have to be a project that becomes so "grueling" that it never happens at all. However, if it is not set up properly, and the majority of people that entered are pissed off enough over certain things, it probably shouldn't have happened, period.

This is tricky, and the solution to this would be extraordinarily variable, but after talking to a few people, and looking over some things, it would almost be better off divided up like this:
D1: 10-25
D2: 26-35
D3: 36-45
D4: 46-55
D5: 56-65
D6: 66-75
D7: 76-85
D8: 85+

This would allow for less of a "gap" to be formed in D6, and still hold as challenging for each player, in each division. There's other prospects to that argument, but I'll just refer to the latter for now. I'm not even trying to argue with anyone here. I appreciate the work that each and every organizer & staff member put in to this tournament, and am very appreciative that I could be a part of it, but some changes need to be made in order to keep everyone in line, and happy with what they can ACTUALLY ("cough" d2/d4 "cough") do.

This is an issue that can be avoided easily, as you already stated. If someone is TRULY sandbagging, why even keep them as part of the community. I don't understand... A tournament is a big thing for a community, and if someone wants to be that UNFAIR about it, kick their ass... don't allow them to come back. You won't make EVERYONE happy, but you can at least try your hardest. Bumping them up a division is not going to solve anything, I assure you. As far as people being bumped up involuntarily, or perhaps, NOT per their request, that's actually lame, especially if it happens during the tournament. If you can't determine someone's skill level prior to the tournament, and feel the need to bump them up AFTER a couple rounds, that's absolutely unfair to them, and absolutely a mistake. Something like that should not happen at all, ever.

Welcome to the insanity that we call FFR.

[Killionz]

Originally Posted by Walrusizer

just remove divisions so winning the tournament is actually skill based rather than being at the high end of your division based

Mmm, spicy, but methinks you're hinting at FFR vs. Osumania, which is what I was trying to avoid, and will continue to avoid, because it bears no relevance.
This is a completely different game format, as such per the tournaments.

[AragakiAyase]

Originally Posted by Killionz

long post

as has been said earlier, where do you draw the line? There's always going to be a skill gap between divisions unless there's literally a division for each player. how big the gap seems to be is relative to the tournament structure, i.e. D5/D6 may seem bigger compared to say D3

[One Winged Angel]

I mean the solution to every 'problem' in this thread is pretty obvious..

How many people entered this tournament and why isn't it equal to the number of divisions we have?

You're welcome tournament staff

[Killionz]

Originally Posted by Cold Kitten

you're funny

Because I made a suggestion? I don't expect anyone to listen to me, care, or really hear me out, but I'm getting my voice out there about all of this. I think that this is a very intelligent debate, with good suggestions, and I love debating with people on this. However, you, have added nothing intelligent to this. So if you'd like to hop in on this and discuss how you feel, go right ahead. If you're going to chip in two words, that have no relevance to what I said, I could really care less about what you have to say.

However, everyone has an opinion, as do I, so thank you for hopping in.

[Killionz]

Originally Posted by AragakiAyase

as has been said earlier, where do you draw the line? There's always going to be a skill gap between divisions unless there's literally a division for each player. how big the gap seems to be is relative to the tournament structure, i.e. D5/D6 may seem bigger compared to say D3

There we go, this is what I ACTUALLY wanted to see.

[hi19hi19]

Originally Posted by Killionz

This is tricky, and the solution to this would be extraordinarily variable, but after talking to a few people, and looking over some things, it would almost be better off divided up like this:
D1: 10-25
D2: 26-35
D3: 36-45
D4: 46-55
D5: 56-65
D6: 66-75
D7: 76-85
D8: 85+

Ironically, I feel this is a far worse solution. There are SO many more people playing in the 56-75 range than in the novice divisions. It's pretty easy to improve in the D1/D2 skill level, but improving once you hit FMOs is a lot slower.
Under this system, D5 and D6 would be even bigger than they are now, I'd reckon, meaning extra work for the additional division, and the end result is worse.

Also I think this is where they "you're funny" comment comes from. Because this has been suggested every tournament, and it really doesn't work.
If there were to be an extra division, you'd have to squash it in between the current bottom of D7 and current mid-D6, and move current D6 and D5 down a bit, I think. It definitely wouldn't be a nice clean "every 10 difficulties" split like you have.

[Deidara837]

Divisions are arbitrary by nature though
That's why this issue can't be fixed by agreeing upon X number of divisions or where the cutoffs should be

So only a drastic format overhaul would get to the root of the problem

But at the moment, this method provides a framework for a standard elimination tournament, and a completely different format might not even be an improvement, just different thing with its own problems

[hi19hi19]

The fairest way to do this is just have one division, and if you're not good at the game (i.e. high D7) then goodbye. This is the o!m system, basically.
The current division system was put in place to give novices a chance to participate, and ironically leads to players in the novice divisions complaining about it every tournament.

Whoo FFR!

EDIT- I should really finish my project with AJ asdfjk;asdf but I'm lazy

[psychoangel691]

Originally Posted by hi19hi19

meaning extra work for the additional division, and the end result is worse.

I just want to note that I really don't have any issues with doing extra work for the tournaments, I really enjoy putting this all together. The issue is adding another division isn't going to solve the problem and imo there has to be a line drawn in adding divisions. I know how much it sucks being at the bottom, I've been bottom D5 forever but if I want to win I'm going to fight for it because I'd love to be better at this game.

I guess I can't understand this mentality here on FFR where a lot of people seem like they don't want to push themselves to improve. Yes this tournament is hard, and it's going to push a lot of people to their limits. I bet you we're also going to see a lot of people who boost up and improve a lot during this.

[Cold Kitten]

Originally Posted by Killionz

Because I made a suggestion? I don't expect anyone to listen to me, care, or really hear me out, but I'm getting my voice out there about all of this. I think that this is a very intelligent debate, with good suggestions, and I love debating with people on this. However, you, have added nothing intelligent to this. So if you'd like to hop in on this and discuss how you feel, go right ahead. If you're going to chip in two words, that have no relevance to what I said, I could really care less about what you have to say.

However, everyone has an opinion, as do I, so thank you for hopping in.

you complained about a AAA fest in d6. these difficulties would, for the most part certainly be followed by AAA fest.

[Walrusizer]

ewwww effort how dare you force people to actually try how dare you

[Killionz]

Originally Posted by ll sephirothll

stop fighting. the game is shit and dead and i dont understand why you guys even made another official lol

Hey, no more trolling man, that's not intellectual discussion.

What did you have for dinner? I had some bomb-ass Sloppy J's & pork beans.

I'm out for now -

[Killionz]

Originally Posted by Walrusizer

ewwww effort how dare you force people to actually try how dare you

How about for each division, an excite bike marathon is implemented, and each round, the marathon increases by an hour.

[Walrusizer]

Originally Posted by Killionz

How about for each division, an excite bike marathon is implemented, and each round, the marathon increases by an hour.

yes

[Kanzas]

Originally Posted by Killionz

How about for each division, an excite bike marathon is implemented, and each round, the marathon increases by an hour.

You'd have to play like, what, 370~ times per hour?
That's absurd


Do it


Edit: Got a new USB Logitech k120 kb, so let's see how this works out!