Rates higher than 1.0 should record

[choof]

y/n

yes I'm starting this thread again

[yo man im awesome]

yes

[SK8R43]

yes, not like they are getting easier by being on 1.1, 1.5, 2.0, etc lol

[BeatMania Rotate Mod]

Agree

[omega_grunt666]

I would agree, but it gives people on R^3 and advantage because none of the other engines can support rates. Some people can't use it due to compatibility issues.

No (Even though personally, I would like them to very much)

[SK8R43]

Originally Posted by omega_grunt666

I would agree, but it gives people on R^3 and advantage because none of the other engines can support rates. Some people can't use it because of compatibility issues.

No (Even though personally, I would like them to very much)

doesnt really make sense, this only affects people who DO use them. Not like people who cant are missing out on anything, right?

[choof]

Originally Posted by omega_grunt666

I would agree, but it gives people on R^3 and advantage because none of the other engines can support rates. Some people can't use it due to compatibility issues.

No (Even though personally, I would like them to very much)

it would be an advantage if rates under 1.0 were recorded

[omega_grunt666]

Grand total farming, pattern cheating, etc.

[SK8R43]

Yeah its not really an advantage since in theory it makes the songs harder. I dont ever really use the R3 engine, but if rates recorded i probably would use it for them to practice instead of FFRMANIA. lol

[omega_grunt666]

There are situations where something like 3434/1234 could be hit with jump trills perfectly where you would normally have to tap it out. Yes a majority of patterns become much harder, but some can become easier and even though the overall difficulty of the song gets higher, the required skills to perfect the song change. So essentially its an uneven playing field, you're comparing two different difficulty songs for scores.

Its not that I don't want them to record, I would love to get credits/GTS while still being able to train speed. But it would be unfair to everyone who doesn't use this engine. It would be nice to have 3 scoreboards, Raw, Combo, Rates after the site change. I think that could make it work.

[choof]

Originally Posted by omega_grunt666

Grand total farming, pattern cheating, etc.

the nice thing about rates is that patterns stay the same

as for grand total farming, that's a valid reason but... I don't think grand total has ever mattered to anyone, outside of dendrite v2 and I think vROFL

Originally Posted by omega_grunt666

Yes a majority of patterns become much harder, but some can become easier and even though the overall difficulty of the song gets higher, the required skills to perfect the song change.

this would happen to such a small amount of songs that it'd be fairly irrelevant

[SK8R43]

Yes some become alot easier, BUT also the rest of the patterns in the song will become harder, its not like every pattern will become easier in the song so it makes it an easy aaa. :P

I mean rates make the song faster, the patterns become squished, harder to read/hit, so making a few easier is cancelled out by making the rest harder lol

[Untimely Friction]

No credits no GTS, and then yes I agree

[SK8R43]

Originally Posted by Untimely Friction

No credits no GTS, and then yes I agree

Sounds fair lets do diss

[choof]

Originally Posted by Untimely Friction

No credits no GTS, and then yes I agree

how about something like this:

the credits/score you earn for songs is divided by the rate; anything under 1.0 rate gets no credits and no score

[qqwref]

Voting no. The songs are all *meant* to be played normally, so if playing them on rate gives you any kind of advantage it should thus be forbidden - and if it doesn't give you an advantage I don't know why you'd want it. It's different than something like mirror or different noteskins because the file fundamentally changes, and because nobody in Stepmania would consider a ratemodded score to be equivalent to a non-rate score. Honestly, if you can't get a score on normal rate, then you just don't deserve to have that particular score in your levelranks. And if you don't want to play through all the files, you don't deserve the low levelrank that everyone else had to get by actually playing through the files.

I do think it'd be nice if songs on rates gave credits, though, just so you can get something for your work. For grandtotal I'd say it should either not record, or it should be divided by song rate, to prevent rates making it easier to whore for vrofl. So yeah, basically what choof said in the previous post, although I don't see any necessity to divide credits (they don't really matter).

[Untimely Friction]

For about a year now I played 65-78 only, now Im doing 75-88 only, if I go on like this then go back and rate 65-74's I'd get a higher score then I presently have on them or maybe AAA's, but quite frankly I wouldnt care to play them off rate so I might be irate when I can't have those scores recorded.

[choof]

Originally Posted by qqwref

Voting no. The songs are all *meant* to be played normally, so if playing them on rate gives you any kind of advantage it should thus be forbidden

playing on rates won't give you any advantage

and if it doesn't give you an advantage I don't know why you'd want it.

maybe because rates are fun? some files are way more fun on rates than they are on 1.0 (some favorites of mine include FN, choprite, anything with stream, etc)

It's different than something like mirror or different noteskins because the file fundamentally changes

mirror fundamentally changes a file more than rates do, imo. examples: anchors, jacks, one-handed trills

and because nobody in Stepmania would consider a ratemodded score to be equivalent to a non-rate score.

this is FFR, stepmania scoring is an entirely different thing.

Honestly, if you can't get a score on normal rate, then you just don't deserve to have that particular score in your levelranks.

wat

And if you don't want to play through all the files, you don't deserve the low levelrank that everyone else had to get by actually playing through the files.

oh okay, I see what you're getting at. you don't want people to be rewarded for challenging themselves, you want people to experience the struggle of playing through a bunch of really bad files

[ilikexd]

i don't have a strong opinion either way and both sides have valid arguments

[qqwref]

Originally Posted by choof

maybe because rates are fun? some files are way more fun on rates than they are on 1.0 (some favorites of mine include FN, choprite, anything with stream, etc)

I enjoy playing songs on rates too. What I don't see is why you'd want a rate score to be on the leaderboards, unless there is some advantage to being on rate. And if there is, it's unfair to the people who had to use 1.0, right?

Originally Posted by choof

mirror fundamentally changes a file more than rates do, imo. examples: anchors, jacks, one-handed trills

I agree mirror makes playing a file different, but as long as you use spread the patterns are still the same and at the same speed, just mirrored. Anchors are still anchors, jacks are still jacks, one-handed trills are still one-handed, just on the other hand. Playing on rate certainly makes patterns play differently, especially because of the 30 fps-ness. For instance, rolls are easier to hit at some speeds than others, and a jack may be too fast to comfortably wristjack and too slow to vibrate, but on a rate it may be a good speed for vibrating.

Originally Posted by choof

oh okay, I see what you're getting at. you don't want people to be rewarded for challenging themselves, you want people to experience the struggle of playing through a bunch of really bad files

I do want people to experience playing through old files, yes. You shouldn't be claiming you have AAAd 500 easy songs if you haven't, and if you don't want to play 500 easy songs, you don't deserve to be one of the people who has AAAd them all. Part of the accomplishment is actually putting in the necessary time, and honestly, that's kind of a theme in FFR. Even Staiain can't get more than 1550 points a note, so if he wants 30 billion grandtotal, he will have to hit just as many notes as anyone else.

And besides, the files are still bad on rates. They're just faster.